log☇︎
530 entries in 0.565s
mircea_popescu: that was the lulz of all time with systemd coupla years ago, the "selling point" of "faster boot times. for servers."
a111: Logged on 2016-10-03 18:26 mircea_popescu: if anyone is inclined to maintain forks of any linux distro (much in the manner of trb - to clean, not to "support"/utf/systemd/etc) we can prolly work something out.
mircea_popescu: if anyone is inclined to maintain forks of any linux distro (much in the manner of trb - to clean, not to "support"/utf/systemd/etc) we can prolly work something out. ☟︎
jurov: https://www.agwa.name/blog/post/how_to_crash_systemd_in_one_tweet a chuckle
trinque: the thing may very well be 10 systemd cycles in, given its age
phf: i think asdf is evil, version 3 is doing some straight up systemd shit. for those who don't know asdf 3 comes with fare's own portability layer called uiop, which in a very systemd agressive and underhanded style is superseding existing utility libraries. ☟︎
asciilifeform: cranking out systemd's, ukukus, etc.
scriba: Logged on 2016-09-07: [01:06:18] <asciilifeform> 'Really, I think it’s too late for mainstream “Linux”. It’s gone. It’s done. Geeks of the world were easily fooled by a shiny new toy and a corporate propaganda campaign to match, without considering the engineering implications. You can still use a real (systemd-free) version of Linux, or move toward the BSDs, but if you stay with the
asciilifeform: ng yourself, and they’re fooling you. Nor will systemd be the end of it – it’s just the beginning, the setup for future changes.'
asciilifeform: 'Really, I think it’s too late for mainstream “Linux”. It’s gone. It’s done. Geeks of the world were easily fooled by a shiny new toy and a corporate propaganda campaign to match, without considering the engineering implications. You can still use a real (systemd-free) version of Linux, or move toward the BSDs, but if you stay with the easy-to-use, polished distros, you’re no longer really using Linux. You’re just fooli
trinque: http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/homeland-eyes-special-declaration-to-take-charge-of-elections/article/2600592 << usg needs moar systemd!
phf: "Systemd Rolls Out Its Own Mount Tool ☶ linux systemd phoronix.com"
asciilifeform: https://github.com/systemd/systemd/issues/1961 << a thing of 'beauty' :
shinohai: When is someone finally gonna kill systemd and bury it deep.
asciilifeform: 'systemd-logind must be restarted every ~1000 SSH logins to prevent a ~25 second delay'
asciilifeform: in other noose, https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/systemd/+bug/1591411
asciilifeform: where was systemd in the '90s ?
asciilifeform: currently they have folks sawing in convergent directions, microshitians to 'linuxize', embrace, extend, e.g., the powershell derps; and poetterings to winblowiate linuxland, e.g., systemd.
phf: are they going to integrate many lulz of systemd? are they going to do more dodgy shit, with nameless anons ripping hair on chest with indignation? are they going to coexist with freedesktop community, kind of like how one huckster can always recognize another, and keep each other at respectful distance until there's an opportunity for an underhanded move
asciilifeform: (systemv init in systemd's case, flymake in flycheck's)
asciilifeform: systemd is, fundamentally, of this species: 'systemv init script is... broken!111 yes! and here is REPLACEMENT eat up'
asciilifeform: systemd gets a good thrashing regularly, but recall flycheck ?
a111: Logged on 2016-08-04 05:40 phf: i don't know the details of ken sievers, some lesser part of systemd's master wrecking plan, involving firmware devices. probably behavior is somehow mandatory in NSA injection sequence. or else guy is just another righteous prick
asciilifeform: http://btcbase.org/log/2016-08-04#1514253 << it was eaten by systemd. there is a (last i saw, working) clean fork, 'eudev'. and it looks like phf explains further down in the l0gz. ☝︎☟︎
phf: i don't know the details of ken sievers, some lesser part of systemd's master wrecking plan, involving firmware devices. probably behavior is somehow mandatory in NSA injection sequence. or else guy is just another righteous prick ☟︎
phf: ben_vulpes: i was going to link relevant mail message, but udev has been merged into systemd a while ago. gentoo has a fork, called eudev. udev also prompted one of the linus' famous rants, https://lkml.org/lkml/2012/10/3/484
phf: well, "libarchive" is already a systemd-ism
mircea_popescu: in the sense ubuntu is linux and systemd a demon
asciilifeform: ^ this was the non-systemd fork of debian, iirc.
asciilifeform: http://seclists.org/oss-sec/2016/q2/34 << lel... 'systemd-journald from systemd v213 started creating world readable journals, allowing local users to read sensitive system log entries.'
mircea_popescu: and the whole discussion re systemd above is quite germane : even "with" this so called "general purpose in the sense of we dunno what exacrtly" computer of today,
phf: you have a changing subtrate, changing interfaces. you can hot iron parts while it's at a manageable size and localized, but at some point you start dealing with systemd type situation where the tendrils are inside either the code that you use OR inside the subtrate/interfaces part (i.e. connection to outside world)
ben_vulpes: i thought systemd was modeled after windows
mircea_popescu: so basically windows is turning into yet-another-systemd ?
asciilifeform: 'The inaugural release of UbuntuBSD is now available, which the developers have codenamed "Escape From SystemD", and pairs the Ubuntu userspace with the FreeBSD kernel. ' << l0l!
phf: very little thinking is going on, most of so called thinking is integration and regurgitation of past thinking, that trickles from occasional pockets where thinking happened. by the time one integrates that thinking one is disinclined to further think (for one is a ph.d. or whatever at that point). but any question can be grothendieck-ed if you're so inclined, to reveal and remove your systemd's and kdbus's
asciilifeform: when i tried the arch, systemd would hose the box ~weekly
asciilifeform: danielpbarron: ick systemd
mircea_popescu: i still don't get this. all this derpage from the early days of systemd "it makes servers boot faster"
asciilifeform: if it is not clear, i am speaking not simply of systemd removal, but dbus et al.
asciilifeform: the systemd of emacs.
phf: doesn't have freedesktop/systemd/...
adlai: untrained gardner could also build systemd
asciilifeform: though the systemd folks are working day and night, for this.
BingoBoingo: I think I'm going to stop reading the "Phenomenology of Spirit". I didn't get sober to import the mental version of systemd.
mircea_popescu: this is in fact how it works : we, aim to V the original lispworld. scum - aims to systemd wikipedia.
mircea_popescu: he's 2nd generation scum, aims to systemd the original scum.
assbot: Mount efivarfs read-only · Issue #2402 · systemd/systemd · GitHub ... ( http://bit.ly/1TsPAVX )
punkman: https://github.com/systemd/systemd/issues/2402 l0l
BingoBoingo: lol, the Tor 'Tails' distro switched to systemd now
jurov: http://www.ethereumpyramid.com/ forget systemd. prb must support this!
mircea_popescu: and so what, we're officially targetting "anything that's unix post bsd pre systemd" ?
ascii_butugychag: would have happily carried on not knowing about systemd also, if had not..... etc
shinohai: systemd is a turd fr though
thestringpuller: pretty sure pankakke bailed on #b-a cause of systemd shit-talking
thestringpuller: jessie uses systemd by default iirc
BingoBoingo: systemd
thestringpuller: "Since 0.11B we have added systemd init scripts to make sure that the node will be started and auto-restarted if you reboot. The systemd bitcoinxtd.service registers the XT based daemon for autostart."
BingoBoingo: All things considered the only safe assumption is the San Fransisco County Sheriff's being on team systemd
mircea_popescu: BingoBoingo i wonder if this has anything to do with the ongoing systemd-ization of foss.
mircea_popescu: assbot:BUS1: A New Linux Kernel IPC Bus Being Made By Systemd Developers - Phoronix <<< ahahaha mkay.
BingoBoingo: "BUS1 isn't being developed by just some unknown individuals, but systemd developer David Herrmann and Kay Sievers seem to be the lead (and only) developers working on it thus far."
assbot: BUS1: A New Linux Kernel IPC Bus Being Made By Systemd Developers - Phoronix ... ( http://bit.ly/1jYSZgu )
asciilifeform: 'dbus', 'kernel systemd', and other filth will be insta-merged in (or rather, usg's pre-readied fork becomes 'blessed')
mircea_popescu: what, you think systemd happened in a vacuum ?
assbot: Logged on 01-11-2015 09:08:23; deedbot-: [Qntra] Busybox Drops systemd Support - http://qntra.net/2015/11/busybox-drops-systemd-support/
ascii_field: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=01-11-2015#1313057 << afaik it never worked to begin with (not even in the miserable sense that systemd 'worked' elsewhere) ☝︎
mircea_popescu: also, the field data suggests that contrary to everyone's worst nightmares, systemd will actually eventually fail, like the rest of similar attempts.
deedbot-: [Qntra] Busybox Drops systemd Support - http://qntra.net/2015/11/busybox-drops-systemd-support/ ☟︎
ascii_field: phun phakt: systemd HARD FREEZES a box with no chance of recovery if it runs into just about ANY issue at boot time.
jurov: to think that ibm pc was universally reviled like today systemd
ascii_field: '"He is a recipient of the Free Software Award from the Free Software Foundation for his work on Secure Boot, UEFI, and the Linux kernel". Ah! All the bits that I *don't* want in the kernel. Did he work on systemd too?'
BingoBoingo: punkman: Seems like motive enough for the NSA to do the systemd turd
assbot: Logged on 21-09-2015 16:49:58; ascii_field: '%g is the application system, currently %gall (1300 lines) %gall is half process table and half systemd, sort of.' << satan preserve us.
ascii_field: '%g is the application system, currently %gall (1300 lines) %gall is half process table and half systemd, sort of.' << satan preserve us. ☟︎
thestringpuller: sounds like something those anti-systemd forkers of debian would get behind
trinque: asciilifeform: yep, don't need pulseaudio for sound (even with mixing!), don't need networkmanager for internet connection (even wifi!), don't need systemd... dont need...
assbot: Logged on 05-02-2015 07:16:33; trinque: you want to build your visa? build it on bitcoin, but don't systemd the thing and decide it must have a visa built in
asciilifeform: complete with systemd-in-silicon
mircea_popescu: systemd BOOTS FASTER!!111
assbot: boot - Systemd is really slow in comparison to upstart - Ask Ubuntu ... ( http://bit.ly/1UnVrZK )
punkman: http://askubuntu.com/questions/665359/systemd-is-really-slow-in-comparison-to-upstart
trinque: well hell, that CoreOS (which is a breeding ground for systemd nonsense) has etcd
punkman: when is pulseaudio getting merged in systemd
punkman: "Next up: Systemd replaces “confusing” unix ls command with new and clean filectl command."
mircea_popescu: ahahaha systemd now su's ?
assbot: Lennart Poettering merged “su” command replacement into systemd: Test Drive on Fedora Rawhide | The Linux Homefront Project ... ( http://bit.ly/1EwE871 )
thestringpuller: "Processing triggers for systemd" << i throw up when I see this at work
asciilifeform: turns out mircea_popescu was right. let's all fly on the first systemd-avionics plane!
asciilifeform: http://www.zdnet.com/article/ubuntu-linux-is-coming-to-the-mainframe << complete with systemd!
punkman: for future testers http://www.linuxfromscratch.org/lfs/view/systemd/chapter07/locale.html
shinohai: http://log.bitcoin-assets.com/?date=08-08-2015#1230794 <<< agreed, but I'm not giving up. Despite how much I love Debian, systemd is a drawback. :/ ☝︎
gernika: Can someone point me to the guide for installing gentoo properly for foundation purposes? Following the default guide and it's got steps for setting up systemd, which clearly I don't want.
phf: systemd was really the last nail in the coffin, this stuff was going on for a while, like freedesktop.org which is a open standards body (?) for all the retardation that came out of kde/gnome and "linux on desktop"
asciilifeform: about as many as 'systemd'
BingoBoingo: Systemdick appologist gets fucked by systemd-ism https://phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=Btrfs-System-Fail-4.2-More
assbot: The NSA Is Looking At Systemd's KDBUS - Phoronix ... ( http://bit.ly/1OhdYFA )
mircea_popescu: by the time "systemd" is a word, usg-as-nsa is no longer.
punkman: what would be not-meta win for systemd?
mircea_popescu: systemd was an utter disaster for 'em.