" and so i assume the middle doesn't carry the required class="breakup" either.
1954099;1575304115;mircea_popescu;seems maybe for the sake of simplicity i could just process the source logs ; but then i'll end up with a broken bot when deployed huh.
1954100;1575304653;mircea_popescu;so instead : hey lobbes, please fix these and give me a one-line-per-post dump, formatted like "INSERT INTO tril_posts(id, post_author, post_status, post_type, post_name, post_date, post_date_gmt, post_title, post_content); INSERT INTO tril_term_relationships (object_id, term_taxonomy_id) VALUES ("articleid-1", 44);", wheren the ids start with 90800 and the time is now+3 hours whenever you start doing it.
1954101;1575304653;mircea_popescu;ima try putting the first few in and we see (i hope for eg you do the sed 's%"%\\"%g' | sed 's%*%\*%g' escapings, yes ?)
1954102;1575306128;BingoBoingo;So, apparently every datacenter in Vzla is fully staffed. For being fully staffed just about every datacenter in Vzla is happy to offer contact information for the folks who make hiring decisions at datacenters in other countries, mostly Colombia.
1954103;1575306173;BingoBoingo;Educated Venezuelans just might be the most helpful people in the Americas.
1954104;1575306243;BingoBoingo;Meanwhile in near virality and Uruguayos not ever leaving their own homes http://archive.is/AigEd
1954105;1575311859;mircea_popescu;lobbes, (adjusted and) answer't your comment.
1954106;1575317549;jurov;!!deed http://paste.deedbot.org/?id=lj5I
1954107;1575317552;deedbot;accepted: 1
1954108;1575318035;mircea_popescu;meanwhile in other lulz, http://archive.is/zK4he
1954109;1575318354;BingoBoingo;5GB of placeholder, what a world
1954110;1575318598;mircea_popescu;you can imagine what joys these "trusted platforms" bring to binary distribution.
1954111;1575318710;BingoBoingo;Last I looked into it they brought at a minimum an additional ~GB of RAM consumption and ~2-50% of CPU utilization as a "Don't copy this floppy" deterrent that forces everyone to download the version with that shit cut out.
1954112;1575318991;BingoBoingo;In other joys of the 4 month transition until the new government comes in March 1st... The outgoing government is declining to do their annual inflation based adjustments to the various rates charged by the state monopolies... after the price of beef at the carnicerías climbed ~70% for "asado de tira" this year. Backdoor welfare as only dollar economies pretending to be their own peso economies can manage.
1954113;1575320492;mircea_popescu;heh
1954114;1575320501;mircea_popescu;"coming soon to a walmart near you"
1954115;1575320865;BingoBoingo;Lol, this country doesn't have an actual walmart. It has small chains of "hypermercados" run by board members of Walmart and Walmart-likes that they use to play around and learn more about this sorta cattle troughing.
1954116;1575320909;BingoBoingo;North American Walmarteers own Tienda Inglesa. Euro equivalents own Disco, Devoto, and Geant.
1954117;1575321047;BingoBoingo;It is a small sadness that it looks like I'll be leaving Uruguay just as it starts to get interesting, but... the local vandals don't seem to have discovered how to make "ninja rocks" outta ceramic insulators.
1954118;1575325534;diana_coman;!!up dorion_road
1954119;1575325535;deedbot;dorion_road voiced for 30 minutes.
1954120;1575325548;dorion_road;ty diana_coman
1954121;1575325573;BingoBoingo;!!up dorion_road
1954122;1575325574;deedbot;dorion_road voiced for 30 minutes.
1954123;1575325703;dorion_road;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-11-29#1953812 << thanks for the background spyked. I agree we're at the phase of figuring out what is [http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-11-29#1953818][really needed].
1954124;1575325703;ossabot;Logged on 2019-11-29 03:43:59 spyked: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-11-27#1953704 <-- not sure what'd be the best fit, tbh. I'm an odd one, spent years studying the theory re os and systems in general. but as far as actual work goes, other than my [http://thetarpit.org/category/tech][public work], I've been doing mostly maintenance (bugfixing, a bit of feature development) for linux kernels driving custom hardware/schedulers/netwo
1954125;1575325703;ossabot;Logged on 2019-11-29 03:51:10 spyked: dorion_road: so I'm sort of a "master of none", I guess. but in general, I'm interested in doing any infrastructure work required to get a tmsr-os up, I think I can handle it, with probably some ramp-up time to learn the code. imho needs figuring out what's really needed tho, e.g. from [http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-11-27#1953703][your list], what work is required for bootloaders/biosen and wh
1954126;1575325764;dorion_road; Did my [http://dorion-mode.com/2019/11/implementing-tmsr-os/#comment-47][reply] to your comment clarify the requirements for owning the boot process ?
1954127;1575325805;dorion_road;The starting point is for the bios and bootloader code to be owned by someone under V. Coreboot, LILO and GRUB (for EFI support) come under V to be beat into human use.
1954128;1575325866;dorion_road;I don't yet know exactly how they're to be beat, that's for the owner to investigate, report back on the cost/benefits of various decisions and publish his vpatches.
1954129;1575326006;dorion_road;diana_coman, mircea_popescu I replied to your comments on my [http://dorion-mode.com/2019/11/implementing-tmsr-os/][tmsr-os] article. Apologies for the latency, atypical meat space festivities took more of my weekend than normal.
1954130;1575326117;dorion_road;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-01#1954016 << ok, thanks for the update. please provide your updated expected date of delivery as soon as it becomes clearer to you what the situation is. as mircea_popescu notes, perhaps you turn up something cool.
1954131;1575326117;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-01 16:57:17 bvt: dorion_road: i have discovered some WTF??? sort of bug in the kernel that manifests only outside of the VM. i will continue debugging it tomorrow, but this means that the writeup will appear only after it is fixed; sorry for this delay.
1954132;1575326188;dorion_road;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-11-29#1953863 << thanks, I applied diana_coman's [http://ossasepia.com/2019/11/29/comments-filtering-for-mp-wp/][fix].
1954133;1575326189;ossabot;Logged on 2019-11-29 14:49:29 mircea_popescu: dorion, it'd prolly be a good idea to take your own trackbacks out of the (independently --VERY SHORT) recent comments toolbar. i can't tell what's going on
1954134;1575326371;dorion_road;I am working on a work plan for myself for the next week(s). I will publish as an article this week when ready.
1954135;1575326594;mircea_popescu;you don't specifically want both lilo and grub, or do you ?
1954136;1575326810;dorion_road;mircea_popescu grub may be required if EFI systems are supported. I don't know if lilo is worth saving or if grub for everything is the better choice.
1954137;1575326849;mircea_popescu;afaik everyone who uses lilo loves lilo and everyone who uses grub loves grub. allegedly the former's more fully featured while the later's more narrowly construed.
1954138;1575327031;dorion_road;I can see it, I think I read about lilo in the logs, then have stuck with since following the gentoo handbook a few years back, apart from one public toilet efi laptop where I went with grub.
1954139;1575327117;mircea_popescu;anyway, the efi/uefi problem is actually looming the largest here.
1954140;1575327247;jfw;myeah. if Intel decides the PC architecture is no longer the PC architecture, OS maker has to bear the burden ?
1954141;1575327313;mircea_popescu;the nsa is firmly entrenched in controlling that sweet, sweet path to diff power analysis, they've glued it thoroughly with all the broken glass of "energy efficiency" faux ourdemocracy preoccupations, it strikes me as one of the things that'll only dislodge once the [http://trilema.com/2014/the-idea-for-a-great-film/][emperor himself] is rapemeat.
1954142;1575327342;mircea_popescu;jfw, the ideal solution here'd be a de-uefi-izing dongle.
1954143;1575327393;mircea_popescu;but in any case, the item's probably the most contundent impediment to sanity in computong
1954144;1575327423;jfw;But what do you put in its place? Reversing boards was tough enough as I gather even before the standard fritz chips
1954145;1575327489;mircea_popescu;myeah.
1954146;1575327514;mircea_popescu;i dunno, i'd rather this didn't end up with a tmsr motherboard.
1954147;1575327587;mircea_popescu;in any case, my point being, this whole uefi thing needs some serious mapping.
1954148;1575327993;*;jfw opens up the spec PDF he had lying on HDD, is reminded it's 2500 pages
1954149;1575328014;hanbot;diana_coman i'm getting that fun ol' "please fill the required fields (name, email)" error on attempting to comment on your latest. did something change since lastcomment?
1954150;1575328717;mircea_popescu;there;s at least one major separation in the uefi latrine (plenty others, of course, the thing's fractally broken), which fortunately occured just about that moment in time when intel chips became thoroughly useless. so not supporting uefi-2, "must have to work" is relatively a small loss, as it goes with the shitty spycore intel chips anyways, which nobody wants (though might be tolerated in some roles for cheapness' sake
1954151;1575328717;mircea_popescu;). uefi-1 however is just this jumble of works-with-or-without, maybe-so-maybe-not, up to indeed about 2015 or so.
1954152;1575328744;mircea_popescu;getting concrete details on this partition would certainly help, as a starting point.
1954153;1575328884;mircea_popescu;i don't really know anyone who both a) is technically literate and b) thinks post 2015 intel chips are actually worth money, as it happens. a situation eerily reminiscent of every other socialism's progress, late sovok folk similarily didn't think late sovok artefacts worth deploying.
1954154;1575329019;jfw;Are the post-2013 AMDs any better? 'platform security processor' to keep up with the competition right?
1954155;1575329116;mircea_popescu;prolly just less documented equally worse, nfi.
1954156;1575329122;jfw;the noted split in UEFI severity is a point.
1954157;1575329250;mircea_popescu;Where do anti-good ideas come from? They come from misguided attempts to do the impossible - which is another way of saying "trying to ignore reality."
1954158;1575329253;mircea_popescu;not bad, huh.
1954159;1575329428;mircea_popescu;fundamentally true, just about everything wrong with the world is the downstream of "well meaning" [http://trilema.com/2019/margaret-cavendish-retard-of-newcastle-upon-tyne][margarets] trying to bring dead babies back to life and such nonsense.
1954160;1575329508;jfw;I was remembering this phrase but not where from; turns out my [http://fixpoint.welshcomputing.com/2019/gales-linux-initial-release/?b=penetrate&e=patch#select][own link], hah. Which pretty sure I found via the logs.
1954161;1575329673;mircea_popescu;aha
1954162;1575331344;mod6;http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-11-29#1953800 << Hi jfw, yes, that's all that is published.
1954163;1575331344;snsabot;Logged on 2019-11-29 03:55:19 jfw: mod6, trinque or other TRB scholars: has there been progress toward raw transaction RPCs since http://therealbitcoin.org/ml/2018-April/000297.html ? I've written a getrawtransaction (in my queue to publish) but am in need of a sendrawtransaction for a split wallet I'm working on ( http://fixpoint.welshcomputing.com/2019/gales-bitcoin-wallet-spec-and-battle-plan/ )
1954164;1575331401;mod6;I had some stuff I was testing and working on, but it did not include a 'cleaving-off' of the wallet.
1954165;1575331422;mod6;Since then, it seems like that may be a first-order of business.
1954166;1575335427;jfw;mod6: I meanwhile found http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2016-09-29#1550366
1954167;1575335427;ossabot;Logged on 2016-09-29 14:21:47 asciilifeform: ( or, e.g., http://btcbase.org/patches/polarbeard_add_sendrawtransaction_rpc )
1954168;1575335527;mod6;Ah, gotcha.
1954169;1575335613;mircea_popescu;that poor guy.
1954170;1575336811;mircea_popescu;meanwhile in period trilemas, http://trilema.com/2015/the-four-points-of-this-morning-in-color-any-questions/
1954171;1575360659;diana_coman;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-02#1954082 - no changes really; on looking at it, that error was thrown on too-short/missing email/name so possibly that's what happened? At any rate, since I don't care about email really, I took the check on email out so please try again and let me know if it's still missbehaving (my testing comments all went through fine, from different machines & IPs).
1954172;1575360660;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-02 19:14:44 hanbot: diana_coman i'm getting that fun ol' "please fill the required fields (name, email)" error on attempting to comment on your latest. did something change since lastcomment?
1954173;1575375839;hanbot;diana_coman: works.
1954174;1575375934;hanbot;i wonder wtf tho'. i remember popping that message when i was trying to adjust the spam filter on the themes to work correctly, but that's been fixed a -while-. maybe it thought my email addy's offensive somehow lol.
1954175;1575376338;diana_coman;hanbot: iirc there was some issue if one messed up something in that additional [http://trilema.com/2013/effectual-spam-filtering-for-wordpress/][spam filtering] change because it touches indeed the same file and it's ~easy to make a mistake so it just kills all comments; but then it kills all really so hm.
1954176;1575376391;diana_coman;was that email address less than 6 chars in total? that and/or no '@' would have failed the check.
1954177;1575376652;hanbot;plenty moar than 6. i suppose it's possible i failed to get an @ in there...but i don't think so. ofc i don't have much of a way to go back and review.
1954178;1575376676;hanbot;what can you do. if i ever see it again i'll take a screenshot or somethin'.
1954179;1575378058;diana_coman;yeah, would give some idea as to what it is; given I took out any check on email field now anyway, I'd really want a screenshot if it happens again! lolz
1954180;1575382310;mircea_popescu;meanwhile in other great online business lulz, http://paste.deedbot.org/?id=_Y8s
1954181;1575382358;mircea_popescu;diana_coman, btw, since we're getting rid of "posts" how about getting rid of email, also ? "secret string".
1954182;1575382369;mircea_popescu;explain to the user that if he wants to be later identified, put a string in there.
1954183;1575382467;mircea_popescu;eventually that could evolve into detaCHED signature. have tmsr-gpg issue a one-line base-whatever tmsr standard detached sig for text.
1954184;1575382652;diana_coman;mircea_popescu: makes sense; atm though there's still a lot of "posts" all over mp-wp and it's annoying because it makes me trip over and go "post" when I mean article, myeah; a lot of cleaning left to do on that but irc billymg was on it so I shall refrain currently from further trespassing :P
1954185;1575382844;*;diana_coman goes back to cs+eulora client
1954186;1575383046;mircea_popescu;:p
1954187;1575385090;BingoBoingo;http://archive.is/60SGP << And the local establishment wankstream press is finally catching up to Qntra on the background of the rebellious youth now that they've been cycled through their house arrest hearings. It also appears that for all of the money spent on cameras and other theatrics... the cameras aren't good enough to offer images capable of actually identifying anyone at night.
1954188;1575385222;mircea_popescu;that has been an open secret for a while.
1954189;1575385282;mircea_popescu;the cameras everywhere are there for stupid old women to shut the fuck up already, they don't really do so much -- in the rare instances they actually have film. which -- it's fuckingexpensive, the camera revolution happened just as the ssds came in. do the math if you will :
1954190;1575385301;BingoBoingo;The derps are also being exceedingly consistent on "no political motivations" despite... audio recordings
1954191;1575385350;mircea_popescu;1080 px (ie, just enough to MAYBE be able to identify ~something~, say 50% of the time, given you have neither iris nor crystalline, meaning your camera's fixed lens, doesn't adjust for either depth of field or luminance) will produce 1mb per color PER FRAME. if there's 10 frames in the second and 24 hours in the day, why,
1954192;1575385361;mircea_popescu;!Qcalc 1 * 3 * 10 * 3600 * 24
1954193;1575385361;lobbesbot;mircea_popescu: 2592000
1954194;1575385418;mircea_popescu;sure, "it can be compressed". HOWEVER, compress as you will, two an' a half raw terrabytes throughput will wear a ssd enough to be noticeable. and then the next day comes, and soon enough nobody wants to buy a new ssd each other week for EACH CAM
1954195;1575385484;mircea_popescu;nor is anyone to be had who knows how to set up a raid of spinners, or could be arsed to.
1954196;1575385509;BingoBoingo;AHA. The fixed lens really beats the thing into uselessness. The fictional "enhance image" tools the magic produced for Old women CSI magician police shows use... don't exist.
1954197;1575385600;BingoBoingo; nor is anyone to be had who knows how to set up a raid of spinners, or could be arsed to. << Most of the small business folk will have one chinese box loaded with 1 to 4 of spinners, dearly bought, to hold the output of their horribly under resolutioned cameras.
1954198;1575385641;mircea_popescu;yeah ; but they're very consistent with all the other magics that don't exist outside old woman skull. they work [http://trilema.com/2018/the-problem-with-christians/][just like jesus], for one thing.
1954199;1575385772;BingoBoingo;I dunno that cheap printing had any positive impact that balances out filling old woman skulls all with the same uniform stupidities.
1954200;1575385834;mircea_popescu;printing had ~nothing to do with it, the problem existed three thousand years ago [http://trilema.com/2018/democracy-sucks-the-two-thousand-four-hundred-and-change-years-old-version/][exactly the same].
1954201;1575386021;BingoBoingo;Well, [http://trilema.com/2014/the-boy-blog-network/][the pulp revolution] let the poor, the stupid, and the old indulge in fantasies of derps like themselves coping with the occasional Gibs ex Machina "validating" them as important.
1954202;1575386170;BingoBoingo;The problem probably predates writing. "Farm so I can get fat", "Fuck you we're moving along and following the mammoths, I'm not going to live off of your damned dry seed paste"
1954203;1575386582;mircea_popescu;indeed the pike was probably the first and most effectual bitcoin to date. "shut up or ima poke you again"
1954204;1575386591;BingoBoingo;Despite Tapioca being a news world crops, large swaths of Africa live off the stuff. It's the ultimate Old Woman crop going further than the old world root vegetables. It's a woody shrub that happens to produce some carb laden if extremely toxic root nodes that will keep indefinitely in the ground ensuring the Matriarchy will never want to move or do anything.
1954205;1575386691;BingoBoingo;And then the old women can stick to their elaborate rituals to make one of the world's least nutritious candidate crops less than deadly for consumption.
1954206;1575386810;BingoBoingo;For carrying out the rituals, the old women get to feel important despite just about any other food all that effort could have been directed at being much better at being food.
1954207;1575386927;diana_coman;eh, such men that get all bogged down that it's all "old women's fault".
1954208;1575386947;mircea_popescu;i've met plenty of 20yo nominally male old women. haven't you ?
1954209;1575386982;mircea_popescu;baiatul-baba, the old woman boy.
1954210;1575386999;diana_coman;neah, just capu' lui mai fu-se la un cur de baba.
1954211;1575387066;mircea_popescu;jahahha what ?!
1954212;1575387147;mircea_popescu;i never heard that one before. is it fuse, past participle to be ? or is it fu & se separately as location ?
1954213;1575387213;diana_coman;mircea_popescu: you know, I always ever heard it spoken only (strabunica apriga dixit, ofc.) so ...always wondered really.
1954214;1575387226;BingoBoingo;diana_coman: The loudest old women nowadays seem to be young and [http://trilema.com/2018/in-which-a-bizarre-character-wanks-it/][not so young] marginal XY folk.
1954215;1575387229;mircea_popescu;hm.
1954216;1575387231;diana_coman;but I found it increasingly apt to describe those, as I grew up, indeed.
1954217;1575387270;mircea_popescu;south east more likely fuse i guess, the short fu is more nw.
1954218;1575387288;diana_coman;I guess so.
1954219;1575387291;*;diana_coman will bbl
1954220;1575387310;mircea_popescu;it is CERTAINLY apt. i myself never heard it before ; and of course the ever-useful internet only has https://ro.porn4you.xxx/video/baba-se-freaca-la-pizda-in-timp-ce-nepoata-se-fute-cu-mosu-1280.html inept nonsense to offer
1954221;1575387337;mircea_popescu;how good that the ourdemocracy shanonizing machines were imported to utterly overwhelm the most firava local textual production.
1954222;1575400402;feedbot;http://qntra.net/2019/12/chicago-police-chief-fired/ << Qntra -- Chicago Police Chief Fired
1954223;1575401222;mircea_popescu;meanwhile in ganymede news, the bimbo's been hauling empty cups downstairs and full cups back upstairs for lo this past half hour ; in between mopping the well sopped bathroom floor and replenishing sanitation items ; in continuation of having taking turns sucking my cock in my bath.
1954224;1575401233;mircea_popescu;next up, going to persia to teach the padishah how to shah.
1954225;1575401565;BingoBoingo;Teaching Persians how to be better Persians is a pursuit with a long storied history. The question is, will the Persians write more words in their note taking than you publish on Trilema for having done the teaching?
1954226;1575401578;mircea_popescu;lol srsly
1954227;1575402481;diana_coman;mircea_popescu: going to India too? :D
1954228;1575402513;mircea_popescu;naah
1954229;1575402544;BingoBoingo;Anyways, some pleasant fallout from the local derping towards activity on the part of the youth. They appear to now to emptying the dumpsters every night despite... kids not gathering at the "problem" stretch of the Rambla anymore in numbers greater than a dozen.
1954230;1575402585;diana_coman;BingoBoingo: ahahah, it takes a sort-of-riot to ...empty the bins? lmao.
1954231;1575402661;BingoBoingo;diana_coman: Well, the sub-municipality containing my hood they contract trash service separately from the rest of the city because "fuck work stoppages" and they were reliably emptied bi-weekly.
1954232;1575402698;BingoBoingo;I've not seen consecutive days of emptying before this week.
1954233;1575402727;BingoBoingo;The horse cart rag and bone men are going to be unhappy.
1954234;1575403058;*;BingoBoingo having continued encouraging conversations with Colombians, may be going to Medellín.
1954235;1575403154;diana_coman;why not.
1954236;1575403192;BingoBoingo;Peaking at the rents, it is looking like a great spot to land if I can get them to buy.
1954237;1575403287;BingoBoingo;Also, the local accents up there should be a tremendous improvement.
1954238;1575405018;mircea_popescu;columbian chicks prolly the hawtest biomatter that side of the world also.
1954239;1575405247;BingoBoingo;There's few Colombianas in Uruguay that I've met, but despite the small sample size... they are a breed apart from the rest of the continent.
1954240;1575405796;BingoBoingo;Of course the fact that Colombianas don't end up in Uruguay seems like it may be a testament to their hotness
1954241;1575406162;mircea_popescu;lobbes, http://trilema.com/2019/introducing-the-logs/#comment-132532
1954242;1575409296;lobbes;mircea_popescu: answered (in modqueue)
1954243;1575409304;*;lobbes will bbl in a few hrs
1954244;1575409977;BingoBoingo;!!up dorion_road
1954245;1575409978;deedbot;dorion_road voiced for 30 minutes.
1954246;1575410095;dorion_road;ty BingoBoingo
1954247;1575410240;dorion_road;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-11-29#1953812 << well spyked, the [http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-02#1954072][efi/uefi problem] needs solving.
1954248;1575410240;ossabot;Logged on 2019-11-29 03:43:59 spyked: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-11-27#1953704 <-- not sure what'd be the best fit, tbh. I'm an odd one, spent years studying the theory re os and systems in general. but as far as actual work goes, other than my [http://thetarpit.org/category/tech][public work], I've been doing mostly maintenance (bugfixing, a bit of feature development) for linux kernels driving custom hardware/schedulers/netwo
1954249;1575410241;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-02 18:59:47 mircea_popescu: anyway, the efi/uefi problem is actually looming the largest here.
1954250;1575410270;dorion_road;as it turns out, it seems to my eye that it'd suit you well, given, e.g., the low level firmware work you're doing. do you want it ?
1954251;1575410350;dorion_road;If so, take mapping the uefi-{1,2} partition as the starting point. The specifications are [https://uefi.org/specifications][here].
1954252;1575410434;dorion_road;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-02#1954075 << Not sure how it is otherwise, but I've installed a custom BIOS on the x200 thinkpads, which was done by overwritting the vendor's on a ROM specifically for BIOS. On that board, the ROM is easily accessible under the trackpad.
1954253;1575410434;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-02 19:03:32 mircea_popescu: jfw, the ideal solution here'd be a de-uefi-izing dongle.
1954254;1575410515;dorion_road;Such ROMs on other boards could be much harder to access. Is such an ideal solution conceivable via USB ? For example, boots into an initramfs with "flashrom" style program and operator's custom BIOS preinstalled for overwriting the vendor.
1954255;1575410941;mircea_popescu;obviously replacing the chip is the golden standard.
1954256;1575410990;mircea_popescu;but otherwise, reflashing, sure.
1954257;1575411287;bvt;dorion_road: thursday is the new deadline; the reason for the bug was nothing cool; it was a hole in my vpatch generation process for kernel which i will have to review and change.
1954258;1575411380;dorion_road;bvt ok, thanks for the update.
1954259;1575411436;bvt;re efi, i only had a one machine with it, used in-kernel efi stub and efibootmgr (configuration tool, not loader), did not use grub there
1954260;1575411521;dorion_road;mircea_popescu et al, nice. it's certainly exciting to be zeroing in on [http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-02#1954076][the most contundent impediment] to sane computing. I'm looking forward to what spyked has to say.
1954261;1575411522;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-02 19:04:23 mircea_popescu: but in any case, the item's probably the most contundent impediment to sanity in computong
1954262;1575412531;mod6;trinque: http://paste.deedbot.org/?id=d9sf
1954263;1575417321;mod6;!!deed http://paste.deedbot.org/?id=PYH9
1954264;1575417324;deedbot;accepted: 1
1954265;1575417342;mod6;^ Last month's Foundation report, just placing in deedbot.
1954266;1575417354;mod6;!!deed http://paste.deedbot.org/?id=mga_
1954267;1575417359;deedbot;accepted: 1
1954268;1575417395;mod6;^ Foundation Report for November, also can be found here: http://thebitcoin.foundation/reports/btcf_address_201911.txt
1954269;1575432880;feedbot;http://trilema.com/2019/forum-logs-for-28-Mar-2016/ << Trilema -- Forum logs for 28 Mar 2016
1954270;1575432893;mircea_popescu;lobbes, http://trilema.com/2019/forum-logs-for-28-Mar-2016/
1954271;1575432912;mircea_popescu;there's still something off here, the font's too big, when compared to http://trilema.com/2019/forum-logs-for-27-mar-2016/ ; looking into it.
1954272;1575432955;mircea_popescu;o look at that, too much escaping o.O
1954273;1575433198;mircea_popescu; <<< aaand yet another problem, too many quotes in there.
1954274;1575433366;feedbot;http://trilema.com/2019/forum-logs-for-26-mar-2016/ << Trilema -- Forum logs for 26 Mar 2016
1954275;1575433697;mircea_popescu;and it looks like we're good!
1954276;1575433719;mircea_popescu;!Qcalc 57 * 1293 / 3600
1954277;1575433720;lobbesbot;mircea_popescu: 20.4725
1954278;1575433745;mircea_popescu;should be done posting in ~20 hours an' a half, at which time ima send you over a db dump + filesystem package.
1954279;1575433770;mircea_popescu;see also the comments for... well, comments.
1954280;1575433851;feedbot;http://trilema.com/2019/forum-logs-for-28-Mar-2016/ << Trilema -- Forum logs for 28 Mar 2016
1954281;1575433888;mircea_popescu;bwahahaha apparently the time's fucked on these, they appear backwards.
1954282;1575433913;feedbot;http://trilema.com/2019/forum-logs-for-29-Mar-2016/ << Trilema -- Forum logs for 29 Mar 2016
1954283;1575433915;feedbot;http://trilema.com/2019/forum-logs-for-30-Mar-2016/ << Trilema -- Forum logs for 30 Mar 2016
1954284;1575434012;mircea_popescu;lobbes wtf dude, you set ALL of these to 2019-12-03 22:03:06 time ?! didn't we go through an entire discussion of how it should increase monotonically ? gah.
1954285;1575434040;feedbot;http://trilema.com/2019/forum-logs-for-31-Mar-2016/ << Trilema -- Forum logs for 31 Mar 2016
1954286;1575434102;feedbot;http://trilema.com/2019/forum-logs-for-02-Apr-2016/ << Trilema -- Forum logs for 02 Apr 2016
1954287;1575434104;feedbot;http://trilema.com/2019/forum-logs-for-03-Apr-2016/ << Trilema -- Forum logs for 03 Apr 2016
1954288;1575434771;feedbot;http://trilema.com/2019/forum-logs-for-27-mar-2016/ << Trilema -- Forum logs for 27 Mar 2016
1954289;1575434833;feedbot;http://trilema.com/2019/the-tmsr-os-implicit-clients/ << Trilema -- The TMSR-OS implicit clients
1954290;1575434835;feedbot;http://trilema.com/2019/what-the-fuck-is-this-then/ << Trilema -- What the fuck is this, then ?!
1954291;1575434837;feedbot;http://trilema.com/2019/the-alleged-crisis-of-the-supposed-engineering-or-mistaken-identities-pantomiming-a-comedy-of-manners/ << Trilema -- The alleged crisis of the supposed engineering, or mistaken identities pantomiming a comedy of manners.
1954292;1575435020;feedbot;http://trilema.com/2019/forum-logs-for-26-mar-2016/ << Trilema -- Forum logs for 26 Mar 2016
1954293;1575435204;mircea_popescu;poor feedbot.
1954294;1575436809;lobbes;o damn
1954295;1575436811;lobbes;http://logs.ericbenevides.com/log/trilema/2019-12-04#1954217 << the line_ids are monotonic yes, but not related to date (it is just a line count). As for the date, I took your [time is now+3 hours whenever you start doing it][http://logs.ericbenevides.com/log/trilema/2019-12-04#1954217] to mean that exactly
1954296;1575436811;ericbot;Logged on 2019-12-04 04:37:32 mircea_popescu: lobbes wtf dude, you set ALL of these to 2019-12-03 22:03:06 time ?! didn't we go through an entire discussion of how it should increase monotonically ? gah.
1954297;1575436812;ericbot;Logged on 2019-12-04 04:37:32 mircea_popescu: lobbes wtf dude, you set ALL of these to 2019-12-03 22:03:06 time ?! didn't we go through an entire discussion of how it should increase monotonically ? gah.
1954298;1575436822;lobbes;wait whoops
1954299;1575436832;lobbes;2nd ref is >> http://logs.ericbenevides.com/log/trilema/2019-12-02#1954033
1954300;1575436833;ericbot;Logged on 2019-12-02 16:41:29 mircea_popescu: so instead : hey lobbes, please fix these and give me a one-line-per-post dump, formatted like "INSERT INTO tril_posts(id, post_author, post_status, post_type, post_name, post_date, post_date_gmt, post_title, post_content); INSERT INTO tril_term_relationships (object_id, term_taxonomy_id) VALUES ("articleid-1", 44);", wheren the ids start with 90800 and the time is now+3 hours whenever you start doing it.
1954301;1575436854;mircea_popescu;lobbes, well, in the process of fixing, should have something presently.
1954302;1575436899;mircea_popescu;what i ~meant~ was, by-reference-to-bash-script published, "take ~TIMECNT~ to be so and so".
1954303;1575437082;lobbes;aa I see.
1954304;1575437185;mircea_popescu;the problem with multiple posts on the same exact second is that mpwp sorts them incorrectly. (like feedbot, gets them in reverse order).
1954305;1575437577;mircea_popescu;i suspect there might be a further issue with date formats there tho.
1954306;1575437972;mircea_popescu;lobbes, i think it's good now, finally!
1954307;1575437993;mircea_popescu;http://trilema.com/2019/forum-logs-for-30-Mar-2016/#2068497 << this is example of why the breakout td btw. without that magic word, the line'd just push everything to the right over the toolbars.
1954308;1575438012;lobbes;mircea_popescu: nice. sorry for all the gyrations
1954309;1575438020;mircea_popescu;well, ~under~ the toolbars on trilema ; but fwis on most other blogs it ends up on top.
1954310;1575438087;feedbot;http://trilema.com/2019/forum-logs-for-28-Mar-2016/ << Trilema -- Forum logs for 28 Mar 2016
1954311;1575438149;feedbot;http://trilema.com/2019/forum-logs-for-29-Mar-2016/ << Trilema -- Forum logs for 29 Mar 2016
1954312;1575438151;feedbot;http://trilema.com/2019/forum-logs-for-30-Mar-2016/ << Trilema -- Forum logs for 30 Mar 2016
1954313;1575438154;feedbot;http://trilema.com/2019/forum-logs-for-31-Mar-2016/ << Trilema -- Forum logs for 31 Mar 2016
1954314;1575438177;mircea_popescu;there we go.
1954315;1575438215;feedbot;http://trilema.com/2019/forum-logs-for-02-Apr-2016/ << Trilema -- Forum logs for 02 Apr 2016
1954316;1575438216;mircea_popescu;with apologies to anyone who perhaps had business to transact today, #trilema is undergoing the second (and forevermore last) festival of log recuperation ; should be done in about twenty hours.
1954317;1575438292;lobbes;they're looking good so far. ah this is nice to see
1954318;1575438301;mircea_popescu;lobbes, was there no april 1st ?!
1954319;1575438345;feedbot;http://trilema.com/2019/forum-logs-for-03-Apr-2016/ << Trilema -- Forum logs for 03 Apr 2016
1954320;1575438348;mircea_popescu;but yes, a large chunk of the job is now done!
1954321;1575438406;feedbot;http://trilema.com/2019/forum-logs-for-04-Apr-2016/ << Trilema -- Forum logs for 04 Apr 2016
1954322;1575438409;feedbot;http://trilema.com/2019/forum-logs-for-05-Apr-2016/ << Trilema -- Forum logs for 05 Apr 2016
1954323;1575438411;feedbot;http://trilema.com/2019/forum-logs-for-06-Apr-2016/ << Trilema -- Forum logs for 06 Apr 2016
1954324;1575438537;feedbot;http://trilema.com/2019/forum-logs-for-07-Apr-2016/ << Trilema -- Forum logs for 07 Apr 2016
1954325;1575438578;lobbes;mircea_popescu: that is odd about apr 1st being missing. There were logs that day: http://logs.ericbenevides.com/log/trilema/2016-04-01
1954326;1575438599;feedbot;http://trilema.com/2019/forum-logs-for-08-Apr-2016/ << Trilema -- Forum logs for 08 Apr 2016
1954327;1575438601;feedbot;http://trilema.com/2019/forum-logs-for-09-Apr-2016/ << Trilema -- Forum logs for 09 Apr 2016
1954328;1575438603;feedbot;http://trilema.com/2019/forum-logs-for-10-Apr-2016/ << Trilema -- Forum logs for 10 Apr 2016
1954329;1575438620;mircea_popescu;lobbes, seems you're missing a day! http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2016-04-01 is absent ; http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2016-04-02#1444341 == http://trilema.com/2019/forum-logs-for-02-Apr-2016/#2070886 and yet http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2016-04-01#1444340 is in http://trilema.com/2019/forum-logs-for-31-Mar-2016/#2070885
1954330;1575438620;ossabot;Logged on 2016-04-02 00:26:08 deedbot-: [Daniel P. Barron] Count me as thick, I dun see the connection. - http://danielpbarron.com/2016/count-me-as-thick-i-dun-see-the-connection/
1954331;1575438620;ossabot;Logged on 2016-04-01 23:55:19 mircea_popescu: cool.
1954332;1575438728;mircea_popescu;lobbes, look here : http://trilema.com/2019/forum-logs-for-31-Mar-2016/#2069891 ; you conflated march 31st and april 1st ; your first day in april is thereby april 2nd/.
1954333;1575438742;mircea_popescu;please tell me you didn't do this systematically for EVERY month, whereby they all start on 2nd ?
1954334;1575438767;mircea_popescu;fencing errors will be the death of you my good man.
1954335;1575438789;feedbot;http://trilema.com/2019/forum-logs-for-11-Apr-2016/ << Trilema -- Forum logs for 11 Apr 2016
1954336;1575438851;feedbot;http://trilema.com/2019/forum-logs-for-12-Apr-2016/ << Trilema -- Forum logs for 12 Apr 2016
1954337;1575438851;lobbes;mircea_popescu: oh ffs, I think I did
1954338;1575438853;feedbot;http://trilema.com/2019/forum-logs-for-13-Apr-2016/ << Trilema -- Forum logs for 13 Apr 2016
1954339;1575438855;feedbot;http://trilema.com/2019/forum-logs-for-14-Apr-2016/ << Trilema -- Forum logs for 14 Apr 2016
1954340;1575438867;mircea_popescu;yup, march 2017 ALSo starts on the 2nd.
1954341;1575438892;lobbes;goddamn it. yes those fencing errors. I'll need to keep a better eye on that going forward
1954342;1575438896;lobbes;gah
1954343;1575438913;mircea_popescu;aite, im stopping this. restate your thing properly! by which i mean, fix this one thing ; don't fix the rest of the issues, i've as you've seen meanwhile written bash around it.
1954344;1575438948;*;mircea_popescu is now somewhat petrified by the process, seeing how the first 2-3 errors were found on the spot, the 4th only once a few articles were in, and this last one only after a month was in.
1954345;1575438964;mircea_popescu;i would FUCKING HATE IT if this is what i do for the coming years, find and fix lobbeslog bugs.
1954346;1575438988;lobbes;I would also hate that, no need to worry
1954347;1575438993;lobbes;but will fix this
1954348;1575439039;feedbot;http://trilema.com/2019/forum-logs-for-15-Apr-2016/ << Trilema -- Forum logs for 15 Apr 2016
1954349;1575439041;feedbot;http://trilema.com/2019/forum-logs-for-16-Apr-2016/ << Trilema -- Forum logs for 16 Apr 2016
1954350;1575439348;feedbot;http://trilema.com/2019/forum-logs-for-26-mar-2016/ << Trilema -- Forum logs for 26 Mar 2016
1954351;1575439350;feedbot;http://trilema.com/2019/forum-logs-for-27-mar-2016/ << Trilema -- Forum logs for 27 Mar 2016
1954352;1575439352;feedbot;http://trilema.com/2019/the-tmsr-os-implicit-clients/ << Trilema -- The TMSR-OS implicit clients
1954353;1575439414;feedbot;http://trilema.com/2019/what-the-fuck-is-this-then/ << Trilema -- What the fuck is this, then ?!
1954354;1575439416;feedbot;http://trilema.com/2019/the-alleged-crisis-of-the-supposed-engineering-or-mistaken-identities-pantomiming-a-comedy-of-manners/ << Trilema -- The alleged crisis of the supposed engineering, or mistaken identities pantomiming a comedy of manners.
1954355;1575439434;lobbes;mircea_popescu: seeing as these were fence post errors, I'm going to get some sleep and cut this again with a fresh head. I'll get that dump to you tomorrow (with just the fix to the months)
1954356;1575465698;diana_coman;BingoBoingo_: the server finally arrived (and rather surprisingly, since the tracking page had no mention of any delivery date even this morning), thank you; it's been thoroughly pawed and decorated with "border force" tape but they can't hold a candle to you when it comes to packing, clearly.
1954357;1575467242;BingoBoingo;diana_coman: ty for letting me know. Have you found the misc screws and pull loops for the rails tucked into the leftmost drive bay?
1954358;1575467433;diana_coman;BingoBoingo: found them (ie 1 bag), yes; on the other side, even the corner of the metal case is bent, lolz.
1954359;1575467533;BingoBoingo;Did they fail to replace the bubble wrap or steal the foam padding?
1954360;1575467648;diana_coman;they half-heartedly shove it all back in again ie they didn't steal anything but didn't really pack it either; one of the drive bays' clamp was sticking out of the box even; I took some pics for the lolz but not sure when/if I get around to publish them.
1954361;1575467981;BingoBoingo;Who would have thought the English would be the ones to sloppily fail to repack things being shipped.
1954362;1575468264;diana_coman;well, tbh I saw way worse from others ie not-packing-at-all, literally left as an overflowing mess; it's still funny though, certainly.
1954363;1575468786;BingoBoingo;Should be quite some time before the kid runs out of bubble wrap to pop.
1954364;1575480847;hanbot;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-04#1954294 << eh it's ~always the "civilized" folks doing the stupidity-via-disrespect; i had a camera shipped to cr a while back amidst worries the locals would fuck it somehow, but it was the US side that stole it. the other half of the snailmail racket just delivers stupidity-via-formalisation, almost a kind of too much respect for the items in question, zero respect for the agents involved.
1954365;1575480848;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-04 10:07:40 BingoBoingo: Who would have thought the English would be the ones to sloppily fail to repack things being shipped.
1954366;1575480860;hanbot;priority post, right, where your priorities ain't theirs.
1954367;1575481042;BingoBoingo;Down here I've seen more of the latter. Then again "porch piracy" is not a concern here while it's endemic in old country.
1954368;1575481815;feedbot;http://qntra.net/2019/12/some-key-stealing-libraries-found-in-python-package-index/ << Qntra -- Some Key Stealing Libraries Found in Python Package Index
1954369;1575484489;BingoBoingo;https://archive.is/0A7Q5 << Meanwhile in ongoing flailing during the 4 month transition, Special Senate session to force through some shit!
1954370;1575498312;mircea_popescu;meanwhile in other random lulz : ip72-200-206-184.ok.ok.cox.net - - [04/Dec/2019:09:48:29 -0500] "GET / HTTP/1.1" 200 195732 "http://localhost:8094/fs/local/root/home/[https://twitter.com/calcnerd256][calcnerd256]/workbench/proxy/static/dangerous.html" "Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64) AppleWebKit/537.36 (KHTML, like Gecko) Ubuntu Chromium/78.0.3904.108 Chrome/78.0.3904.108 Safari/537.36"
1954371;1575498359;mircea_popescu;wtf they teach xtian masters of science in oklahoma is anyone's guess by this point.
1954372;1575498437;mircea_popescu;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-04#1954303 << also apparently there's a bug in the brackets-to-html convertor.
1954373;1575498438;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-04 18:33:13 mircea_popescu: meanwhile in other random lulz : ip72-200-206-184.ok.ok.cox.net - - [04/Dec/2019:09:48:29 -0500] "GET / HTTP/1.1" 200 195732 "http://localhost:8094/fs/local/root/home/[https://twitter.com/calcnerd256][calcnerd256]/workbench/proxy/static/dangerous.html" "Mozilla/5.0 (X11; Linux x86_64) AppleWebKit/537.36 (KHTML, like Gecko) Ubuntu Chromium/78.0.3904.108 Chrome/78.0.3904.108 Safari/537.36"
1954374;1575498482;mircea_popescu;i suppose it tries to put an a href inside an a href huh.
1954375;1575498599;mircea_popescu;!!seen lobbes
1954376;1575498599;deedbot;2019/12/04 06:03:55 mircea_popescu: seeing as these were fence post errors, I'm going to get some sleep and cut this again with a fresh head. I'll get that dump to you tomorrow (with just the fix to the months)
1954377;1575498620;mircea_popescu;here's to hoping he shows up, im bored enough i'm here going through trilema logs and shit
1954378;1575500627;*;lobbes just finished saltmines bs and is about to start cutting that dump now.
1954379;1575508508;lobbes;well I found the source of the conflated months weird. For whatever reason, the date compare for python fails when it is comparing formatted dates across months... i.e. "31 Mar 2016 < 01 Apr 2016" evaluates to ~false~, yet "30 Mar 2016 < 31 Mar 2016" evaluates to true like it should
1954380;1575508509;lobbes;in any case, fixing now (there was also an issue with some of the bot lines being out-of-order, which will also be fixed).
1954381;1575510571;mircea_popescu;o.O
1954382;1575510592;mircea_popescu;wtf, that's a spectacular bug. python ftw.
1954383;1575510793;mircea_popescu;holy shit he's right!
1954384;1575510794;mircea_popescu;Python 2.6.6 (r266:84292, Jun 20 2019, 14:14:55)
1954385;1575510794;mircea_popescu;[GCC 4.4.7 20120313 (Red Hat 4.4.7-23)] on linux2
1954386;1575510794;mircea_popescu;Type "help", "copyright", "credits" or "license" for more information.
1954387;1575510794;mircea_popescu;>>> one="31 Mar 2016"
1954388;1575510794;mircea_popescu;>>> two="01 Apr 2016"
1954389;1575510796;mircea_popescu;>>> one". I ultimately just need to tell if the days have changed from one line to the next, so that works); re-running my archives into my testblog now. Then I'll be going through with a veeeyyry fine toothed comb
1954392;1575511704;mircea_popescu;aite.
1954393;1575511759;mircea_popescu;ftr, today's the 5th, just started ; and it's also the absolute last day i can possibly receive this thing. after that, ima be on the road for a while.
1954394;1575511787;mircea_popescu;so im guessing having failed to make it run in this window we'll look at it again when i'm back ?
1954395;1575511843;lobbes;mircea_popescu: well, what are you looking at for hours left? I can try and get this to you in the next say 5 hours
1954396;1575511902;lobbes;otherwise, for the foreseeable future I will be available whenever you are to look at this (save for the last week of December)
1954397;1575512129;mircea_popescu;lobbes, no but think about it, even if i add the dump now, it'll be 20+ hours until it ~completes~. i'd like to you know, have more than a day after that if a problem crops up. it's just not feasible anymoar.
1954398;1575512152;mircea_popescu;i'll be back in settled circumstances willing and able to do such things sometime early next year.
1954399;1575512176;lobbes;mircea_popescu: I hear you on that. Welp, I failed this one
1954400;1575512216;lobbes;I'll keep combing it for bugs in the meantime, what can you do. Gives me time to make sure there will be no issues on prod server either I suppose
1954401;1575512253;mircea_popescu;moreover, a weekend-ish project that didn't complete in [http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-09-13#1935888][three momths] ain't gonna complete in a coupla days.
1954402;1575512253;ossabot;Logged on 2019-09-13 05:15:31 auctionbot: Buy order # 1057 has ENDED: item as described in http://logs.nosuchlabs.com/log/trilema/2019-09-07#1934605 and following. SOLD by lobbes for 100mn ecu. Attn: mircea_popescu
1954403;1575512254;snsabot;Logged on 2019-09-07 04:57:27 mircea_popescu: so : who would like to do a spot of work for hire for me ? the ideea is to write and publish as a vpatch a stan logbot extension which a) processes search, through talking to a [presumably present] mysql server, and spitting out the results (formatted as in http://trilema.com/2019/
1954404;1575512532;lobbes;mircea_popescu: it is reasonable. fwiw I'll have it ready for when you are
1954405;1575512677;lobbes;though tbh, this whole experience makes me think that maybe computers just ain't my thing. Perhaps I ought to think about BingoBoingo's writing for Qntra course a little more instead of this TMSR OS project
1954406;1575512694;lobbes;idk, I've got some thinking to do
1954407;1575513531;mircea_popescu;i thought computering was your chosen profession ?
1954408;1575513630;lobbes;I mean, I make my living doing it in Incan lands, sure. But the bar is much lower in those lands
1954409;1575513717;lobbes;and even then, it has always been 'soft computering' like reporting, sql queries, excel jockying, etc. The only programming language I really know is python (and that I've only ever used here in tmsr)
1954410;1575513754;mircea_popescu;from what i've seen, most people decide they don't really like computers once they get to know them at all.
1954411;1575513842;mircea_popescu;in fairness, sql is as much a programming language as any of them. bash, too.
1954412;1575513869;lobbes;that may be part of it haha. The more I do learn, the more I realize that I don't like it enough to ~want~ to be in front of a computer all day
1954413;1575513889;lobbes;well I'm glad you think that of sql; I've never known if I could count it as a 'programming' language
1954414;1575513907;mircea_popescu;(notice, incidentally, how my bash / awk didn't betray me in "if($2 != day)" like your python betrayed you)
1954415;1575513946;*;lobbes really does need to learn bash and awk already, in any case
1954416;1575513948;mircea_popescu;awk is really a sorta better php imo
1954417;1575513963;lobbes;I believe
1954418;1575513967;mircea_popescu;at any rate transparently what php set out to be back in 1990s, "what if we had a web-awk???".
1954419;1575514012;mircea_popescu;not even a bad idea, i'd say it's the core that carried the http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2018-12-04#1878244 thing
1954420;1575514012;ossabot;Logged on 2018-12-04 10:15:46 mircea_popescu: lamp was, in strict historical terms, the ~only~ linux success.
1954421;1575514056;mircea_popescu;now, how can you live doing reporting without awk is beyond me.
1954422;1575514349;lobbes;well, current saltmine (doing reporting) not only doesn't have awk, nor bash, but is on winblows (no surprise) and no administrative rights to do anything useful on computer). It is comical really. The amount they spend in time/money to do things that could be done with a 5 minute bash/awk (which again, just goes to show that in Incan lands it isn't about actually doing, just looking like doing)
1954423;1575514393;mircea_popescu;anyway, to belabour the point : the difference between us, dictated by experience and high level understanding as it may be, nevertheless comes in simple droplets. where i choose to let sql handle its own date format and use proper numeric notation for time, you attempt to convey string dates across boundries. it's [http://trilema.com/2015/the-downtrodden-are-downtrodden-for-a-reason-step-on-their-faces/?b=Old%20age&e=trea
1954424;1575514393;mircea_popescu;chery#select][this sorta thing] that gets you bloody.
1954425;1575514440;mircea_popescu;it's [http://trilema.com/2015/the-downtrodden-are-downtrodden-for-a-reason-step-on-their-faces/?b=Old%20age&e=treachery#select][this sorta thing] that gets you bloody.
1954426;1575514480;mircea_popescu;i dunno this has anything to do with computers per se, or in other words even if you decide you want to write, or make pottery, or run an isp or whatever the fuck else, you'll just meet the same bugaboos in different skirts.
1954427;1575514709;lobbes;hm is this something I can change, though? Or am I doomed here
1954428;1575514776;mircea_popescu;well how the hell do i know what you can change
1954429;1575514788;lobbes;true. I'm gonna take some time to absorb that trilema
1954430;1575514795;lobbes;ty
1954431;1575514818;mircea_popescu;np
1954432;1575515226;mircea_popescu;in other webidiocy lulz, http://ivy.paheal.net/_images/61370761c2ece4571a3a354e16605a52/1556124%20-%20Bugaboo%20Princess_Peach%20Super_Mario_Bros..png is the FIRST, and roughly speaking only, non-stroller result for a pic search for the string "bugaboo".
1954433;1575538898;spyked;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-02#1954056 <-- apologies for the radio silence. I've been down with a nasty stomach flu the last few days. I'll catch up with the discussion in the next coupla days and I'll give my take on bios/bootloader ownership
1954434;1575538898;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-02 18:36:12 dorion_road: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-11-29#1953812 << thanks for the background spyked. I agree we're at the phase of figuring out what is [http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-11-29#1953818][really needed].
1954435;1575538965;spyked;in related news, my november review/december plan was also delayed because of that, I'll have it published on saturday, along with my notes on current tmsr-os status
1954436;1575541276;spyked;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-03#1954183 <-- ftr, I'm not especially familiar with coreboot, though I've swimmed for a while in the SeaBIOS code a couple of years ago. but otoh the uefi 1/2 cleavage is worth studying and documenting in detail and I'll take that up if you think it's a priority.
1954437;1575541276;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-03 18:05:46 dorion_road: as it turns out, it seems to my eye that it'd suit you well, given, e.g., the low level firmware work you're doing. do you want it ?
1954438;1575541537;spyked;also otoh, I'm not entirely sure custom biosen/chips are the way to go, since they require a fair amount of reverse engineering, which is usually a massive time sink. it'd certainly be an interesting research project, but it's not something I'd make the delivery of tmsr-os depend on.
1954439;1575545819;mircea_popescu; it's only interesting because it's how "bake own hardware" eventually starts ; sure as fuck can't have anything stalled on it.
1954440;1575559885;diana_coman;!!up dorion_road
1954441;1575559886;deedbot;dorion_road voiced for 30 minutes.
1954442;1575560104;dorion_road;ty diana_coman.
1954443;1575560240;dorion_road;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-05#1954366 << thank you for the update, sorry to hear you're under the weather. I hope you're able to rest up and recover. I look forward to the discussion!
1954444;1575560240;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-05 05:49:41 spyked: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-02#1954056 <-- apologies for the radio silence. I've been down with a nasty stomach flu the last few days. I'll catch up with the discussion in the next coupla days and I'll give my take on bios/bootloader ownership
1954445;1575560326;dorion_road;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-05#1954369 << interesting to know on the SeaBIOS experience, what'd you do with that ?
1954446;1575560326;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-05 06:29:20 spyked: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-03#1954183 <-- ftr, I'm not especially familiar with coreboot, though I've swimmed for a while in the SeaBIOS code a couple of years ago. but otoh the uefi 1/2 cleavage is worth studying and documenting in detail and I'll take that up if you think it's a priority.
1954447;1575560411;dorion_road;the uefi 1/2 cleavage is a priority crevice to map in detail.
1954448;1575560515;dorion_road;how about you outline your first steps there in the plan you'll be publishing saturday ?
1954449;1575561057;dorion_road;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-05#1954371 << I agree reversing chips is not a dependency of tmsr-os. My [http://dorion-mode.com/2019/11/implementing-tmsr-os/?b=Does%20Coreboot&e=big%20win#select][thought process] there is it's an optional package.
1954450;1575561057;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-05 06:33:41 spyked: also otoh, I'm not entirely sure custom biosen/chips are the way to go, since they require a fair amount of reverse engineering, which is usually a massive time sink. it'd certainly be an interesting research project, but it's not something I'd make the delivery of tmsr-os depend on.
1954451;1575561083;dorion_road;While there must be a bootloader to run tmsr-os, Coreboot need not be utilized on a system, even if that system is already [https://coreboot.org/status/board-status.html][supported by Coreboot].
1954452;1575561213;dorion_road;With that being said, BIOS auditability and integrity is a key piece of the pie and someone owning it and adding configs for the set of supported boards would be a win to my eye.
1954453;1575561606;dorion_road;spyked et. al, is ^ that a sensible approach to you ?
1954454;1575561698;diana_coman;!!up dorion_road
1954455;1575561698;deedbot;dorion_road voiced for 30 minutes.
1954456;1575562311;dorion_road;It occurred to me this morning, this tmsr-os project could be utilized medium to long term in both [http://trilema.com/2013/in-which-life-moves-on/#footnote_9_48565][lifetime support consultancy] and [http://trilema.com/2012/probably-the-hottest-business-idea-of-the-moment-in-btc/][the hottest business idea in btc] (code review and code insurance) ventures.
1954457;1575562570;dorion_road;I haven't developed it very far past what's in those articles and what we've done to develop [http://dorion-mode.com/2019/11/jwrd-computing-the-why-how-what-and-way-forward/][JWRD], but seems like there is a medium to long term [http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-05-17#1914461][profit center] to establish.
1954458;1575562570;ossabot;Logged on 2019-05-17 19:17:54 trinque: republic is scant of profit centers
1954459;1575563036;dorion_road;life's too short to [http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-03-04#1900385][salt mine for idiots] any longer than you have to.
1954460;1575563037;ossabot;Logged on 2019-03-04 16:14:16 mircea_popescu: empire does not in any factual sense exist. man who works 70% of the time for idiots is === the remaining 30% of that man.
1954461;1575564244;mircea_popescu;in other "lulz", in the sense that koch & co are so fucking evil it boggles the mind : gpg has an ascii armored mode, which however contains no error recovery.
1954462;1575564321;mircea_popescu;so koch-gpg is, out of the box, worse than useless for archival : tar / zip / etc as they exist on unix-likes are fucked in the head enough such that if there's a byte error, either the remainder of the archive or the bytes past that one in the list are lost ; but this can be mitigated at least by having multiple copies. gpg however, multiple copies are equally useless, if none make it intact the contents is lost, because
1954463;1575564321;mircea_popescu;well, different bytestreams.
1954464;1575564350;mircea_popescu;the WHOLE FUCKING POINT of "armored" mode is to armor it, you're not wasting those 40% extra bytes just for the sake of wasting them wtf.
1954465;1575564415;mircea_popescu;it's high fucking time for a ~comprehensive~ archival-and-encryption util that handles compression, encryption ~and error redundancy~!!!! correctly.
1954466;1575564499;mircea_popescu;i must know, at the end of its run a) that it optimally used the bytespace by wringing out periodicity in the input ; b) that only the designated keys can ever get the input back out and c) that a specific set of occurences will not harm the contents. such as "two consecutive lost bytes once ; AND six independent lost bytes". or w/e it is. set percentually or w/e.
1954467;1575564530;mircea_popescu;this is ~all~ obviously crypto-matter (which'd explain why the forefuckwits managed it so poorly -- crypto is like the intellectual antithesis of moronman)
1954468;1575566385;feedbot;http://qntra.net/2019/12/vpn-breaking-zero-day-effective-against-many-nix-systems-burned/ << Qntra -- VPN Breaking Zero Day Effective Against Many *nix Systems Burned
1954469;1575566401;BingoBoingo;^ In other lulz
1954470;1575566426;BingoBoingo;!!seen zx2c4
1954471;1575566431;deedbot;2018/11/30 04:54:33 My "nice post" remark wasnt sarcastic, if thats what youre responding to
1954472;1575566541;BingoBoingo;[http://trilema.com/2014/the-public-burning-of-bob-beck/][The whole "we're going to Microsoft better than Microsoft] crowd seems to have been caught prone in the field this time.
1954473;1575567805;mircea_popescu;and every other time
1954474;1575567903;mircea_popescu;"I orignally listed CentOS as being vulnerable
1954475;1575567904;mircea_popescu;to the attack, but this was incorrect, at least regarding IPv4" << the moneyshot there.
1954476;1575568264;BingoBoingo;We appear to be first outside of the mailing list on this, so taking a bit of time to try spreading
1954477;1575568510;mircea_popescu;jfw's been a busy boy, has he!
1954478;1575568619;BingoBoingo;jfw has indeed. Publishing quite the treasure trove. The jfw/dorion pairing seems to be a great benefit to the both of them.
1954479;1575569904;diana_coman;well, they have actually developed a partnership that works, certainly.
1954480;1575583704;*;BingoBoingo finally applying to places in Buquebus range (also Missouri en Argentina del Norte). Trying not to hold "No querés re-activar tu proyecto de venta de servicios web? Nosotros para ayudarte podemos ofrecerte el servicio sin costo inicialmente..." against them.
1954481;1575583894;feedbot;http://bvt-trace.net/2019/12/keccak-hashing-for-kernel-rng/ << bvt's backtrace -- Keccak Hashing for Kernel RNG
1954482;1575623197;spyked;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-05#1954376 <-- tyvm dorion_road! yup, I'll add uefi study to saturday's plan, the first step I have in mind is providing some context/rationale and making an estimate of how much the study and mapping process is going to take.
1954483;1575623197;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-05 11:45:25 dorion_road: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-05#1954366 << thank you for the update, sorry to hear you're under the weather. I hope you're able to rest up and recover. I look forward to the discussion!
1954484;1575623345;spyked;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-05#1954378 <-- it was part of a study on (or rather using) qemu, to figure out how whatever software runs in SMM interacts with the OS at boot/run-time. unfortunately it got piled under a bunch of other work and I never got it published.
1954485;1575623346;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-05 11:46:51 dorion_road: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-05#1954369 << interesting to know on the SeaBIOS experience, what'd you do with that ?
1954486;1575623518;spyked;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-05#1954385 <-- so the idea here is that whoever wants to tmsrize their box can also get help replacing their heathen bios/firmware with a V-ified coreboot? this is the business proposition that I'm seeing atm.
1954487;1575623519;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-05 12:01:38 dorion_road: With that being said, BIOS auditability and integrity is a key piece of the pie and someone owning it and adding configs for the set of supported boards would be a win to my eye.
1954488;1575634262;feedbot;http://ossasepia.com/2019/12/06/cutting-through-the-tangles-notes-on-graphics-in-eulora-vii/ << Ossa Sepia -- Cutting through the Tangles (Notes on Graphics in Eulora, VII)
1954489;1575650844;BingoBoingo;!!up dorion_road
1954490;1575650845;deedbot;dorion_road voiced for 30 minutes.
1954491;1575650900;dorion_road;ty BingoBoingo.
1954492;1575650933;dorion_road;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-06#1954415 << cool, sounds like a good first step.
1954493;1575650933;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-06 05:14:46 spyked: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-05#1954376 <-- tyvm dorion_road! yup, I'll add uefi study to saturday's plan, the first step I have in mind is providing some context/rationale and making an estimate of how much the study and mapping process is going to take.
1954494;1575651020;dorion_road;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-06#1954417 << the SMM interaction with OS is an important branch of study/understanding to my eye. publishing what you have may become a priority down the line, so it's good to know you have that experience.
1954495;1575651021;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-06 05:17:15 spyked: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-05#1954378 <-- it was part of a study on (or rather using) qemu, to figure out how whatever software runs in SMM interacts with the OS at boot/run-time. unfortunately it got piled under a bunch of other work and I never got it published.
1954496;1575651090;dorion_road;In my brush up of, now wtf again is SMM ? this morning, I referred to an old [http://www.rcollins.org/ddj/Jan97/Jan97.html][article] by [http://www.rcollins.org/][robert. r. collins] on the topic. He's new to me, but CV looks impressive, anyone here come across him ?
1954497;1575651131;dorion_road;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-06#1954419 << there are a couple layers to my thinking. the idea started from the basis that I'm compiling and installing the bios on whatever hardware I'm using using for a trb node, tmsr-pgp, etc.
1954498;1575651131;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-06 05:20:08 spyked: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-05#1954385 <-- so the idea here is that whoever wants to tmsrize their box can also get help replacing their heathen bios/firmware with a V-ified coreboot? this is the business proposition that I'm seeing atm.
1954499;1575651158;dorion_road;I'm sure many people here are doing that as well, these logs are where I first learned about it, afterall.
1954500;1575651237;dorion_road;If a [http://trilema.com/2012/probably-the-hottest-business-idea-of-the-moment-in-btc/?b=Full%20process%20insurance#select][full process insurance] business can be derived from tmsr.os in the longer term, I'd expect the bios to be included (assuming bios as it's now referred is part of the end process).
1954501;1575651292;dorion_road;In the immediate term, Corebootable machines are part of the [http://dorion-mode.com/2019/11/jwrd-computing-the-why-how-what-and-way-forward/?b=Computer%20Hardware#select][consulting package] jfw and I are offering clients.
1954502;1575651360;dorion_road;a V-ified cooreboot will provide more leverage in increasing hardware coverage. if a patron wants to sponsor the owner (or anyone else from his WoT) to expand the hardware coverage, having it V-ified forms a good foundation as I see it.
1954503;1575651474;dorion_road;With that being said, the operator ought not ~have~ to use coreboot to run tmsr.os since so much extant hardware has yet to be liberated from vendor control of the bios.
1954504;1575651794;dorion_road;to summarize then, having coreboot owned, even with minimal hardware coverage to start, provides a long term incentive to have this key piece well covered.
1954505;1575651848;dorion_road;am I making sense or missing any important points ?
1954506;1575652096;dorion_road;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-04#1954338 << on the one hand, there is other work to be done aside from writting code, but on the other hand, portage/emerge/ebuild system is [http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-04#1954342][python].
1954507;1575652096;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-04 22:32:39 lobbes: though tbh, this whole experience makes me think that maybe computers just ain't my thing. Perhaps I ought to think about BingoBoingo's writing for Qntra course a little more instead of this TMSR OS project
1954508;1575652096;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-04 22:49:59 lobbes: and even then, it has always been 'soft computering' like reporting, sql queries, excel jockying, etc. The only programming language I really know is python (and that I've only ever used here in tmsr)
1954509;1575652243;dorion_road;while I understand you wanted to the logging project to go smoother, but you were also picking up a new langauge for the job.
1954510;1575654168;BingoBoingo;!!up dorion_road
1954511;1575654169;deedbot;dorion_road voiced for 30 minutes.
1954512;1575658865;feedbot;http://qntra.net/2019/12/oracle-sues-us-department-of-labor-over-existence-of-administrative-courts/ << Qntra -- Oracle Sues US Department Of Labor Over Existence Of "Administrative Courts"
1954513;1575660146;feedbot;http://trilema.com/2019/digging-through-archives-yields-lulz-shall-we-call-it/ << Trilema -- Digging through archives yields... lulz, shall we call it ?
1954514;1575675256;lobbes;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-06#1954439 << this is true. I've given it some reflection, and I'm going to go ahead and commit to diving into the ebuilds.
1954515;1575675256;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-06 13:16:27 dorion_road: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-04#1954338 << on the one hand, there is other work to be done aside from writting code, but on the other hand, portage/emerge/ebuild system is [http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-04#1954342][python].
1954516;1575675258;lobbes;My root issue is really that I [http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-04#1954358][haven't been optimizing for the best case] in general. Completely separate from that is the issue of my general computer illiteracy. Both of these I can work to cure via diving into ebuilds, so I'll hold steady on this course I reckon
1954517;1575675259;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-04 23:02:02 mircea_popescu: it's [http://trilema.com/2015/the-downtrodden-are-downtrodden-for-a-reason-step-on-their-faces/?b=Old%20age&e=treachery#select][this sorta thing] that gets you bloody.
1954518;1575698655;feedbot;http://trilema.com/2019/the-momentary-dusk-of-reason-or-the-world-as-a-received-trigrammaton/ << Trilema -- The momentary dusk of reason ; or the world as a received trigrammaton.
1954519;1575709155;spyked;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-06#1954435 <-- I'm not convinced it will, tbh. atm buying an existing corebootable board is a much cheaper alternative (for gpg at least) than supporting a new one, on account of http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-05#1954371 ; might work on the long term when the supplies for e.g. x60 will be exhausted, but even then, trying to make sense of closed t
1954520;1575709155;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-06 13:04:11 dorion_road: a V-ified cooreboot will provide more leverage in increasing hardware coverage. if a patron wants to sponsor the owner (or anyone else from his WoT) to expand the hardware coverage, having it V-ified forms a good foundation as I see it.
1954521;1575709156;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-05 06:33:41 spyked: also otoh, I'm not entirely sure custom biosen/chips are the way to go, since they require a fair amount of reverse engineering, which is usually a massive time sink. it'd certainly be an interesting research project, but it's not something I'd make the delivery of tmsr-os depend on.
1954522;1575709161;spyked;urds is gruesome (read: both very risky and time-consuming) enough that doing it once will shift the business towards [http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-05#1954372][tmsr hardware]
1954523;1575709161;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-05 07:45:04 mircea_popescu: it's only interesting because it's how "bake own hardware" eventually starts ; sure as fuck can't have anything stalled on it.
1954524;1575709240;spyked;anyway, I'ma sit on this thread for a while, will focus on getting uefi disentangled for now
1954525;1575728922;BingoBoingo;spyked: My suspicion is that the cost of acquiring a TMSRbootable board is almost aways going to beat supporting new hardware, unless the new hardware is *very* interesting.
1954526;1575733837;*;spyked will admit he doesn't even know how reverse engineering costs can be estimated, most likely due to lack of experience. will ask around, maybe someone in the field can give an idea
1954527;1575734070;*;BingoBoingo just assuming hardware is cheaper than directed hands on a task
1954528;1575734229;spyked;indeed, there's that
1954529;1575735660;feedbot;http://thetarpit.org/2019/work-plan-for-m12-2019 << The Tar Pit -- Work plan for (the rest of) M12 2019
1954530;1575741087;BingoBoingo;!!rate jfw 3 Met in person. We rolled servers on the rambla.
1954531;1575741088;deedbot;Get your OTP: http://paste.deedbot.org/?id=xFuC
1954532;1575741117;BingoBoingo;!!v05217138296E46388B1AB35AE1FED6079D09768697130BAD7C98A28B80D62CA9
1954533;1575741128;BingoBoingo;!!v 05217138296E46388B1AB35AE1FED6079D09768697130BAD7C98A28B80D62CA9
1954534;1575741129;deedbot;BingoBoingo rated jfw 3 << Met in person. We rolled servers on the rambla.
1954535;1575751855;*;mp_en_viaje waves
1954536;1575752295;diana_coman;hello mp_en_viaje
1954537;1575752309;mp_en_viaje;this spyked discussion's something the fuck else lmao.
1954538;1575752452;mp_en_viaje;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-07#1954463 << ahaha beautiful. how was i t?
1954539;1575752452;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-07 13:59:44 BingoBoingo: !!rate jfw 3 Met in person. We rolled servers on the rambla.
1954540;1575752468;*;mp_en_viaje shall go impress some fucktoys now, bbl.
1954541;1575752543;BingoBoingo;mp_en_viaje: Going well. Prepping drives for hammer time right now.
1954542;1575763642;BingoBoingo;Breaking down the Pizarro disks we discovered... Some platters don't shatter
1954543;1575763971;BingoBoingo;As in all of the platters from the few spinnign rust drives in the rack. After having been sanded they are soaking in a Tomato+ColaBlack sauce on the camp stove.
1954544;1575763986;BingoBoingo;Heavy on the salt.
1954545;1575768693;feedbot;http://qntra.net/2019/12/saudi-air-force-lieutenant-shoots-up-naval-air-station-pensacola/ << Qntra -- Saudi Air Force Lieutenant Shoots Up Naval Air Station Pensacola
1954546;1575771115;trinque; /join #asciilifeform
1954547;1575771120;trinque;lol, whoops!
1954548;1575775358;BingoBoingo;Report on the local kids: small but slowly growing crowd where crowds normally grow on the Rambla. One 'Republicana' Police tank parked near the Montevideo sign. At least one helicopter flying low and angrily sweeping its spotlight all over with no apparent purpose other than to "be seen". Several pairs of motorcycle cops riding along the side streets, also likely with the "be seen" mission. The amount of kids present in the spot
1954549;1575775358;BingoBoingo;drawing attention is typical of a Thursday night at this hour. Meanwhile a number of the smaller forgettable plaza have above average, but still unimpresive crowds.
1954550;1575811850;mp_en_viaje;oh gmorning
1954551;1575811898;mp_en_viaje;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-07#1954475 << o wow really ? what, moved on from glass-ceramic into metal ?!
1954552;1575811898;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-07 20:15:41 BingoBoingo: Breaking down the Pizarro disks we discovered... Some platters don't shatter
1954553;1575811971;BingoBoingo;mp_en_viaje: Aluminum. Apparently looking into it, aluminum platters are not rare.
1954554;1575811994;mp_en_viaje;oh
1954555;1575812006;mp_en_viaje;i thought for a moment they did that artificial nacre thing
1954556;1575812018;BingoBoingo;They dented.
1954557;1575812047;mp_en_viaje;meanwhile in keks, https://www.technologyreview.com/s/614842/china-us-ai-military-spending/
1954558;1575812314;BingoBoingo;lol, they'll talk about anything but the missile gap that matters
1954559;1575812367;mp_en_viaje;"oh, we were worried china outspends us on $random-nonsense-we-made-up-specifically-so-as-to-have-it-all-to-ourselves" "why were you worried about that ?" "so we have somtething to talk about" "ah, okay"
1954560;1575812419;mp_en_viaje;i know some rural dumb cunts very much like the us. nobody outspends them on kerngknekjvsdfks.
1954561;1575812430;mp_en_viaje;in fact, nobody even heard of it. nobody ELSE.
1954562;1575812821;diana_coman;as I ended up doing a long log-crawl on v-matters because [http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-11-30#1953907][it's still bugging me], I found several discussions on spaces vs tabs but overall I can't tell what the current conclusion is on this: does anyone know?
1954563;1575812822;ossabot;Logged on 2019-11-30 12:34:56 diana_coman: mircea_popescu: trouble is that it's *not* development that is painful-er, not at all; it's...publishing that is painfuller and I doubt that has any merits.
1954564;1575834696;mp_en_viaje;diana_coman, i still believe
1954565;1575834713;mp_en_viaje;\t should be used for tabulature and \s for individual spaces.
1954566;1575834899;mp_en_viaje;forced-size tabs are stupid, because maybe i want the tab displayed as eight, or maybe i want mine displayed as two. it's not something that should be fixed at write-time, much like paragraph flow is to be decided when the paragrap
1954567;1575834905;mp_en_viaje;'s displayed.
1954568;1575834972;diana_coman;mp_en_viaje: do you mean the vpatch should contain literally "\s" or what?
1954569;1575835030;mp_en_viaje;no, \s is not ambiguous, it can only mean " ". for the same money you
1954570;1575835042;mp_en_viaje;re not held to replace all * with &ask; or wjhatever.
1954571;1575835079;diana_coman;some people space code with \t precisely in the idea that you can set it to whatever you want it to be; others with spaces; and looking back through those discussions it seems to go one way and then the other and overall I have no idea if there was some conclusion to this or it remained up to each vpatch author or whatevers.
1954572;1575835089;mp_en_viaje;however tabs can ONLY be described as \t. a succession of spaces IS NOT a tab. only \t is a tab. a succession of spaces is a succession of spaces, even if "it looks the same" on some particular hw-sw combo
1954573;1575835098;diana_coman;well yes, ofc.
1954574;1575835136;mp_en_viaje;i was firmly on the \t ; asciilifeform did not like it, wanted to do the dumb thing. ~nobody else said much on the topic, and he quashed discussion with "who's gonna fix all the dumb code already written by all the other dumb people"
1954575;1575835145;mp_en_viaje;at which point i gave up that line.
1954576;1575835145;diana_coman;indeed, \t or space, no other option exists really.
1954577;1575835216;mp_en_viaje;i expect the discussion still stands now as then : you can either do the sane thing or the dumb thing ; doing the sane thing's burdened by the anal child argument that indeed a lot of dumbasses have already been permitted to shit into the discussion
1954578;1575835306;mp_en_viaje;indeed it seems to me one who's not capable to on his own mental power discover how to use the button over the caps lock and the button between the alts when first given a computer is also, and for that archsufficient reason, not qualified to ever touch one, or be included in any computer anything.
1954579;1575835307;diana_coman;myeah; honestly, reviewing the whole V-stuff, the part that bugs me most turns around exactly this sort of thing: the core idea as I see it was that "code is text" and therefore it should be discussed and read and undersigned and referenced and all that intertextuality and context and all; in practice there are the vtools providing some of the mechanics, there's a spread of discussions going every which way and otherwise there's rather ...
1954580;1575835313;diana_coman;... too much silence.
1954581;1575835334;mp_en_viaje;sadly.
1954582;1575835365;diana_coman;mp_en_viaje: I don't know re that as such; ie I don't mind it either way, whether \t or space, I don't see it as a huge problem.
1954583;1575835372;diana_coman;or a problem at all really.
1954584;1575835385;mp_en_viaje;it isn't a huge problem, which is why it wasn't particularly resolved, then. or i guess now. or ever be
1954585;1575835391;mp_en_viaje;but since you asked...
1954586;1575835411;diana_coman;the \t thing is at times annoying because the key is also mapped to other stuff but that is arguably a matter of "set the workbench so it's not"
1954587;1575835432;mp_en_viaje;for that matter, running strings over the output of one bringing up lots and lots of gggg pppp rrrrrrrr etc suggests monkley rather than man involvement.
1954588;1575835442;mp_en_viaje;much like all the ooga-booga languages are suspect, and so on.
1954589;1575835493;mp_en_viaje;lotta windows users are like that, most of their keyboard usage is repetitive pressings on the same key. which is i suppose how people even came up with the "hey, make the screen a single button and be done with it" next node of "improvement"
1954590;1575835546;diana_coman;hm, maybe.
1954591;1575835669;mp_en_viaje;the other node of the argument, to be perfectly fair, is that a lang editor that ~doesn't~ auto-tabulate is thereby broken ; and perhaps the case stands that a language wherein this can't be done -- is also broken.
1954592;1575835697;mp_en_viaje;seems that he also said something along these lines, making the man-maintained space-tab distinction a bit of a monkeyism itself.
1954593;1575835731;diana_coman;eh, let me hereby inform the forum that in my current investigations of v-tronicity, I have managed therefore to crash (repeatedly!) the nano editor! with SIGFPE, arithmetic exception!
1954594;1575835744;mp_en_viaje;wut did you do ?!
1954595;1575835808;diana_coman;opened up a vpatch from a dir eg nano -wF patches/some.vpatch and then from inside attempted to open another vpatch that was however in dir "a" - apparently it crashes; I did not yet spend more time to find out exactly why/where/how.
1954596;1575835830;diana_coman;but yeah, talking of editors...
1954597;1575835863;diana_coman;it's the first time I manage to crash nano like this but I suppose it won't be the last time.
1954598;1575835905;mp_en_viaje;you should probably write this up ; i'd like to reproduce for one thing and no, i never had nano crash yet.
1954599;1575835972;diana_coman;by now I have stuff to write up, down and every other way really.
1954600;1575836016;mp_en_viaje;heh.
1954601;1575836059;mp_en_viaje;meanwhile in "pantyhose sucks, do yourself a favour an' never wear it" documentation, http://archive.is/hWIaV/d3066736bfbd35e181880f20964f02c879e7d9b2.jpg
1954602;1575836541;mp_en_viaje;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-08#1954513 << this is not a problem peculiar to that particular corner, either. people who write, write. people who don't write, don't write. the two aren't really the same thing, you can give some rope so type-1 individuals finding themselves in a type-2 tradition renounce and extricate themselves. but that's about as far as it goes.
1954603;1575836541;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-08 16:10:17 diana_coman: ... too much silence.
1954604;1575836633;mp_en_viaje;the [http://trilema.com/2019/the-momentary-dusk-of-reason-or-the-world-as-a-received-trigrammaton/?b=One%20letter&e=stands#select][unexamined]/[http://trilema.com/2019/the-momentary-dusk-of-reason-or-the-world-as-a-received-trigrammaton/?b=Another%20letter&e=stands#select][rationalized] life still delivers at the end the same exact death.
1954605;1575836754;diana_coman;maybe; to my eye there is also the annoying layer of "oh, I'm too busy writing about MY stuff to read (as in properly review and/or sign) other people's stuff.
1954606;1575836793;diana_coman;basically code literacy has still quite a way to go or something.
1954607;1575836841;mp_en_viaje;conceivably usage should be the regulator of that
1954608;1575836864;mp_en_viaje;but yes, code literacy is as novel a concept now as it was in knuth's time, as it was in 600 ad.
1954609;1575836944;mp_en_viaje;incidentally : the oldest... trackway, shall we call it ? in the world was in use since 600 bc to about the first century. it permitted boats to cross the isthmus of corinth, it was maintained and operated for the general public like any other tramway.
1954610;1575836961;diana_coman;waterway?
1954611;1575836963;mp_en_viaje;then the concept took a hiatus for a good baker's dozen centuries.
1954612;1575836988;mp_en_viaje;diana_coman, no, the isthmus is landmass. it was basically wooden railroad.
1954613;1575837023;diana_coman;oh, they moved the boats on that? I thought they had some part to flood for the purpose or something (because yes, isthmus is landmass)
1954614;1575837030;mp_en_viaje;the loads guided with separate pin/groove arrangements, rather than the familiar wheel retainers, and the thing built out of wood. but, historically, a TRAIN refers to a horse-drawn wagon arrangement.
1954615;1575837064;mp_en_viaje;diana_coman, nope, involved no flooding. just dragged the damned things over specially made, elevated... rail.
1954616;1575837073;diana_coman;I see.
1954617;1575837101;mp_en_viaje;(originally, these were wood, both in collieries and otherwise. then metal sheeting was added on top, to reduce wear / improve friction. then to deal with the buckle, the rail became all-metal.)
1954618;1575837114;mp_en_viaje;the greeks didn't have metal casting so never did that.
1954619;1575837158;mp_en_viaje;anyway, back to the point : who knows, given all the passive resistance, code literacy may even have to wait 1500-3500-wharever years.
1954620;1575837306;diana_coman;or it gets pushed first and it becomes the new fashion, "was there any other way??"
1954621;1575837421;mp_en_viaje;fwis all these apparent successes have hidden economic counters underneath that are often not understood until a long time passes.
1954622;1575837491;mp_en_viaje;consider if you will the case of sir thomas bouch, referenced to relatively little effect in [http://trilema.com/2019/the-alleged-crisis-of-the-supposed-engineering-or-mistaken-identities-pantomiming-a-comedy-of-manners/#comment-132545][the recent engineering discussion].
1954623;1575837521;mp_en_viaje;this fellow was a bright sixteen year old, who took an apprenticeship in the hot thing of the time, the one happening place for bright young minds : metalworking.
1954624;1575837540;mp_en_viaje;he didn't remain in liverpool, but he returned home, and with a merry gang of equally enthusiastic entrepreneurs an' worldchangers he set out to... change the world.
1954625;1575837561;mp_en_viaje;which they did -- at the time the first bridge over the tay was proposed (by him), everyone thought it madness.
1954626;1575837639;mp_en_viaje;a decaded and change later, after the queen (victoria!) was driven over water on the result of that madness, she liked it enough to declare it fundamentally constituent and relevant part of her kingdom (different from the realm she ruled, much like one's wife is different from the woman living in his house, as a product of directed imagination, a projection of reason). he was knighted as a side-effect of this.
1954627;1575837684;mp_en_viaje;then once that bridge fell, all sorts of "unsympathetic" "expert" witnesses, who were in fact younger men, ~of the coming generation~, and who in fact did get to re-build all the things he either built or designed, had things to say.
1954628;1575837708;mp_en_viaje;it was not self-evident at the time, to the participants, that ALL they had to say reduced to "we are younger men, and you are old. and it is our time to enthuse"
1954629;1575837787;diana_coman;hm; kind of got from young to old in 9 years though
1954630;1575837797;mp_en_viaje;which it was. but neither bouch, nor anyone else "accused" or "under suspicion" during the proceedings -- all of them his friends, incidentally, the gilkes making dubious passive-agressive comments in the vein of "knowing how treacherous a thing cast iron is, but if an engineer gave me such a thing to make I should make it without question, believing that he had apportioned the strength properly" had been his partner for thirty years at t
1954631;1575837797;mp_en_viaje;hat time. the things they built, that were ALL THE THINGS BUILT, they built together.
1954632;1575837815;mp_en_viaje;diana_coman, from young to old in the thirty years between 20 and 50, actually.
1954633;1575837852;mp_en_viaje;my point being : gilkes DIED BANKRUPT. it's not that bouch "did the bad", that he "left the sacred principles of good engineering behind". if this he did -- what did gilkes do, leave the "sacred principles of businessmanship behind ?"
1954634;1575837870;diana_coman;hm, I took 9 years from 1870 (bridge building started in 1871) to 1879 (bridge collapsed one year after opening)
1954635;1575837871;mp_en_viaje;there was economy underneath, yes, but not the kind the naive want to make it out.
1954636;1575837888;mp_en_viaje;diana_coman, a yes, that. but by the time someone would venture money in 71, they had been extremely successful for 20 years.
1954637;1575837918;mp_en_viaje;so successful in fact they altered the public space significantly, like after some guy from nigeria wom the olympics all nigerian kids were now swimmers or w/e
1954638;1575837960;diana_coman;ah, that certainly (for both successful for 20 years and the gilkes part, sure)
1954639;1575837986;mp_en_viaje;anyway, the situation bears striking similarity to the case of [http://trilema.com/2012/in-sfirsit-avem-ocazia-sa-ne-scapam-de-tiganimea-din-cimpia-dunarii/#comment-87068][the "patriotic" apuseni thieves].
1954640;1575838031;mp_en_viaje;the bridge, contrary to what kids would love to believe, and their mothers prefer to pretend for expediency's sake, did not hold or fall because of what bouch said, or did.
1954641;1575838047;mp_en_viaje;man's impact on the world surroundant's a lot less manifest than that.
1954642;1575838180;diana_coman;hm, the bridge was his folly in that he should have retired while not yet "the old one, it's time for us"?
1954643;1575838197;mp_en_viaje;and that'd have delivered... what ?
1954644;1575838214;mp_en_viaje;i honestly do not thing he should've anything, besides perhaps not be surprised, like in that old ro joke.
1954645;1575838226;diana_coman;presumably his pension, nothing more.
1954646;1575838227;mp_en_viaje;i do not believe he did anything undefensible at any point, let alone culpable.
1954647;1575838234;diana_coman;but yes, essentially not being surprised, indeed.
1954648;1575838234;mp_en_viaje;they didn't have pensions back then iirc.
1954649;1575838263;diana_coman;whatever, his keeping the title or something.
1954650;1575838308;mp_en_viaje;(the joke : don't think ; but if you must think don't say ; but if you say at least don't write ; and if you write do not sign. but if you sign -- don't be surprised)
1954651;1575838347;mp_en_viaje;diana_coman, the queen didn't take it back anwyays, iirc.
1954652;1575838369;diana_coman;iirc he also died quite soon after that so he was truly done anyway, there is that.
1954653;1575838383;mp_en_viaje;he WAS surprised.
1954654;1575838421;diana_coman;aha; hence: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-08#1954580
1954655;1575838421;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-08 16:58:58 diana_coman: but yes, essentially not being surprised, indeed.
1954656;1575838430;mp_en_viaje;much like ceausescu, you know ? there he finds himself, among young men for once. for once in a logn while. and he still, he doesn't quite see how it'll go. he's surrprised by the chain of events. i dunno, seems fucking obvious.
1954657;1575838463;mp_en_viaje;a lot more becomes obvious once one turns off the elohim caliban wordmakin' rattle
1954658;1575838501;diana_coman;basically not realising that "not my time anymore" -> http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-08#1954575
1954659;1575838502;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-08 16:58:04 diana_coman: hm, the bridge was his folly in that he should have retired while not yet "the old one, it's time for us"?
1954660;1575838518;mp_en_viaje;basically
1954661;1575838530;mp_en_viaje;though i dunno he should retire. i suspect he should take teenaged fucktoys.
1954662;1575838555;diana_coman;that's *also* retirement!
1954663;1575838568;mp_en_viaje;it helps if one doesn't attempt to simultaneously live and exist within a "society", ie a list of bad "no" answers to fundamental questions.
1954664;1575838576;mp_en_viaje;diana_coman, i suppose "he should've retired broadly construed".
1954665;1575838585;mp_en_viaje;but then again, everyone should do that. i started doing it in my 20s.
1954666;1575838594;mp_en_viaje;hard to not do it all the time, you know ?
1954667;1575838612;diana_coman;well, I always wanted to do that rather than anything else, what can I tell you.
1954668;1575838626;mp_en_viaje;lol
1954669;1575838717;mp_en_viaje;now, much like "engineering" is the supposed "thing sir bouch betrayed", that a) only exists retrospectively and b) only can be constructed by young men
1954670;1575838777;mp_en_viaje;stands this http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-08#1954553 thing. it can only become such a thing a) retrospectively and b) through the working of authority. much like the imaginary "french resistence" in ww2.
1954671;1575838778;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-08 16:43:30 diana_coman: or it gets pushed first and it becomes the new fashion, "was there any other way??"
1954672;1575838796;mp_en_viaje;in reality, no such wonder existed. but in 1950, de gaulle was looking for legitimacy, and so a counterfit past was invented for him.
1954673;1575838813;diana_coman;well sure, how else
1954674;1575838814;mp_en_viaje;it wasn't much divergent from his own personal past ; but it was well divergent from everyone else's.
1954675;1575838820;mp_en_viaje;right.
1954676;1575838851;mp_en_viaje;"young men" aka men without history, that's what's there : you can only take for your own the past of another if you don't have much past of your own.
1954677;1575838910;mp_en_viaje;the pantsuit drive to cleave history from existence, incidentally, is a lot more successful a ploy than their derpy http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-08#1954492
1954678;1575838911;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-08 09:47:49 mp_en_viaje: "oh, we were worried china outspends us on $random-nonsense-we-made-up-specifically-so-as-to-have-it-all-to-ourselves" "why were you worried about that ?" "so we have somtething to talk about" "ah, okay"
1954679;1575839257;diana_coman;history is quite an expensive thing to have anyway.
1954680;1575839345;mp_en_viaje;and if you must have, at least don't sign
1954681;1575839360;diana_coman;aha.
1954682;1575839405;mp_en_viaje;meanwhile in everyday living, there's much more accessible rack-and-pinions. "don't write " " when you mean "\t", god damn it! and such
1954683;1575839507;diana_coman;ahaha; but yes, what's with all those hierogliphs anyway, slash and a bended sword!!
1954684;1575839516;diana_coman;bent*
1954685;1575839594;diana_coman;oh, it should be hieroglyphics too, pfft.
1954686;1575869859;*;mp_en_viaje has been re-reading this discussion in lieu of sleeping. there's a lot in there, and i fear not so greatly expressed.
1954687;1575869949;mp_en_viaje;the collation of the "[http://trilema.com/2019/the-alleged-crisis-of-the-supposed-engineering-or-mistaken-identities-pantomiming-a-comedy-of-manners/#comments][what is engineering]" discussion with [http://trilema.com/2014/on-the-superiority-of-monarchy-or-adnotations-to-why-the-worst-get-on-top/?b=history%20can%20readily&e=oath#select][ye olde observation] and all the many parts in their entrain colliding with the faux ethics of the preva
1954688;1575869950;mp_en_viaje;iling postmodernist religion
1954689;1575870005;mp_en_viaje;("scientism", or whatever you'd call the neoreformated creeds of [http://trilema.com/2016/please-stop-using-dns-already-and-other-considerations/#footnote_6_65060][the horde idiotic enough] to think itself free from belief)
1954690;1575870092;mp_en_viaje;does actually expose pretty much the entire buboe. except it's not a pretty sight, for one thing, and moreover "civilised" life as narrated by the pantsuit's simply not compatible with the observation.
1954691;1575870237;mp_en_viaje;nevertheless, i suspect a superior systematic set of answers to the main questions is on its way from there.
1954692;1575905988;BingoBoingo;!!up dorion_road
1954693;1575905988;deedbot;dorion_road voiced for 30 minutes.
1954694;1575906099;dorion_road;ty BingoBoingo
1954695;1575906208;dorion_road;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-07#1954452 << you make good points; I'll have to sit with the thread as well. I'm here to weigh the options and understand what makes sense.
1954696;1575906208;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-07 05:07:30 spyked: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-06#1954435 <-- I'm not convinced it will, tbh. atm buying an existing corebootable board is a much cheaper alternative (for gpg at least) than supporting a new one, on account of http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-05#1954371 ; might work on the long term when the supplies for e.g. x60 will be exhausted, but even then, trying to make sense of closed t
1954697;1575906250;dorion_road;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-07#1954457 << I'm looking forward to the uefi disentanglement!
1954698;1575906250;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-07 05:08:56 spyked: anyway, I'ma sit on this thread for a while, will focus on getting uefi disentangled for now
1954699;1575906351;dorion_road;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-07#1954458 << I'd tend to agree with the suspicion. First I think it'd be helpful to know the cost of acquiring TMSR bootbable hardware. Defining was TMSR bootbale hardware means and listing the 'known good' board that are already supported by coreboot or similar would be a good start.
1954700;1575906351;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-07 10:36:59 BingoBoingo: spyked: My suspicion is that the cost of acquiring a TMSRbootable board is almost aways going to beat supporting new hardware, unless the new hardware is *very* interesting.
1954701;1575906382;dorion_road;s/was TMSR/what TMSR/
1954702;1575906455;dorion_road;The baseline consideration is, what is the ev of having the already known TMSR bootable bios configs under V ?
1954703;1575907829;BingoBoingo;!!up dorion_road
1954704;1575907830;deedbot;dorion_road voiced for 30 minutes.
1954705;1575908132;diana_coman;!!v EFA5B4EC77E9EA76D606034E512BF9ACBF5847CE756A6297D71C3B932A58B2C4
1954706;1575908132;deedbot;diana_coman rated dorion_road 1 << talking while travelling.
1954707;1575908248;diana_coman;dorion_road: ^ so you can !!up yourself at least while the old voice model is still around.
1954708;1575915868;dorion_road;ty diana_coman
1954709;1575915931;dorion_road;bvt I left a comment that's in your mod queue http://bvt-trace.net/2019/12/keccak-hashing-for-kernel-rng/comment-page-1/#comment-100
1954710;1575919720;dorion_road;spyked I left a comment that's in your mod queue http://thetarpit.org/2019/assorted-notes-on-bootstrapping-cuntoo#comment-188
1954711;1575922624;dorion_road;trinque you've been highlighted on a couple different tmsr os threads: bvt is curious about what you have to say on the extent to which the [http://bvt-trace.net/2019/11/yet-more-thoughts-about-tmsr-os-os-making-exam-taking/#footnote_0_58][bootstrapping/package management/development tools] are a source of bloat in Cuntoo.
1954712;1575922648;dorion_road;and spyked on the reasoning for the location of the kernel installation step in [http://thetarpit.org/2019/assorted-notes-on-bootstrapping-cuntoo#comment-181][the cuntoo bootstrapping] script.
1954713;1575922684;dorion_road;I'd like to know your thoughts as well. Not just about those, but, e.g. also [http://fixpoint.welshcomputing.com/2019/gales-linux-initial-release/][Gales Linux] now that it has been released. Gales bootstraps with busybox, which I know you've been [http://logs.ossasepia.com/log-search?q=from%3Atrinque+busybox&chan=trilema][working with].
1954714;1575922713;dorion_road;Generally, [http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-11-26#1953600][my question] about your availability to contribute to sorting out some of these early decisions remains of interest.
1954715;1575922714;ossabot;Logged on 2019-11-26 15:26:08 dorion_road: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-11-25#1953543 << Thank you for the luck wishes. What pace of engagement do you see yourself able to maintain over say, a 30-60 day stretch ?
1954716;1575923207;dorion_road;http://logs.ericbenevides.com/log/trilema/2019-11-27#1953688 << hey ave1, how goes ? have you been following along the tmsr os thread ? I've assumed you want to continue with your gcc work and own it, is that still the case ?
1954717;1575923208;ericbot;Logged on 2019-11-27 18:40:49 dorion_road: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-11-17#1951499 << hey ave1, how goes ? has there been a delivery date set on this ?
1954718;1575923208;ossabot;Logged on 2019-11-17 12:42:50 ave1: I was genesing it, and will continue to do so. But with feedback in the loop. So, for example, gcc comes with an old STL html documentation tree, can this be dropped? (I would say yes)
1954719;1575923248;dorion_road;let's shorten that feedback loop, eh ?
1954720;1575923349;mp_en_viaje;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-09#1954635 << wtf does "tmsr" mean if they're not in v, anyways ?
1954721;1575923349;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-09 11:56:03 dorion_road: The baseline consideration is, what is the ev of having the already known TMSR bootable bios configs under V ?
1954722;1575923487;mp_en_viaje;meanwhile from trilema arguably-useful spam, http://rdk.regionsv.ru/
1954723;1575923766;jurov;!!v EE90A999548111B06519A9A8AD79984DB0800E10D02C725BD51108CF7BF05ADB
1954724;1575923769;deedbot;jurov paid asciilifeform 1
1954725;1575923922;jurov;asciilifeform: sent you 1btc by mistake instead of invoice #1 pls return
1954726;1575923952;dorion_road;mp_en_viaje right, if tmsr, then bios to be ruled by V, in line with [http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-11-29#1953858][portgage] and all the rest. can still run tmsr os on hardware that's not tmsr bootable with bios build and install optional.
1954727;1575923952;ossabot;Logged on 2019-11-29 13:08:36 mircea_popescu: this 2 really goes all the way back to the proposed portage supremacy i nixed back in 2018 or w/e it was. NO, portage is not special cuntlet, NO, portage may not be more important than any other turd. V rules, portage obeys or goes away.
1954728;1575923958;mp_en_viaje;whoa, this rake actually got stepped on meanwhile ?!
1954729;1575924008;jurov;!!v E00B747223656E9160D26E9438DFA601519ADF0334AD00C77D062832A20B9349
1954730;1575924011;deedbot;jurov paid asciilifeform invoice 1
1954731;1575924044;mp_en_viaje;dorion_road, seems to me you're mixing things. yes, you can run a mercedes you bought on mud roads in your native tardikistan. no, it can't be a mercedes if it comes without a manual, or without standard parts, or if it violates any other fundamental assumptions implicit in the name.
1954732;1575924086;jurov;!!v 46983BD40E8A16C48CB82008135469486CA1BF9C4B88436C6D944DAE977957FC
1954733;1575924089;deedbot;jurov paid BingoBoingo invoice 17
1954734;1575924409;dorion_road;mp_en_viaje I was/am thinking of the bios software as one of the standard parts. if the operator doesn't want to use it, doesn't have to. for anyone that does, it's there to be used.
1954735;1575924440;dorion_road;ave1 [http://dorion-mode.com/2019/11/implementing-tmsr-os/#comment-51][the latest] on the gcc discussion is 4.4.7, 4.7.4 and 4.9.4 are up for consideration.
1954736;1575925030;mp_en_viaje;this is pretty much universally the case, yeah.
1954737;1575925353;dorion_road;mp_en_viaje thanks for helping me clarify.
1954738;1575925787;bvt;hello, i'll be traveling 14-20 dec and 5-10 jan; will be in low availability mode
1954739;1575925830;bvt;dorion_road: comment published and answered; i can do a test run of gales after returning (20 dec)
1954740;1575925854;mp_en_viaje;happy holidays, or how the ro for it goes, sarbautori fericite.
1954741;1575925914;mp_en_viaje;#fieca
1954742;1575926166;bvt;ty
1954743;1575926869;feedbot;http://qntra.net/2019/12/one-week-after-grave-vulnerability-revealed-wireguard-moving-into-linux-kernel-for-5-6/ << Qntra -- One Week After Grave Vulnerability Revealed, WireGuard Moving Into Linux Kernel For 5.6
1954744;1575926933;dorion_road;bvt thanks, sounds good!
1954745;1575927143;dorion_road;I'll be traveling dec 25-jan 6 with potentially good internet, but unknown at present; I'm going on a cruise. january 6th I'll be back in Panama.
1954746;1575927244;mp_en_viaje;meanwhile in other 60s lulz (since jfw 's memoirs prompted my sending intel on a digging expedition through the shockingly irrelevant microfractures of the us communist party mega-soviet outreach failure) : https://www.markrudd.com/
1954747;1575927286;dorion_road;I'll publish my december tmsr os plan by this thursday.
1954748;1575927287;mp_en_viaje;derpy dood who "went underground" for nothing in particular, got bored of it half decade in for you know, not making enough money, came back out and apologized, spent the next four decades trying to milk "it"
1954749;1575927450;mp_en_viaje;the "it" being the ~same it as for say [http://trilema.com/2017/party-monster/][the sad kids], self-hallucinated relevancy based on personal illiteracy, incuriosity &c americanskisms.
1954750;1575927457;mp_en_viaje;dorion_road, what, with old people ?!
1954751;1575927531;dorion_road;mp_en_viaje myeah, it's a family reunion. I agreed to go back in august.
1954752;1575927546;mp_en_viaje;well... best of luck.
1954753;1575927681;dorion_road;I can't say I'm very enthused, but looking to see the upside and get through it as productive as I can be. Getting back to Panama will be a relief for sure.
1954754;1575927715;mp_en_viaje;lol. so come back with a girlfriend over fifty, what can it hurt.
1954755;1575928454;diana_coman;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-09#1954679 - ahaha, complete with faq of multiple-lulz.
1954756;1575928454;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-09 17:42:34 mp_en_viaje: meanwhile in other 60s lulz (since jfw 's memoirs prompted my sending intel on a digging expedition through the shockingly irrelevant microfractures of the us communist party mega-soviet outreach failure) : https://www.markrudd.com/
1954757;1575928464;dorion_road;lol, we'll see.
1954758;1575928800;mp_en_viaje;diana_coman, he's not entirely wrong, either. his diagnosis is correct in at least that juncture : that radical pantsuits never got anywhere, 1960 - 2020, through the exact same mechanism : just as soon as they had two sticks to rub together, they'd get baited into confrontation with the establishment, cuz they're such great heroes & [http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2016-12-07#1579472][ilya muromets]' their name.
1954759;1575928801;ossabot;Logged on 2016-12-07 19:15:10 mircea_popescu: the whole story is decided at the onset - ARE you hero mc heroson ? yes ? then you go kill koschei. no ? then you don't. what do you mean "do what he did" ffs.
1954760;1575928846;mp_en_viaje;then it turned out the fantasyland ontologic approach to existence dun work irl, technology takes over and soon enough they had no name at all, let alone the RIGHT name.
1954761;1575928917;diana_coman;I had more fun with the "how to make a movement" , "going under cover" and all the "we are very serious(ly playing) here"
1954762;1575928946;mp_en_viaje;and then, to add insult to injury, all sort of nobodies on a stick (trump and obama have this exact [http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2017-08-11#1697164][whisk] in common, that as much as trump was an outsider laughingstock for the business community, obama was an outsider laughingstock for the counterculti/commies -- they're literally the same object in a structuralist perspective) ended up arbitrarily named in a purely nominative ex
1954763;1575928946;mp_en_viaje;ercise by the very koschei itself.
1954764;1575928947;ossabot;Logged on 2017-08-11 14:37:00 mircea_popescu: this is how it manages the inapproximable "whisks" of meaning that latin-style then has so much trouble noting down.
1954765;1575928967;mp_en_viaje;diana_coman, right ? boys who never ~could~ have >50yo girlfriends.
1954766;1575928984;diana_coman;ahahah, maybe he'll just be seasick and ...very productive at it!
1954767;1575929028;mp_en_viaje;more stark statement of youthful impotence as imanent ireelevancy besides this simple "oh, an older woman couldn't possibly ever kneel for you" i can't really imagine.
1954768;1575929097;mp_en_viaje;"why, you think dogfood tastes differrntly chewed with dentures ?!" "oh my!" "she still lives on this fucking planet, luke" "inconceiblablu!!!"
1954769;1575929379;mp_en_viaje;o btw BingoBoingo cunt-intel-pros santa also has a tidbit for you. did you know that in your native chicago a "larouche movement" chick made democratic ticket secretary of state (along with some others), and then adlai wouldn't run on the ticket with the nuts so he invented "solidarity party" which of course cost him the election -- but here's the morcel : until ~the day after the election~ the idiot press reported the defeated democratic
1954770;1575929379;mp_en_viaje;darlings ~were running unopposed~.
1954771;1575929429;diana_coman;mp_en_viaje: well, with age and lock-up knees, it might indeed be quite impossible she kneels for you, there is also that.
1954772;1575929441;mp_en_viaje;ie, "mainstream media" ineptitude wasn't invented this generation of tards. or the previous one. lazy moomoos ran that sideshow for at least forty years.
1954773;1575929480;mp_en_viaje;diana_coman, and she's gonna accept that, too, cuz that's how people are built from nature : sensible. women especially.
1954774;1575929492;mp_en_viaje;not that i've seen, not on this planet, but...
1954775;1575929493;mp_en_viaje;who knows.
1954776;1575929842;BingoBoingo;mp_en_viaje: lol, I knew adlai got sidelined, but it's been a while since I read into the how/why
1954777;1575929888;mp_en_viaje;turns out it's chicago-level lulzy.
1954778;1575930085;mp_en_viaje;https://larouchepub.com/spanish/boletines/2006/images/kesha_rogers1.jpg << lotta that actually.
1954779;1575930151;mp_en_viaje;https://larouchepub.com/spanish/other_articles/2019/1107-after-attack-on-culiacan.html << ahaha.
1954780;1575935019;mp_en_viaje;and speaking of us political fringe,
1954781;1575935022;mp_en_viaje;!!up tomaw
1954782;1575935023;deedbot;tomaw voiced for 30 minutes.
1954783;1575935037;mp_en_viaje;hey, are you the hopedale guy ?
1954784;1575942395;mp_en_viaje;i'm developing fucking insomnia ;/
1954785;1575944097;trinque;dorion_road: I dropped the cuntoo thing because I think it's idiocy to "ubuntu but totally in our own way and with moar fascism!1" or w/e. I'm not then going to turn around and help you build one.
1954786;1575944108;trinque;you're going to eat something that's bigger than your capacity to maintain and then what.
1954787;1575944127;mp_en_viaje;then build the capacity to maintain it.
1954788;1575944149;trinque;I can't say I agree with your approach either.
1954789;1575944155;trinque;"just do it" ?
1954790;1575944160;mp_en_viaje;i'm not sitting around to watch you play with age-adequate lego sets.
1954791;1575944202;mp_en_viaje;this is the adult table. grow big, or go raise your kids, whatever it is you do, there's no "let's sit and look at each other".
1954792;1575944238;trinque;what kids
1954793;1575944252;trinque;you have what you want, so I'll see myself out. lets leave it at that.
1954794;1575944254;mp_en_viaje;everyone runs into the same exact choices. all the time. always the same.
1954795;1575944274;mp_en_viaje;you're either going to make something new, or you're going to make something old. that's the choice.
1954796;1575944278;trinque;anyone wants to pick up these items I've built, I'll be more than happy to give them to him in working order.
1954797;1575944279;mp_en_viaje;the old thing is called kids.
1954798;1575950565;mp_en_viaje;yo spyked, how's the vomit business thsee days ?
1954799;1575952425;mp_en_viaje;in other end of year book keepings, holy shit i can't believe i'm gonna have to take a negrate in lieu of [http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2018-11-15#1872520][that coin].
1954800;1575952425;ossabot;Logged on 2018-11-15 11:58:12 mircea_popescu: i'll want the coin back next year. now go forth and own stupidity no more!
1954801;1575952450;mp_en_viaje;i never would have imagined.
1954802;1575952512;mp_en_viaje;then again... 2018 was the year of [http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2018-12-12#1880334][lotta bullshit], wasn't it.
1954803;1575952512;ossabot;Logged on 2018-12-12 14:20:34 asciilifeform: would switch, in a heartbeat, to fulltiming at hypothetical tmsr consultancy, if it could be made to get off ground
1954804;1575988926;BingoBoingo;2018 was indeed a year heavy on the thrashing about and wall sticking projectiles
1954805;1575991223;dorion_road;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-09#1954718 << that'd be a fair point, but what if you help me build something without whatever idiocy which was imported into cuntoo ?
1954806;1575991224;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-09 22:23:29 trinque: dorion_road: I dropped the cuntoo thing because I think it's idiocy to "ubuntu but totally in our own way and with moar fascism!1" or w/e. I'm not then going to turn around and help you build one.
1954807;1575991242;dorion_road;The stage I'm at now in terms of wutdo with cuntoo is : there have been 7 installation reports that I'm aware of -- if I've missed one, someone please correct.
1954808;1575991263;dorion_road;[http://ossasepia.com/2019/07/14/a-working-cuntoo-install-on-amd-fx-8350-with-script/][diana_coman] , [http://bvt-trace.net/2019/02/cuntoo-installation-report/][bvt] , [http://thetarpit.org/2019/assorted-notes-on-bootstrapping-cuntoo][spyked] , [http://thewhet.net/2019/02/hanbots-cuntoo-bake-test-notes-part-i/][hanbot] ,
1954809;1575991263;dorion_road;[http://www.krankendenken.com/2019/02/a-bridge-to-cuntoo-for-the-lenovo-x61-x86_64/][lobbes] , [http://mod6.net/2019/February/10/a_cuntoo_adventure_part1.html][mod6] , [http://btcinfo.sdf.org/blog/cuntoo-a-linux-that-sucks-less.html][shinohai]
1954810;1575991293;dorion_road;I'm budgeting time this month to carry out spyked's method using qemu and lobbes is deepening his understanding of the ebuild system.
1954811;1575991320;dorion_road;[http://fixpoint.welshcomputing.com/2019/gales-linux-initial-release/][Gales Linux] was released last month (which I've used for a couple years by now), [http://bvt-trace.net/2019/12/keccak-hashing-for-kernel-rng/comment-page-1/#comment-101][bvt] and [http://thetarpit.org/2019/work-plan-for-m12-2019#comment-189][skyped] are giving it a spin this month and
1954812;1575991320;dorion_road;[http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-11-29#1953861][diana_coman] is sometime as well.
1954813;1575991321;ossabot;Logged on 2019-11-29 13:11:15 diana_coman: tbh by now I really want to give a spin to jfw's gales thing too and actually see what's there.
1954814;1575991362;dorion_road;trinque, you've [http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-11-06#1950030][foreshadowed] using a minimalist busybox system, which Gales is. Giving it a test run and writing and article about what the positives and negatives are compared to cuntoo would go a long way to help killing idiocy. If you made time to do it by jan 15, adding your insight while others are working on it would help us
1954815;1575991362;dorion_road;leverage the process.
1954816;1575991363;ossabot;Logged on 2019-11-06 23:08:07 trinque: and you have fewer men than you'd like, and I'm not going to pretend to be 20, and then cry when I fail at it. that's why I said I'm looking at kernel + busybox for my own stack. even it isn't human-sized, but it's about two orders of magnitude less twine and shit than "standard linux distro"
1954817;1575991386;dorion_road;Right now my approach is to draw from the experience with cuntoo and gales and understand : what strengths can be taken from both, what do they both lack that tmsr os requires.
1954818;1575991632;dorion_road;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-09#1954729 << can you answer questions and carry conversation about design decisions over these next couple weeks ? there have been a couple, "let's see what trinque says" that've gone unanswered these past couple weeks.
1954819;1575991633;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-09 22:26:29 trinque: anyone wants to pick up these items I've built, I'll be more than happy to give them to him in working order.
1954820;1575991675;dorion_road;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-09#1954719 << how do you reason ?
1954821;1575991675;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-09 22:23:39 trinque: you're going to eat something that's bigger than your capacity to maintain and then what.
1954822;1575991699;dorion_road;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-09#1954728 << I intend to make something new.
1954823;1575991700;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-09 22:26:25 mp_en_viaje: you're either going to make something new, or you're going to make something old. that's the choice.
1954824;1575993711;BingoBoingo;dorion_road: It seems to me like the growing dissatisfaction with Gentoo as a thing to capture for terraforming is that Gentoo comes with a lot of Gentoo specific complexity. This complexity can be handy if you want to build a linux and that linux happens to fit in the space the Gentoo maintainers are running towards, but... that complexity appears to be an impediment to producing a standardized thing that just works without inflicting
1954825;1575993711;BingoBoingo;sometimes substantial costs.
1954826;1575993720;BingoBoingo;These costs can take a number of forms, but the big one seems to be... Gentoo comes with a lot of script baggage that makes it Gentoo instead of something else. To make a TMSR operating system that does V instead of the Gentoo thing... starting from Gentoo means a lot of cuts are going to have to be made.
1954827;1575993730;BingoBoingo;Reading the ongoing conversations in the forums and castles, I get a building suspicion [http://ossasepia.com/2019/12/06/cutting-through-the-tangles-notes-on-graphics-in-eulora-vii/#comment-7162][that further cutting on Gentoo is going to start looking like cutting on CrystalSpace]
1954828;1575993744;BingoBoingo;dorion_road: Mind however, that this is based off of what I'm reading in the logs rather than the source of the actual items.
1954829;1575993778;diana_coman;BingoBoingo: there is certainly something there in that CrystalSpace tries to be essentially a sort of OS all by itself.
1954830;1575993963;BingoBoingo;diana_coman: I'm trying to stay in my own land and out of the OS discussion, but the parallels between the CrystalSpace discussions and the Gentoo discussions are seting of some alarms.
1954831;1575995847;dorion_road;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-10#1954759 << this is a good point. In my mind gentoo can be cut in two parts: 1) core/base bootstapping and 2) package management -- 'stage3' and 'portage'/'emerge' respectively in gentoo slang.
1954832;1575995847;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-10 12:10:35 BingoBoingo: These costs can take a number of forms, but the big one seems to be... Gentoo comes with a lot of script baggage that makes it Gentoo instead of something else. To make a TMSR operating system that does V instead of the Gentoo thing... starting from Gentoo means a lot of cuts are going to have to be made.
1954833;1575995868;dorion_road;the complexity/cost of the first is the apparent [http://fixpoint.welshcomputing.com/2019/introducing-gales-linux-a-cross-bootstrapped-do-it-yourself-fully-static-discriminatory-distribution/?b=I%20planned&e=seeded%20their%20image#select][thompsonization of gentoo bootstapping].
1954834;1575995927;dorion_road;the second is the python script baggae with USE flag system that makes gentoo gentoo for better and worse. I think the package management is the biggest value in gentoo, but I don't yet know the cost/benefit of tameing it with V.
1954835;1575995968;dorion_road;gentoo package management has gone through a lot change over the years. I've used gentoo regularly since 2016, but am looking forward to lobbes article on ebuilds because I still haven't grasped that complexity.
1954836;1575996047;dorion_road;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-10#1954760 << I hadn't made that connection, thanks for the link!
1954837;1575996047;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-10 12:10:44 BingoBoingo: Reading the ongoing conversations in the forums and castles, I get a building suspicion [http://ossasepia.com/2019/12/06/cutting-through-the-tangles-notes-on-graphics-in-eulora-vii/#comment-7162][that further cutting on Gentoo is going to start looking like cutting on CrystalSpace]
1954838;1575996129;dorion_road;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-10#1954763 << very much appreciated. i'll read up on it.
1954839;1575996129;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-10 12:14:38 BingoBoingo: diana_coman: I'm trying to stay in my own land and out of the OS discussion, but the parallels between the CrystalSpace discussions and the Gentoo discussions are seting of some alarms.
1954840;1575999810;nicoleci;it's something to watch the stone trinque cast [http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-10-19#1946710][three months ago] go meanwhile round the world and come back to hit him in the back of the head - kind of ironic...
1954841;1575999810;ossabot;Logged on 2019-10-19 01:27:38 trinque: let it be plain that I hate most of you. and you should hate me back. I don't want to hear another dipshit that can't find his way into a 50k/yr business call himself lord.
1954842;1576003664;mp_en_viaje;in other news, anna netrebko was quite the accomplished fanciulla some years ago. ah, the nineties...
1954843;1576003932;mp_en_viaje;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-10#1954747 << smart.
1954844;1576003932;mp_en_viaje;who knows, maybe critical experience is the needed mystery ingredient to finally permit him defeat whatever demons made him miss out on having a blog, for instance.
1954845;1576003932;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-10 11:31:17 dorion_road: trinque, you've [http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-11-06#1950030][foreshadowed] using a minimalist busybox system, which Gales is. Giving it a test run and writing and article about what the positives and negatives are compared to cuntoo would go a long way to help killing idiocy. If you made time to do it by jan 15, adding your insight while others are working on it would help us
1954846;1576004066;mp_en_viaje;it'd be ridiculous to the point of hysterical (if it weren't so fucking sad), this. everyone strives towards communicating effectually, makes planning articles to try and conquer their innate ineffectuality, EXCEPT the supposed "pillars of the community". those special cuntlets/tards, those... what, write themselves special cuntletry exceptions, what looks great on say [http://thetarpit.org/2019/work-plan-for-m12-2019][thetarpit] would hav
1954847;1576004067;mp_en_viaje;e what, looked bad on loperos ?
1954848;1576004119;mp_en_viaje;needless to say i'm not in the fucking slightest impressed ; and i think it's well established by now how that goes, or how much this sort of "i'm speshul" cuntery ends up being worth.
1954849;1576004301;mp_en_viaje;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2018-09-29#1855672 is still good law, and still exactly how this'll derpy "oh, i'm gonna turn around and try to use the republican infrastructure to fuck up the republic with" is gonna go.
1954850;1576004302;ossabot;Logged on 2018-09-29 19:35:27 mircea_popescu: but as far as the foundation is concerned -- if all it does (ALL IT DOES!!!) is stand up to tell me "oh, we can't follow the keccak because reasons" ima put an end to it in short order.
1954851;1576004316;mp_en_viaje;republican infrastructure builds the republic, not assholery. for fucks sake.
1954852;1576004364;mp_en_viaje;if this two bit idiocy worked, what the fuck were i even doing here ? hurr.
1954853;1576004571;mp_en_viaje;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-10#1954750 << to be perfectly clear, i'm not at all inclined to lend support to this sort of misbehaviour. young man has no excuse to act like a cunt, "oh, hurr durr, LET OTHER PEOPLE". by and large, if he's not here to work his shit, nobody cares about his shit.
1954854;1576004572;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-10 11:31:41 dorion_road: Right now my approach is to draw from the experience with cuntoo and gales and understand : what strengths can be taken from both, what do they both lack that tmsr os requires.
1954855;1576004640;mp_en_viaje;if trinque fails to work within the framework (which yes, DOES mean jan 15th is a firm deadline, not because you made it so or could, but because i can, and do), and nobody gives a shit about cuntoo, everything that was thereby lost is upon trinque to pay.
1954856;1576004645;mp_en_viaje;and he will, too.
1954857;1576004676;mp_en_viaje;no amount of "collective action" engineertard "let's stick together like the cuntherd" will save this. the stain is indelible, in fifty years or fifty centuries it will stay visible.
1954858;1576004730;mp_en_viaje;like i see the stain on the idiots who failed to symbolics, and like no amount of handwringing / wining on the "engineer" side can save them, so this. it's fucking visible -- monkeys failed for being monkeys, it is ON THEM. for having been monkey. when the calling came, they failed.
1954859;1576004766;mp_en_viaje;and in general -- the absentee, the insufficient, the "otherwise busy", the butthurt, physically or mentally -- better pray they're in fact quite as inconsequential as they seem.
1954860;1576004803;mp_en_viaje;because if they aren't, if indeed the republic can't exist without them and thereby won't exist -- guess who's going straight to hell for this sin of theirs, and who'll ever forget, be successfully misdirected, whatever.
1954861;1576004808;mp_en_viaje;the stain, IT REMAINS.
1954862;1576005097;mp_en_viaje;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-10#1954760 << for the transparently self-obvious reason that idiots preserve idiocy -- if they didn't, they wouldn't still be around. so yes all their infuriating cuntbrainfarts are always well glued with broken glass, it's never a case of "holy shit, i can't believe how intolerably stupid i've been", it's always a case of http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-11-12#1950966
1954863;1576005097;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-10 12:10:44 BingoBoingo: Reading the ongoing conversations in the forums and castles, I get a building suspicion [http://ossasepia.com/2019/12/06/cutting-through-the-tangles-notes-on-graphics-in-eulora-vii/#comment-7162][that further cutting on Gentoo is going to start looking like cutting on CrystalSpace]
1954864;1576005097;ossabot;Logged on 2019-11-12 21:14:00 mircea_popescu: i dun think you're a lazy man. currently i think you grew up in a house with a lot of door slamming as a rhetorical device, but that's really neither here nor there.
1954865;1576005107;mp_en_viaje;because totally, i'll be so very fucking impressed, don't you know it.
1954866;1576005647;mp_en_viaje;anyways, i have serious reservations about anything-python. it's the first time for me, i never thought before a lang is basically the satan ; but it seems to me anything derived off python's going to be stupid, for that reason.
1954867;1576005653;mp_en_viaje;it attracts a certain sort of mental deffective.
1954868;1576005714;mp_en_viaje;i suppose the same could be said about 2000s era php, or 2010s era haskell
1954869;1576006071;diana_coman;there are 1001 pythons in fact and at some point it used to be a half-decent quick-prototype/plaything tool; I'd say it got then pushed forwards & "adopted" and all that, because "easy".
1954870;1576006233;diana_coman;and now I hope I won't have to cut & clean blender too, lolz.
1954871;1576007373;lobbes;I can say from experience that working in python has not been the best for my mental health
1954872;1576009183;BingoBoingo;Milepost now that K's back in the pink house: http://archive.is/92vj5 DOLAR OFICIAL COMPRA $ 57,910 VENTA $ 62,910 VARIACIÓN -0,130% ACTUALIZADO: 10/12/2019 15:00 DOLAR BLUE COMPRA $ 65,250 VENTA $ 69,250 VARIACIÓN -1,070% ACTUALIZADO: 10/12/2019 15:00 CONTADO CON LIQUI REFERENCIA $ 75,130 VARIACIÓN -2,080% ACTUALIZADO: 10/12/2019 15:00 DOLAR PROMEDIO COMPRA $ 58,49 VENTA $ 63,45 VARIACIÓN -0,130% ACTUALIZADO: 10/12/2019 15:00 DO
1954873;1576009183;BingoBoingo;LAR BOLSA REFERENCIA $ 71,920 = VARIACIÓN 0% ACTUALIZADO: 10/12/2019 15:00 RIESGO PAÍS ÚLTIMO 2.180,00
1954874;1576014331;feedbot;http://qntra.net/2019/12/greek-government-introduces-fines-for-not-spending-income-electronically-through-captive-channels/ << Qntra -- Greek Government Introduces Fines For Not Spending Income Electronically Through Captive Channels
1954875;1576016462;trinque;mp_en_viaje: I put it to you that without money inflow... what republic? I'd thought we'd arrived in the same place on that one, at the time.
1954876;1576016504;trinque;I'm not going to be put in the position of defending socialists, people with kids, or whatever else I'm declared to be.
1954877;1576016599;trinque;I'm going to write something on why eating a product of socialists is stupid, and if we must eat shit, eating the least shit is the move.
1954878;1576016732;trinque;if after this, you still want to eat stallman's leavings I'm not going to protest or insult you on the matter.
1954879;1576016787;trinque;I'll just tip hat and go be stupid somewhere else.
1954880;1576017036;trinque;dorion_road: ftr I have no problem with trying out your thing and offering critique either. I do have a problem with armies that don't eat, so I'd love to hear how you plan to sustain the effort necessary to maintain an OS.
1954881;1576017121;trinque;and this retort that real men manifest food with sheer will, great. there's nothing actionable in that comment.
1954882;1576017203;trinque;an OS build forever out of "community organizing" and volunteerism is going to be a piece of shit.
1954883;1576017247;trinque;and a found item with TMSR chizeled in it is not thereby owned
1954884;1576017309;trinque;you will see this article sooner than the 15th, too.
1954885;1576019732;trinque;nicolewhatever: and by the way, repeating your master's opinion for him says very little. I heard him; he doesn't need you going "ayyyyyy", but good girl all the same.
1954886;1576035427;mp_en_viaje;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-10#1954773 << way of the world. i've rewatched [http://trilema.com/2015/have-some-chocolate-cake/#comment-111920][the big lebowski] however, for good measure.
1954887;1576035427;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-10 13:52:05 nicoleci: it's something to watch the stone trinque cast [http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-10-19#1946710][three months ago] go meanwhile round the world and come back to hit him in the back of the head - kind of ironic...
1954888;1576035432;mp_en_viaje;great film about engineering.
1954889;1576035485;mp_en_viaje;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-10#1954808 << yes, we did. and we are in the same place on that one, at this time too.
1954890;1576035486;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-10 18:29:38 trinque: mp_en_viaje: I put it to you that without money inflow... what republic? I'd thought we'd arrived in the same place on that one, at the time.
1954891;1576035561;mp_en_viaje;that doesn't mean now i'll permit a whole "lost tech" fantasy fiction to erupt on fucking gentoo, as fucking if the symbolics idiocy wasn't [http://logs.ossasepia.com/log-search?q=X-ray&chan=trilema][ENOUGH] of a waste of time / ready rug to sweep it under..
1954892;1576035629;mp_en_viaje;nor can i eschew signalling this point to dorion for the merry gang, specifically because he has little fucking idea about the underlying truths in the thick "engineering" sauce.
1954893;1576035704;mp_en_viaje;because, ultimately, that's what i do here.
1954894;1576035918;trinque;I'm going to just honestly say I don't follow you, because I don't.
1954895;1576035931;trinque;gentoo's full of this "engineering" you're talking about
1954896;1576035987;trinque;it literally has surfaces within surfaces of autistic knobs to fiddle just so.
1954897;1576036040;mp_en_viaje;well, at which juncture do you stop following ?
1954898;1576036134;trinque;what is it you think I'm signaling to diana_coman's bunch?
1954899;1576036140;trinque;all is folly and get drunk kids?
1954900;1576036276;mp_en_viaje;that if you're not here to represent gentoo, they have really very little business bothering with it.
1954901;1576036291;trinque;ah hell no.
1954902;1576036298;trinque;http://fixpoint.welshcomputing.com/2019/introducing-gales-linux-a-cross-bootstrapped-do-it-yourself-fully-static-discriminatory-distribution/ << this might actually be the correct item.
1954903;1576036303;mp_en_viaje;and that they're certainly ill advised to deputize presumably their more active set to go on some kind of dubmass expedition through the remains.
1954904;1576036327;trinque;I think they can do all sorts of things with or without me.
1954905;1576036355;mp_en_viaje;~that~ is what i'm signalling ; and that that's what i'm doing along with that i have to do it is self-fucking-obvious on the extant record, wut!
1954906;1576036358;trinque;but gentoo's a piece of shit. if it's not apparent why, I'll definitely have to say why.
1954907;1576036380;mp_en_viaje;so then there's no disconnect on this score.
1954908;1576036393;trinque;recall the mod6 derpitude, "my trusty gentoo" and all that.
1954909;1576036397;trinque;like it's his neckbeard katana
1954910;1576036400;mp_en_viaje;vaguely
1954911;1576036564;mp_en_viaje;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-10#1954809 << look, it's very fucking simple : there are 62 cities in the world larger than houston ; of the 4.5mn living there about 300k own more than a million dubaloos' worth. if you go from nothing to 1mn dubaloos, you go from nothing to being in the top 300k pantsuits in pantsuit conglomeration #62.
1954912;1576036564;mp_en_viaje;nobody cares, it's not like i'm particularly threatened by the notion god help me ; but if you quit your day job to spend a decade or whatever's left of your active live becoming the 285`666th most popular singer-songwriter in the 63rd most popular genre AND you also expect someone will drop what they're doing to clap for you... you're insane, in so many words.
1954913;1576036565;mp_en_viaje;what, you think i'm hobby police over here ? go, win the fishing competition, be the greatest pitcher on diamond #8, municipal sportscourt #11 etcetera. just, again, if you stop showing up for work because THAT's what you're doing, you're off your rocker, for srsly.
1954914;1576036713;mp_en_viaje;paintsuit world is as fine a hobby as any other hobby, and what the fuck's wrong with having hobbies now. but if you stop distinguishing between vocation and avocation, if the hobby takes over activity as a sort of parasite, it's not ME "declaring" you an otaku. i'm like the coroner in that sad context, nobody died because the coroner pronounced them dead. at the time the coroner showed up, the deed was long done.
1954915;1576036749;trinque;we don't disagree on that point either; I don't give a shit how many funnybux I have.
1954916;1576036813;trinque;the only context in which I brought it up was getting pissed at alf that I couldn't have a chip, and w/e.
1954917;1576036869;mp_en_viaje;yes, but nobody knows what the fuck you're either thinking or doing, because you don't express yourself neither consistently nor well. so we're stuck guessing. i'm trying to do as good a job of it as possible, but god fucking help me it's my least favourite activity.
1954918;1576037361;mp_en_viaje;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-10#1954813 << they're doing a consulting gig, it's somewhat detailed on his blog, he even has a business plan / some description of actual sales activity in there.
1954919;1576037361;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-10 18:39:12 trinque: dorion_road: ftr I have no problem with trying out your thing and offering critique either. I do have a problem with armies that don't eat, so I'd love to hear how you plan to sustain the effort necessary to maintain an OS.
1954920;1576037407;mp_en_viaje;it's not much as it stands, but i do believe they've targetted exceptionally well, and might perhaps be able to execute also. maybe even surive to iterate. in any case i intend to help them, within reason.
1954921;1576037426;trinque;I've been in that business. It's hard, wish them well.
1954922;1576037456;mp_en_viaje;the exceptional part goes from being peripherally connected to the wealth management consulting behemoth, it's what he did in panama.
1954923;1576037518;mp_en_viaje;but yes, putting the above 20 log lines (in context-adequate form) under the eyes of a few hundred thousand pantsuits in fifty or a hundred pantsuit congomerations is not a half-bad plan.
1954924;1576037597;mp_en_viaje;"soo... well done on the 50mn exit. now, why are you at walmart with a credit card, in the same outfit as the single mother over there with her govt-issued scrip ? you know the same social worker can cut your access that gives her the electronic meal ticket, yes ?"
1954925;1576037698;trinque;that escape bridge might be extremely lucrative, yeah.
1954926;1576037819;mp_en_viaje;whether it ends up working or not, http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-10#1954814 is however not a fair description of what's going on.
1954927;1576037820;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-10 18:40:37 trinque: and this retort that real men manifest food with sheer will, great. there's nothing actionable in that comment.
1954928;1576037836;trinque;if the gents have somehow managed to communicate to the "offshore money" crowd that computing infrastructure matters, that'll definitely be something.
1954929;1576037873;trinque;the oil folks are all dipshits, and the fraud's a feature. they don't want it.
1954930;1576037949;mp_en_viaje;yes, but meanwhile i had an exceptional aged steak yest, and then retired for a glass of port, coffee, sweets and a cigarette. you understsnd this, if i ask for an ashtrey at this poshest place in town, THEY FUCKING BRING ME ONE.
1954931;1576037990;mp_en_viaje;contrary to the pantsuit fantasy, "this is everywhere" does not hold. there's a lot of power to be put behind the "you're fucking stupid, amerikanski" in very simple exemplar form.
1954932;1576038043;mp_en_viaje;in the end, nobody fucking cares what the hillbillies are used to. experience shows time and again the young female;s willing to move on, and with her the whole fucking world moves, from outhouse to indoor plumbing arrangements, and so on.
1954933;1576038180;trinque;last thing I begrudge is your success, and I'm well aware that at 32 so far I've knocked down middle class walmart retirement.
1954934;1576038187;trinque;this is pretty squarely the point.
1954935;1576038199;mp_en_viaje;not a point of my success ; the point is -- yes i'm aware texas oil money is rather... ok, your term, dipshits.
1954936;1576038211;mp_en_viaje;but i don't think that situation is self-perpetuating.
1954937;1576038227;mp_en_viaje;notwithstanding it managed to do so for a shocking century.
1954938;1576038340;mp_en_viaje;the nile also flooded every year, in a regular process that seemed to most everyone, certainly everyone in the ancient world, fundamental. yet it wasn't fundamental ; i twasn't even self-perpetuating. as it turns out, the nile's stopped flooding altogether, it's been decades.
1954939;1576038364;mp_en_viaje;i guess the converse statement's that im some kind of half-baked optimist. but anyways.
1954940;1576038376;trinque;the strangest thing is when you're calling me the asshole
1954941;1576038378;trinque;it really gives me pause
1954942;1576038381;trinque;:D
1954943;1576038388;mp_en_viaje;wait what
1954944;1576038401;trinque;just making jokes over here.
1954945;1576038439;mp_en_viaje;as the romanian expression goes, am ris si cu curu'.
1954946;1576038570;mp_en_viaje;o look at that, the only google reference is... [http://trilema.com/2011/m-am-spart-de-ris-cu-augustin-radu/][a trilema piece]. god help us, it's true mp will always return a "wait, what ?!" moment, but...
1954947;1576038597;mp_en_viaje;it means "i laughed with the ass also"
1954948;1576038631;trinque;lol
1954949;1576038789;trinque;so dorion_road, is the idea that there's a tmsr stack upon which what, systems are built for these folks holding piles of database money?
1954950;1576038798;mp_en_viaje;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-10#1954816 << you know, my slaves meet the "found item, chiseled". not thereby owned ? or is it animism magic, "rule only applies to non-sluts" ? this'll be a hard argument, objectification of women and all that.
1954951;1576038798;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-10 18:42:43 trinque: and a found item with TMSR chizeled in it is not thereby owned
1954952;1576038798;trinque;this I would actually like to know.
1954953;1576038833;mp_en_viaje;trinque, do you recall that time asciilifeform couldn't get a ro lawyer to talk to him over gpg ?
1954954;1576038850;trinque;shitty lawyer. I even got my accountant to use
1954955;1576038864;mp_en_viaje;my understanding is that they're basically fixing that : giving the guy the laptop's evidently not enough (i gave mine one when i left ro), it needs to be supported culturally / with habits, mental and otherwise
1954956;1576038877;mp_en_viaje;trinque, he's romanian, whole different kettle of fish.
1954957;1576038921;mp_en_viaje;anyway, that's what they seem to be doing, "here's the hardware, here's the mental floss slash bible, here's the daily prayers rules regulation and prayerbook", a complete package like that.
1954958;1576038932;trinque;it's a start.
1954959;1576038937;trinque;where do they keep the records though.
1954960;1576038945;mp_en_viaje;it seems self-evident their plan as it stands is missing the 4th and final ingredient of churchly success, "and this is the congregation", but that can be discovered in time
1954961;1576038951;trinque;I bet all that's shockingly primitive
1954962;1576038966;mp_en_viaje;i guess they explain this when they wake up.
1954963;1576039048;mp_en_viaje;anyways, it seems all very neoprotestant ("compile your own bible out of letters found around the house!!) which my rather catholic description doesn't do justice to. but it's just summary, i don't mean to rule by misrepresentation.
1954964;1576039111;mp_en_viaje;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-10#1954818 << this "he doesn't need you" thing is such nonsense. i also don't need any other of the things, what the hell, since when it's a needs-based economy.
1954965;1576039111;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-10 19:24:08 trinque: nicolewhatever: and by the way, repeating your master's opinion for him says very little. I heard him; he doesn't need you going "ayyyyyy", but good girl all the same.
1954966;1576039142;mp_en_viaje;if want the bitches to express themselves or not express themselves, in the end ? it's gotta be one, can't be both.
1954967;1576039169;trinque;see, I'm the fucking misogynist over here!
1954968;1576039202;mp_en_viaje;not like you have to be!
1954969;1576039497;trinque;at any rate, folks that are handling money overseas for clients are obviously a target.
1954970;1576039519;trinque;they're using shockingly primitive accounting tooling, shockingly primitive processes for e.g. wire authorizations and all the rest
1954971;1576039540;trinque;most importantly they're rolling in cash.
1954972;1576039589;mp_en_viaje;the actual important part is that "the industry" is looking for recovery after the whole "panama papers" etc circus.
1954973;1576039611;mp_en_viaje;and yes, as it happens there DOES exist exactly one jurisdiction where they can move to, after being betrayed by all the toy pretend-states.
1954974;1576046324;jfw;!!v 1C2C9E4AADCF962B69A0B349D77530F1C978D1CC9A29D420CD479B1E6DE671B4
1954975;1576046324;deedbot;jfw rated mircea_popescu 5 << Father & overlord of the Most Serene Republic. Reads ~everything worth the mention and writes in abundance at trilema.com.
1954976;1576046330;jfw;!!v 7FE20FEC02F565A69AC924B828339637C311312077DC16D4A04DC40FC182D78B
1954977;1576046330;jfw;!!v 9511C76CEDB314555384627E38B0D918C3D0544ED6E4785C9B173513406D4E33
1954978;1576046330;jfw;!!v 2F925421CD243FD9AC3554D2F68D44C58536F1F26560BF9F8A970EAAEA6D82AE
1954979;1576046330;jfw;!!v 23F47243CCE75305B627E393F507768EE0DE11E676CB9F652C9D28A4B3886CF9
1954980;1576046330;jfw;!!v 49127BD8F1B2478531CA3F1920357C60716DB38E7064BE49C643622629924ECB
1954981;1576046330;deedbot;jfw rated BingoBoingo 3 << Aaron Rogier: bingology.net, qntra.net, moved abroad to start ISP, knowledgeable on diverse topics, responsible custodian of computing equipment. Met in person Dec 2019.
1954982;1576046330;deedbot;jfw rated diana_coman 5 << ossasepia.com, long-time Trilema scholar, develops Eulora, knowledgeable on computing, writing & other topics; committed to seeing things for what they are & solving the right problems. My mentor & Master at Young Hands Club.
1954983;1576046331;deedbot;jfw rated asciilifeform 2 << Stanislav Datskovskiy, loper-os.org, seeks the Right Thing in all matters even if it would take ten lifetimes. Has honored promises in commerce in my experience.
1954984;1576046331;deedbot;jfw rated dorion 6 << Robinson Dorion, close friend & business partner, known since Jan 2014. Studious and dedicated. Writes at dorion-mode.com.
1954985;1576046331;deedbot;jfw rated trinque 2 << Knowledgeable on system administration, Lisp, Bitcoin. Develops & operates deedbot, holding its wallet keys. Writes occasionally at trinque.org.
1954986;1576047575;jfw;mp_en_viaje: thanks for those blog comments btw, looking forward to a proper read + catching up on the juicy looking log here in the coming days. I see dorion_road's and my venture was discussed just above; I'll give him the first word as I believe he's more up to date here.
1954987;1576047605;mp_en_viaje;take yer time
1954988;1576047634;mp_en_viaje;how derange did BingoBoingo end up, after years in the crazed orclands btw ?
1954989;1576047710;jfw;No derangement that I was able to detect.
1954990;1576047718;mp_en_viaje;guy's got fortitude, huh.
1954991;1576047728;mp_en_viaje;dat midwestern stock, apparently they can live through anything.
1954992;1576047733;jfw;But possible that's because I've been in crazed orclands longer
1954993;1576047748;mp_en_viaje;ha, that's a point huh.
1954994;1576052109;diana_coman;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-11#1954893 - heh, my first line on hearing of the training they give their clients was precisely [http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/ossasepia/2019-10-15#1006297][how long until they find their way to here]
1954995;1576052109;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-11 00:44:23 mp_en_viaje: it seems self-evident their plan as it stands is missing the 4th and final ingredient of churchly success, "and this is the congregation", but that can be discovered in time
1954996;1576052109;ossabot;(ossasepia) 2019-10-15 diana_coman: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/ossasepia/2019-10-14#1006282 - heh, how long until they register a key and find their way in here?
1954997;1576053201;mp_en_viaje;word.
1954998;1576053404;mp_en_viaje;meanwhile in linear improvements : i'm thinking of setting up #trilema to forward the useless / idle / etcetera to the feeder chans. apparently freenode has support for this, in that in setting a ban one can also specify a channel wherein the banned to be dumped.
1954999;1576053404;mp_en_viaje;so what i'm thinking is, what if deedbot set a ban on any nick it sees unvoiced for >1hr, setting the forward channel alternatively #ossasepia and #trilema-hanbot on it ?
1955000;1576053404;mp_en_viaje;this'll prolly need management in the sense that i suspect the banlist is limited, so after a few of these it'd be stuck expiring the oldest ban to enact a new one, meaning it'll need a round buffer of them.
1955001;1576053440;mp_en_viaje;so specifically trinque is this feasible iyo ? and everyone else also, is an hour too short a time ? other comments ?
1955002;1576054155;mp_en_viaje;diana_coman, http://thesingingfarmwife.blogspot.com/2015/05/dingleberry-duty.html << here, have a "could be worse"
1955003;1576056410;diana_coman;mp_en_viaje: ahaha; and designer overalls, lmao; the exquisite sheep worming attiree.
1955004;1576056485;diana_coman;mp_en_viaje: I don't mind it or anything; tbh only the other day I had a look at the list of names and picked RubenSomsen to pm & he got at least in #ossasepia, presumably still reading now through the mountain of links he ended up hit with.
1955005;1576057019;diana_coman;mp_en_viaje: the only potential trouble I see with your proposed model is when the new voice model is implemented since my pageboys will not be able to hang around here at all anymore.
1955006;1576057092;mp_en_viaje;why not ?
1955007;1576057119;diana_coman;they won't be able to self-voice and then what, someone has to voice them every hour or they end up kicked to one of the other chans?
1955008;1576057207;diana_coman;alternatively I suppose the !!up could be perhaps permanent ie until a !!down
1955009;1576057222;diana_coman;rather than 30 minutes thing.
1955010;1576057293;mp_en_viaje;what a can of worms
1955011;1576057322;mp_en_viaje;so for one thing, if you're not willing to rate them enough so they can voice, why should they idle here ?
1955012;1576057349;diana_coman;mp_en_viaje: ugh, what??? the new model is that only those rated by you with 9 can self-voice, no?
1955013;1576057356;diana_coman;what do you want me to rate them as?
1955014;1576057371;diana_coman;or at any rate, those rated by you.
1955015;1576057373;diana_coman;not me.
1955016;1576057393;mp_en_viaje;for the other thing, the original reason the thing was set to auto-devoice in 30 minutes was to avoid the burden of hostility upon the devoicer, and the situation of voice inflation, where randos have it just as good as actual people, like thios [http://trilema.com/2018/democracy-sucks-the-two-thousand-four-hundred-and-change-years-old-version/?b=strike%20citizens&e=distinguishable#select][were athens] or something.
1955017;1576057423;mp_en_viaje;diana_coman, i thought the model was that those rated by my as 9 are on the list of ratings deedbot looks at to establish l2
1955018;1576057423;*;diana_coman goes to re-read the new self-voice model, maybe missed something.
1955019;1576057460;mp_en_viaje;so i rate 9 = l1 ; l1 rates 2 or above = l2.
1955020;1576057499;diana_coman;if that's the case, then there is no problem indeed since yes, they would still be able to self-voice for sure; in my mind it was that only your l1 can self-voice, hm.
1955021;1576057510;mp_en_viaje;that seems silly
1955022;1576057534;mp_en_viaje;iirc that was discussed re flexibility for ~other~ chans, which is how the 9 came about, "just don't rate people 9 if you don't want a l1/l2 in your chan"
1955023;1576057661;*;mp_en_viaje goes to re-read also, by now it's bee na while
1955024;1576057753;diana_coman;now I see it; I read [http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-09-14#1936099][depedent on ~my~ wot] and I didn't get it was just moving the centre but keeping the l2 as well, hm.
1955025;1576057753;ossabot;Logged on 2019-09-14 04:06:31 mircea_popescu: unrelatedly : hey trinque, now that there's actually multiple functional castles the time's prolly come to update the deedbot voice model into awareness of this situation. so how about a patch making voice in #trilema dependent on ~my~ wot, rather than deedbot's own ; and similarily in any castles that ask for it / you come to an understanding with the lords thereof, so they can use the voice model there if the
1955026;1576057803;mp_en_viaje;i suppose i should prolly write a proper article about this, seems it's unhelpfully all over the logs ?
1955027;1576057863;diana_coman;it is really because that's the start but then it gets discussed and the different values talked about and so on; so yes, I for one would very much prefer to have an article as ref.
1955028;1576057892;mp_en_viaje;might as well
1955029;1576058169;feedbot;http://trilema.com/2019/server1-hotelmoskva-rs/ << Trilema -- server1.hotelmoskva.rs
1955030;1576075467;BingoBoingo;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-11#1954926 << I imagine a bit of both are at play.
1955031;1576075468;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-11 03:11:06 mp_en_viaje: ha, that's a point huh.
1955032;1576082019;dorion_road;|http://logs.ericbenevides.com/log/trilema/2019-12-10#1954786 << sounds sound.
1955033;1576082019;ericbot;Logged on 2019-12-10 19:07:06 mp_en_viaje: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-10#1954750 << to be perfectly clear, i'm not at all inclined to lend support to this sort of misbehaviour. young man has no excuse to act like a cunt, "oh, hurr durr, LET OTHER PEOPLE". by and large, if he's not here to work his shit, nobody cares about his shit.
1955034;1576082020;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-10 11:31:41 dorion_road: Right now my approach is to draw from the experience with cuntoo and gales and understand : what strengths can be taken from both, what do they both lack that tmsr os requires.
1955035;1576082042;mp_en_viaje;wasn't talking about you there, lol, but yeah.
1955036;1576082106;dorion_road;heh. I got that, noting the general principle.
1955037;1576082125;dorion_road;http://logs.ericbenevides.com/log/trilema/2019-12-10#1954788 << noted
1955038;1576082126;ericbot;Logged on 2019-12-10 19:08:15 mp_en_viaje: if trinque fails to work within the framework (which yes, DOES mean jan 15th is a firm deadline, not because you made it so or could, but because i can, and do), and nobody gives a shit about cuntoo, everything that was thereby lost is upon trinque to pay.
1955039;1576082153;mp_en_viaje;aite
1955040;1576082156;dorion_road;http://logs.ericbenevides.com/log/trilema/2019-12-10#1954799 << hmm. I know python is discussed at length in various log threads, for the sake of clarity, would you mind summarizing the most important marks against it ?
1955041;1576082157;ericbot;Logged on 2019-12-10 19:25:02 mp_en_viaje: anyways, i have serious reservations about anything-python. it's the first time for me, i never thought before a lang is basically the satan ; but it seems to me anything derived off python's going to be stupid, for that reason.
1955042;1576082203;mp_en_viaje;dorion, i wouldn't. let's use the call-and-response format for this. so, what would you say is the problem the republic's formed to resolve ?
1955043;1576082373;dorion_road;good question. the problem of maintaining a hierarchy of indivdual agents.
1955044;1576082386;dorion_road;individual*
1955045;1576082439;mp_en_viaje;ever heard / seen someone say "bring it" ? as in you know, the challenge, there's some kinda threat an' the response is... bring it
1955046;1576082457;dorion_road;yes, I have.
1955047;1576082518;mp_en_viaje;the job of gnoseology, the collected product of thought, is to enact partitions, and record them. some of these are more interesting than others, as illustrated through experience ; an examined life is exactly this "following phenomena while aware of the partitions list"
1955048;1576082566;mp_en_viaje;i'd say the most interesting partition available upon "living things" is whether they are ready. there's the living things that are, and the living things that aren't. hence that whole discussion of http://trilema.com/2017/the-day-of-failure-trilemma/
1955049;1576082616;mp_en_viaje;now, people as a particular class of living things are perverse (this is called "intelligence" in pantsuit gospels), meaning they also have a recursion built in there.
1955050;1576082631;dorion_road;that's an interesting partition for sure.
1955051;1576082646;mp_en_viaje;practically this enacts another partition, nietzsche's will.
1955052;1576082694;mp_en_viaje;now there are three groups : the ready, the willing unready, and the dumb unready. in more traditional terms the middle class is denoted as organized stupidity.
1955053;1576082759;mp_en_viaje;they'd like to be ready, see. they just... aren't. and because people are perverse, this tends to manifest rather as exam taking than actual improvement. they don't become any ready-er, they just become adept at pretending they are.
1955054;1576082830;mp_en_viaje;this having progressed unchecked for lo these many years, the principal problem of the republic is dealing with organized stupidity. this is a lot like any other cleaning job, because yes there's no difference between the filth that supports vermin infestations and the "collective action" that supports the marauding idiots.
1955055;1576082853;mp_en_viaje;my objection is that foremost and before being any other thing, python is a tool for the wilfully stupid.
1955056;1576082975;mp_en_viaje;hence the link relating it to wikipedia recently that now of course i can't find. basically what it does seems to me in any and all particulars based upon the forwarding of the "group action" agenda of the only evil in this world ; much like the republic's in all workings promoting itself python's in all its workings first supporting the enemy.
1955057;1576083038;mp_en_viaje;the problem with this argument of course is that it can be applied quite well to A LOT of the things we use ; most notably c++. but it's at the core, i suspect, if unexpressed, of why nobody ever pushed for say c#.
1955058;1576083102;diana_coman;fwiw I wanted to add precisely ^ .
1955059;1576083122;dorion_road;python is then not available to meaningful examination because it has been exam taking and pretending to be ready (e.g. usg.mit now uses it instead of scheme), rather than actually making itself ready for human use.
1955060;1576083178;mp_en_viaje;no, python is a tool built so as to permit the unready to write very bad code.
1955061;1576083208;dorion_road;ah, now I see.
1955062;1576083252;mp_en_viaje;but i do mean ~very~ bad. fractally bad, it even gives them the impression they have been. without prejudice to lobbes, look at his experience, not necessarily just since sept.
1955063;1576083261;mp_en_viaje;i don't think it's him ; i think it's the damned python.
1955064;1576083341;mp_en_viaje;i am not proposing bash is good ; but i made a point of it in that context because i believe it is in this respect opposite. it has all the ills naggum finds it, yes, but it does not have that one thing that produces pete dushenskis out of otherwise promising young men.
1955065;1576083349;mp_en_viaje;it doesn't promote smarm.
1955066;1576083408;dorion_road;mp_en_viaje makes sense, thanks for laying it out.
1955067;1576083468;mp_en_viaje;this'd be to my mind the string holding pantsuit online together : python, wikipedia & wediditreddit.
1955068;1576083558;dorion_road;the string ought be pulled then.
1955069;1576083568;mp_en_viaje;well at the very least known about.
1955070;1576083585;mp_en_viaje;i dunno i support any particular action on the foregoing basis. but i also ain't gonna pass it in silence no mo.
1955071;1576083770;dorion_road;python primarily comes up due to portage. Gales uses a shell script based package manager, so the point about bash will get further practical consideration as that gets explored.
1955072;1576083805;mp_en_viaje;before coming up due to portage it came up due to flask ; and after portage it came up due to http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-04#1954347
1955073;1576083806;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-04 22:53:10 mircea_popescu: (notice, incidentally, how my bash / awk didn't betray me in "if($2 != day)" like your python betrayed you)
1955074;1576083813;mp_en_viaje;it keeps coming up, and it's always in this context.
1955075;1576083832;*;diana_coman looks at blender
1955076;1576083836;mp_en_viaje;you know ?
1955077;1576083897;mp_en_viaje;and it's not ~the language~, either. there's nothing magically great about "how it handles conditioanls", "if($2 != day) is not god's own notation or anything LIKE that. it's that python breeds and fits upon and further breeds and further fits upon the sort of thought process that'll produce the sort of thing that fails.
1955078;1576083903;mp_en_viaje;it's like terraforming for failure.
1955079;1576083963;mp_en_viaje;much like any other drug addiction, by supressing the wrong pain signals (which is what it set out to do, guido van dorkum's idea was exactly this, if coding weren't painful more people would -- yes, but BADLY) it produces positive feedback harmful loops.
1955080;1576083964;diana_coman;well, supporting idiocy I'd say, yes.
1955081;1576084095;mp_en_viaje;there's a trilema somewhere explaioning how positive feedback loops are the only dangerous thing in nature, but...
1955082;1576084250;BingoBoingo;Explicitly [http://trilema.com/2014/the-hour-of-reckoning/][mentioned here] as a classical failure mode
1955083;1576084289;mp_en_viaje;yeah but
1955084;1576084371;diana_coman;mp_en_viaje: there's the statement as such that [http://trilema.com/2018/post-malone/?b=positive%20loops&e=#select][positive loops are just another name for death]
1955085;1576084382;mp_en_viaje;a yes! that's it ty
1955086;1576084479;mp_en_viaje;well... actually it might not be it, it might be only reference to the it, but i am intellectualy exhausted by now
1955087;1576084585;diana_coman;it didn't seem like it because it's a statement, not an explanation really; onth it doesn't link it either and supposedly it should, if it can be found and so on.
1955088;1576084683;mp_en_viaje;yeah
1955089;1576084704;mp_en_viaje;i dunno, sometimes i think 2018 was spent doing a LOT of drugs, i can remember it like hippies can remember the 60s
1955090;1576084791;BingoBoingo;http://trilema.com/2015/prophylaxis/
1955091;1576085739;feedbot;http://trilema.com/2019/the-contemplated-update-to-the-trilema-voice-model/ << Trilema -- The contemplated update to the #trilema voice model
1955092;1576087246;mp_en_viaje;BingoBoingo, um, it's not even mentioned there ?!
1955093;1576087334;BingoBoingo;Not explicitly but Aunt Dumb does get beat by the sex good, condoms cheat Aunt dumb outta babies from sex, more sex happens loop
1955094;1576087756;mp_en_viaje;yueah but this was a belabouredly explicit explanation of how all serious threats are positive feedback loops. iirc was in a medical context
1955095;1576088708;BingoBoingo;There's a discussion here in the planetary context http://trilema.com/2016/how-to-fix-global-warming/#footnote_0_70733
1955096;1576088767;BingoBoingo;Here in psych context http://trilema.com/2019/thelastpsychiatristcom-are-certain-behaviors-and-jobs-more-masculine-and-out-of-our-control-adnotated/#footnote_7_86241
1955097;1576089462;mp_en_viaje;well, these are all great and each more or less good enough, so...
1955098;1576089480;mp_en_viaje;i dunno, maybe the peroration i have in mind happened orally in the harem or who knows.
1955099;1576089567;BingoBoingo;That is a very live possibility.
1955100;1576091910;feedbot;http://qntra.net/2019/12/hell-freezing-over-afl-cio-endorses-trump-trade-agreement/ << Qntra -- Hell Freezing Over: AFL-CIO Endorses Trump Trade Agreement
1955101;1576095169;BingoBoingo;!!v 7D08CA31090F93DE7958E6C7933AD617760C1FBC5BE811BDEC715070DD101503
1955102;1576095172;deedbot;BingoBoingo paid lobbes invoice 8
1955103;1576097400;dorion_road;http://logs.ericbenevides.com/log/trilema/2019-12-10#1954817 << I'm looking forward to the article.
1955104;1576097401;ericbot;Logged on 2019-12-10 22:39:24 trinque: you will see this article sooner than the 15th, too.
1955105;1576097430;dorion_road;trinque mind clarifying which you mean though ? the article about [http://logs.ericbenevides.com/log/trilema/2019-12-10#1954813][trying out Gales and offering critque] or [http://logs.ericbenevides.com/log/trilema/2019-12-10#1954810][on why eating a product of socialists is stupid] ?
1955106;1576097431;ericbot;Logged on 2019-12-10 22:34:51 trinque: dorion_road: ftr I have no problem with trying out your thing and offering critique either. I do have a problem with armies that don't eat, so I'd love to hear how you plan to sustain the effort necessary to maintain an OS.
1955107;1576097431;ericbot;Logged on 2019-12-10 22:27:34 trinque: I'm going to write something on why eating a product of socialists is stupid, and if we must eat shit, eating the least shit is the move.
1955108;1576097481;dorion_road;http://logs.ericbenevides.com/log/trilema/2019-12-11#1954822 << [http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2017-12-02#1745646][make money].
1955109;1576097481;ericbot;Logged on 2019-12-11 03:42:21 mp_en_viaje: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-10#1954808 << yes, we did. and we are in the same place on that one, at this time too.
1955110;1576097481;ossabot;Logged on 2017-12-02 17:16:42 mircea_popescu: but otherwise -- everything's sough. you got tits ? make money. you can code ? make money. you can draw ? make money. you "got relations" / can pr/whatever the fuck you got ? MAKE MONEY!
1955111;1576097482;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-10 18:29:38 trinque: mp_en_viaje: I put it to you that without money inflow... what republic? I'd thought we'd arrived in the same place on that one, at the time.
1955112;1576097520;dorion_road;http://logs.ericbenevides.com/log/trilema/2019-12-11#1954825 << thank you.
1955113;1576097521;ericbot;Logged on 2019-12-11 03:44:44 mp_en_viaje: nor can i eschew signalling this point to dorion for the merry gang, specifically because he has little fucking idea about the underlying truths in the thick "engineering" sauce.
1955114;1576097546;dorion_road;http://logs.ericbenevides.com/log/trilema/2019-12-11#1954831 << perhaps I'm dull, but I'd appreciate it stated plainly in texan straight talk.
1955115;1576097547;ericbot;Logged on 2019-12-11 03:53:10 trinque: what is it you think I'm signaling to diana_coman's bunch?
1955116;1576097608;dorion_road;http://logs.ericbenevides.com/log/trilema/2019-12-11#1954839 << I'd say it's worth spelling out once and for all in an article, I'd read and comment. Publishing it would probably be cathartic too.
1955117;1576097609;ericbot;Logged on 2019-12-11 03:56:53 trinque: but gentoo's a piece of shit. if it's not apparent why, I'll definitely have to say why.
1955118;1576097844;dorion_road;http://logs.ericbenevides.com/log/trilema/2019-12-11#1954851 << trinque, [http://dorion-mode.com/2019/11/jwrd-computing-the-why-how-what-and-way-forward/][the business plan] for my venture with jfw.
1955119;1576097845;ericbot;Logged on 2019-12-11 04:13:36 mp_en_viaje: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-10#1954813 << they're doing a consulting gig, it's somewhat detailed on his blog, he even has a business plan / some description of actual sales activity in there.
1955120;1576097845;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-10 18:39:12 trinque: dorion_road: ftr I have no problem with trying out your thing and offering critique either. I do have a problem with armies that don't eat, so I'd love to hear how you plan to sustain the effort necessary to maintain an OS.
1955121;1576097940;dorion_road;http://logs.ericbenevides.com/log/trilema/2019-12-11#1954853 << yeah, it's still early, working with our first few clients since September, expecting more to start in February.
1955122;1576097940;ericbot;Logged on 2019-12-11 04:14:22 mp_en_viaje: it's not much as it stands, but i do believe they've targetted exceptionally well, and might perhaps be able to execute also. maybe even surive to iterate. in any case i intend to help them, within reason.
1955123;1576097999;dorion_road;http://logs.ericbenevides.com/log/trilema/2019-12-11#1954854 << if you're up for it, I'd also like to read about your experience there.
1955124;1576098000;ericbot;Logged on 2019-12-11 04:14:42 trinque: I've been in that business. It's hard, wish them well.
1955125;1576100051;feedbot;http://bingology.net/2019/pizarro-isp-closing-statement/ << Bingology - BingoBoingo's Blog -- Pizarro ISP Closing Statement
1955126;1576101561;dorion_road;http://logs.ericbenevides.com/log/trilema/2019-12-11#1954882 << it's not clear to me what you mean by database money.
1955127;1576101562;ericbot;Logged on 2019-12-11 04:37:25 trinque: so dorion_road, is the idea that there's a tmsr stack upon which what, systems are built for these folks holding piles of database money?
1955128;1576101937;dorion_road;With tmsr os, how much work to support the [http://trilema.com/2019/the-tmsr-os-implicit-clients/][implicit clients] isn't clear yet. I'm also not 100% clear on spyked, bvt and lobbes situation apart from gathering they've been consistently productive while working salary mines.
1955129;1576101966;dorion_road;I defintely have to think more about the [http://dorion-mode.com/2019/12/heading-tmsr-os/?b=4.%20Long%20Term#select][long term] monetization, but I see big potential.
1955130;1576102057;dorion_road;In the short term, jfw and I are going to integrate it into our service, which, at this point, aims at guiding the [http://dorion-mode.com/2019/11/jwrd-computing-the-why-how-what-and-way-forward/?b=The%20Learning%20Curve#select][right people] in [http://dorion-mode.com/2019/11/jwrd-computing-the-why-how-what-and-way-forward/?b=The%20Learning%20Curve#select][learning] how to lower their risk in
1955131;1576102057;dorion_road;transacting bitcoin, e.g. deploying a node, key generation, etc.
1955132;1576102123;dorion_road;Right now we're delivering the service primarily face to face, which [http://dorion-mode.com/2019/11/jwrd-computing-the-why-how-what-and-way-forward/#comment-28][mircea_popescu advised against]. More thinking about the pivot needs to be done, but with more sales, there will be more opportunity to make an offer to people that's competitive with salary mines.
1955133;1576102200;BingoBoingo;In very Uruguay things, an Asado related incident has lead to a relatively large wildfire in Rocha which is leading to closure of some of the few roads up that way. What a way to start tourist season.
1955134;1576104614;mp_en_viaje;in other lulz, iran bombing usg oil installations nao...
1955135;1576104668;mp_en_viaje;i guess im putting some bitcoin aside for when they start selling portland "yazidi" girls in a few years ?
1955136;1576105593;BingoBoingo;Events seem to be unfolding that way. Persia got bold again
1955137;1576105777;BingoBoingo;I'm guessing 'Portland Yazidis' will be a sorta budget substitute for the real thing?
1955138;1576108123;mp_en_viaje;nfi. it seems to me "yazidi" is practically how you say "bovine local population of no particular utility"
1955139;1576108143;mp_en_viaje;arabic for barrista, as it were.
1955140;1576108364;BingoBoingo;Ah, sorta like "Goy"
1955141;1576108538;mp_en_viaje;more like "cow"
1955142;1576109291;BingoBoingo;To my knowledge the label "cow" only differs in its greater specifity of labeled thing
1955143;1576112806;BingoBoingo;!!withdraw 1.38226328 14dtb2eeiZzmoNeASn2Q2psfpgrfkYreWy
1955144;1576112812;deedbot;Get your OTP: http://paste.deedbot.org/?id=wRQr
1955145;1576112853;BingoBoingo;!!v D1C8A1835D7E10CFDEF7FDDB74E977D61E09379FB0FE97F6BB06CBF4FA861122
1955146;1576112859;deedbot;http://paste.deedbot.org/?id=B-NA
1955147;1576112897;BingoBoingo;!!withdraw 1.15224083 1CkK7nVMp9pjZPaDbdPu94hA6B9sqkWx1P
1955148;1576112902;deedbot;Get your OTP: http://paste.deedbot.org/?id=aa7C
1955149;1576112947;BingoBoingo;FF0255E89B92905B9381FC571B9827FE1A3DD0EBB85E29C2B16E45F1BF1720E5
1955150;1576112961;BingoBoingo;!!v FF0255E89B92905B9381FC571B9827FE1A3DD0EBB85E29C2B16E45F1BF1720E5
1955151;1576112967;deedbot;http://paste.deedbot.org/?id=gOXd
1955152;1576120550;lobbes;http://logs.ericbenevides.com/log/trilema/2019-12-11#1955061 << let me know how I can clarify on my part; I dun mind going into whatever details you need.
1955153;1576120551;ericbot;Logged on 2019-12-11 22:09:54 dorion_road: With tmsr os, how much work to support the [http://trilema.com/2019/the-tmsr-os-implicit-clients/][implicit clients] isn't clear yet. I'm also not 100% clear on spyked, bvt and lobbes situation apart from gathering they've been consistently productive while working salary mines.
1955154;1576120558;lobbes;In other plans, I'm aiming to take a more treacherous approach to coding the [http://www.krankendenken.com/2019/12/workplan-december-2019/?b=Automated&e=bidding#select][auto-bidding] for auctionbot. I figure I can handle the majority sans-python, and instead simply leverage the postgres db it sits on (i.e. listen for insert into bid table, execute some postgres functions, spit results into outbox table, done). I'll make an article of what I come
1955155;1576120558;lobbes;up with in any case
1955156;1576137062;mp_en_viaje;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-11#1955087 << let me be clear here : your dedication is endearing, but the problem isn't using python, per se. if i thought it were, i'd have said ; if an absolute ban on usage were warranted i wouldn't say things like http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-11#1955003
1955157;1576137062;mp_en_viaje;i understand the ambiguity's innerving, and i understand the nude dedication behind "well, if it's bad, don't use it then".
1955158;1576137062;mp_en_viaje;this is a naive point of view, of the same nature as "all politicians are dubious so i don't vote" or "i've yet to meet a pure hearted maiden thus i have no truck with girls".
1955159;1576137062;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-11 23:24:41 lobbes: In other plans, I'm aiming to take a more treacherous approach to coding the [http://www.krankendenken.com/2019/12/workplan-december-2019/?b=Automated&e=bidding#select][auto-bidding] for auctionbot. I figure I can handle the majority sans-python, and instead simply leverage the postgres db it sits on (i.e. listen for insert into bid table, execute some postgres functions, spit results into outbox table, done). I'll mak
1955160;1576137062;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-11 13:08:26 mp_en_viaje: i dunno i support any particular action on the foregoing basis. but i also ain't gonna pass it in silence no mo.
1955161;1576137062;mp_en_viaje;this ~purely imaginary~ purity is the very problem ; maintaining it while ditching python's specifically keeping the devil while burning the totem. ~the very expectation~ that the world works a certain way, "cleanly" in this manner, the hallucination that it's always okay to find fleas in cottage cheese and knots in the reeds is why all this is problematic to begin with.
1955162;1576137067;mp_en_viaje;so how about instead of trying to shoehorn sql into supporting your idealism, you just "bang python like a cheap whore. use it, but ~don't expect~ it knows what to do with ifs ; give it tasks, but short and narrow, measurable and ~do not confide in it~. let it write against apache, not import its flask, let her do the dishes not invite her mother over to stay.
1955163;1576137072;mp_en_viaje;use it like it's the enemy, if you will, because it is ; this doesn't reduce to "don't use it".
1955164;1576137074;mp_en_viaje;this is the whole substance of that whole "old age and treachery" thing : that idealism (or platonism, or spherical chickenism, or w/e you call it) dun work irl. even if it appears to work in the mind.
1955165;1576137127;mp_en_viaje;in general though, that's the overarching point, gotta separate usage and confidence as a required ingredient of maturation.
1955166;1576137208;mp_en_viaje;BingoBoingo_, in other lulz, if 1) trump gets impeached and then 2) trump gets elected does he then 3) get to run again, because impeached term dun count ? :D
1955167;1576137247;mp_en_viaje;#ioniliescu
1955168;1576137310;diana_coman;ahahah, also #saracdarcinstit !
1955169;1576137856;mp_en_viaje;ikr ?
1955170;1576137862;mp_en_viaje;#bogatdarfrumos
1955171;1576138234;mp_en_viaje;http://trilema.com/2016/poor-women/#footnote_1_69667 << holy shit look what i found.
1955172;1576138257;mp_en_viaje;"I never bothered to review Love Liza because it's a shitty movie ; nevertheless shitty as it was it'd have provided an anchor for today's reference. The reason I write down this note is precisely to underscore as thickly as humanly possible this most important point : that you are in no position to judge what's not worth doing. Because the future is uncertain. It would have been worth doing, all 20 minutes it'd have taken me, so as to hav
1955173;1576138257;mp_en_viaje;e what to link here ; if only I were to somehow know months ago when I decided not to that months later in a discussion of women I'd have liked to have the reference. Yet I couldn't have known such a thing. Neither can you. Ever. And so instead of spending those twenty mintues there I spent five writing this note and fifteen fishing through the internets trying to identify which fucking bad film it was in the first place."
1955174;1576139829;mp_en_viaje;dorion, you about ?
1955175;1576141933;mp_en_viaje;apparently it's "your dedication's endearing" day in the republic. anyways, my man mode d : i get it, you're a serious and dedicated fellow, and you mean to do right by this sudden and immense pile fallen one day upon your head. good!
1955176;1576141933;mp_en_viaje;but it's massively overwhelming, you don't know what the fuck it even is or is supposed to be in plenty of angles ; so you yelp an' try to find some footing, and some purchase. which is cute.
1955177;1576141933;mp_en_viaje;it stops being cute when you start driving yourself nuts with it. how in god's own reddish hells are you supposed to say, aforehand, what [http://dorion-mode.com/2019/12/heading-tmsr-os/?b=Qualifications&e=contributing#select][the qualifications for contributing] are ? in the next two days, you're gonna produce that ? how ?
1955178;1576141935;mp_en_viaje;does being an alien disqualify one from contributing ? "but mp, what are the odds an alien shows up" dude, how the fuck do i know ? how the fuck do you know ? why take the wrong sort of position on [http://trilema.com/2014/an-hero-is-he/][uncappable outcome] ? are we protecting something here ? what is it ?
1955179;1576141938;mp_en_viaje;let it be, you don't care. you needn't care. you should not care. carelessness is a legitimate management technique, because wovon [man nicht sprechen kann] is a legitimate philosophical stance.
1955180;1576141941;mp_en_viaje;if, and look what a large if that is, you ever find yourself in the situation where there's two entities trying to solve the same problem and you absolutely must pick one, then you pick one. THEN. not fucking now, so far you're stuck with a trillion cubic miles of sky and like half a delta wing, they won't even ~meet~ unless you specifically direct them at each other.
1955181;1576141949;mp_en_viaje;if a beach bum walks into an internet cafe in indochina, ramen bowl in one hand and a found copy of eat, pray, love in the other, makes himself a key on keybase and offers to write a better garbage collector for you, you... what do you do ?
1955182;1576141953;mp_en_viaje;do you tell him to get a job ? do less drugs ? find some real shoes ? sure, why not. does that amount to "oh and also you're not qualified to help" ? why the fuck should you care enough to get yourself in people's way ? let them be, it's their life. he'll write it or not, defend it or not, it'll get accepted or not, used or not, which part of this is your problem ?
1955183;1576141958;mp_en_viaje;maybe the dude asks you a question. then you answer it. that's what you do. you don't go chasing about the street with pre-answers to questions nobody's asked yet ; if the guy asks whether he's qualified he probably isn't, which is not the end of the world, you're not qualified either. what the fuck qualification exam did i pass, per accidens & pro tempore's not a collegiate degree. this isn't homogenochina we're trying to reproduce here,
1955184;1576141962;mp_en_viaje;nobody even fucking knows how an os is made in the first place for the simple self-obvious reason nobody fucking made one yet. it's not farming. it's not anything like farming. i don't even know what the fuck it's like, maybe we live to figure it out, but so far we just have some good classes of what it can't be like is all.
1955185;1576141966;mp_en_viaje;the first imperative of management is "don't get in people's way". like the doctor's "firstly, don't harm", exactly. fail everything else but hold that up, you'll be a fine manager ; fuck that up nothing else you do can bring you above water.
1955186;1576142306;mp_en_viaje;there's some humongo tasks around here because nobody gives so much of a shit how big it is, if it has to be done. but IF. if. if it HAS TO BE done, then yes. not otherwise, the converse doesn't work, just because something's a humongous pile of comparable humongocity doesn't make it a republican task -- the criteria's the has to be done.
1955187;1576142385;mp_en_viaje;various things are relegated to a large warehouse of "nfi, we'll figure it out later" because they appear unmistakably humongous, and we're not so well satisfied they actually have to be done. so they wait -- this is what time does, if nothing else : it'll always resolve the "did it have to be done ?" quandary.
1955188;1576142443;mp_en_viaje;so, good news, you don't have to answer whether aliens may join or not, forget about it.
1955189;1576143669;mp_en_viaje;contrariwise, items 2 and 3 on that same list are quite needed ; 2 needn't be even usable as such, its importance is in getting that tree going, even if not one line of a genesis survives it in the final press nevertheless the tree wouldn't have existed without ; 3 is definitely the sort of key element we've been sorely neglecting to date.
1955190;1576143691;mp_en_viaje;now go forth an' stop burying the ledes, ye hear.
1955191;1576157236;dorion_road;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-12#1955110 << I'm thinking to keep it simple along the lines of : 1) register a key, 2) install a V, 3) maintain a blog where you : a) maintain a code shelf , b) publlish your work plans , c) publish articles for context on your vpatches, 4) maintain an irc connection to converse with people (point out '6 months' reading the log is recommended for
1955192;1576157236;dorion_road;context.).
1955193;1576157236;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-12 05:20:58 mp_en_viaje: it stops being cute when you start driving yourself nuts with it. how in god's own reddish hells are you supposed to say, aforehand, what [http://dorion-mode.com/2019/12/heading-tmsr-os/?b=Qualifications&e=contributing#select][the qualifications for contributing] are ? in the next two days, you're gonna produce that ? how ?
1955194;1576157258;dorion_road;do what interests you, what you think is important, do it well, talk with people.
1955195;1576157287;dorion_road;linking in extensive examples of established republican practices ; point out how there is no central code repository and version control system or even website, etc.
1955196;1576157371;dorion_road;mp_en_viaje does that ^ make sense to spell out in an article ?
1955197;1576157738;dorion_road;"you may be an alien, but you're gonna have to [http://trilema.com/2013/youre-gonna-have-to-learn-that-variety-speak/][learn that variety speak]."
1955198;1576158273;dorion_road;mp_en_viaje thanks for the don't get in people way likbez.
1955199;1576158306;dorion_road;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-12#1955122 << cool, I'm excited to write those.
1955200;1576158306;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-12 05:49:54 mp_en_viaje: contrariwise, items 2 and 3 on that same list are quite needed ; 2 needn't be even usable as such, its importance is in getting that tree going, even if not one line of a genesis survives it in the final press nevertheless the tree wouldn't have existed without ; 3 is definitely the sort of key element we've been sorely neglecting to date.
1955201;1576163830;BingoBoingo;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-12#1955099 << Well the 22nd amendment to the Consitution does give a 10 year total limit to presidenting, but... Insane common law jurisdiction where everything is made up as they go while further burdened by the weight of all English history to boot. Not out of the realm of possibility impeachment could be taken as nullifying his first term.
1955202;1576163830;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-12 04:02:12 mp_en_viaje: BingoBoingo_, in other lulz, if 1) trump gets impeached and then 2) trump gets elected does he then 3) get to run again, because impeached term dun count ? :D
1955203;1576165381;BingoBoingo;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-12#1955124 << You can probably call that "requirements" or "how to contribute" but the label "qualifications" seems like a poor match for describing those active processes.
1955204;1576165382;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-12 09:36:02 dorion_road: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-12#1955110 << I'm thinking to keep it simple along the lines of : 1) register a key, 2) install a V, 3) maintain a blog where you : a) maintain a code shelf , b) publlish your work plans , c) publish articles for context on your vpatches, 4) maintain an irc connection to converse with people (point out '6 months' reading the log is recommended for
1955205;1576167907;BingoBoingo;mp_en_viaje: In the very lulzy leaving a mess on the way out files: The "Banco Republica" has lines around their main branch composed of local old retired and pensioned derps applying for "un Prestamo de tus sueños"
1955206;1576170743;dorion_road;BingoBoingo, thanks, perhaps qualification isn't the best word. I did include "best practices" in there and meant qualification in the [https://www.etymonline.com/search?q=qualification][necessary precondition] sense ; had in mind the [http://trilema.com/2012/how-does-one-list-on-mpex/][mpex listing] process.
1955207;1576170948;mp_en_viaje;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-12#1955128 << i suppose a very defensively limited item like that may well work, why not.
1955208;1576170948;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-12 09:36:53 dorion_road: linking in extensive examples of established republican practices ; point out how there is no central code repository and version control system or even website, etc.
1955209;1576170963;mp_en_viaje;i guess maybe i misread what you were saying. anyways.
1955210;1576171019;mp_en_viaje;call it "how to contribute effectually, the guide" or something, "qualification"'s not the word there.
1955211;1576171053;diana_coman;dorion_road: you switched from [http://younghands.club/2019/12/07/rmd-plan-dec-7th-13th-2019/?b=guidelines&e=#select][guidelines/expectations] to [http://dorion-mode.com/2019/12/heading-tmsr-os/?b=Qualifications&e=contributing#select][qualifications and best practices] and they are not the same thing.
1955212;1576171097;mp_en_viaje;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-12#1955138 << pretty fucking sad.
1955213;1576171097;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-12 12:33:53 BingoBoingo: mp_en_viaje: In the very lulzy leaving a mess on the way out files: The "Banco Republica" has lines around their main branch composed of local old retired and pensioned derps applying for "un Prestamo de tus sueños"
1955214;1576171101;dorion_road;mp_en_viaje, diana_coman thanks, apologies for miwording.
1955215;1576171113;dorion_road;miswording*
1955216;1576171641;BingoBoingo;mp_en_viaje: The saddest part is that "un Prestamo de tus sueños" is exactly what they are marketing it as.
1955217;1576171966;BingoBoingo;What dreams do the 75+ set have that a loan enables rather than destroys? Probably a couple extra kilos of Asado de tira before they pass and the bank takes the house out from under the kids and grandkids who've not lived anywhere else.
1955218;1576175529;mp_en_viaje;aand in other participatory democracy news, i just spent an hour or so in the jacuzzi / saunas etcetera. upon leaving, i confiscated the girls' bathing suits
1955219;1576175556;mp_en_viaje;so now there's a table of sluts in the restaurant donning naught but their robes.
1955220;1576175579;mp_en_viaje;how they're gonna pay for it is anyone's guess ; though maybe i get there in time. IF THE LOGS ARENT TOO THICK!!!
1955221;1576175643;mp_en_viaje;BingoBoingo, imho, the old guys getting a steak and their kids and grandkids getting thrown out into the street is minimal justice in south america. in fact, i'd much prefer they were handled by albigensian crusade 2, kicked ~out of town~ not merely in the street ; and literally nude.
1955222;1576175669;mp_en_viaje;the socialism pipedream gotta be confronted at some point.
1955223;1576177538;BingoBoingo;mp_en_viaje: Just got back from getting my hair cut by the fossil who owns the joint. Probably my best haircut ever. Intense experience as the fellow with a resting parkisons tremor made copious use of the straight razor.
1955224;1576178144;BingoBoingo;Holy shit my standard expections of the Uruguayos up to today grossly underestimated the fall from what was.
1955225;1576187694;mp_en_viaje;heh
1955226;1576188257;BingoBoingo;And the haircut was the same ~10 bucks as always. I suspect the problem is... the Cathars were purged by the Church for Church reasons when they should have been squashed by the crown for being tards.
1955227;1576188779;mp_en_viaje;no, they were quashed by the crown for being tards. the problem is that was 1200, by 1400 they re-appeared, called "protestants" this time, and they weren't quashed that time.
1955228;1576188867;diana_coman;but did he know [http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2018-01-28#1777648][hair theory] ?
1955229;1576188868;ossabot;Logged on 2018-01-28 00:58:37 mircea_popescu: meanwhile in other chicks can code moments, "I earned my degree and license in cosmetology and had a horrible career as a hair dresser that I ended in 2015 due to social anxiety. I still love hair theory, and I even really enjoy working on people with whom I share a close relationship, but now I'm in pursuit of a new path."
1955230;1576188884;mp_en_viaje;i expect not.
1955231;1576188925;BingoBoingo;diana_coman: Not a single action on his part suggested anything informed by theory. Strict application of method as informed by practice.
1955232;1576188960;diana_coman;what can I say, I'll end up again with very-long-hair out of hating women's haircutters, lolz.
1955233;1576189170;mp_en_viaje;gotta find a gay dude.
1955234;1576189199;diana_coman;I tend to stress them out by taking a book with me, but I still resent-the-fucking-time-it-takes.
1955235;1576189232;mp_en_viaje;so go to one of those nails-and-hair spa things, get mutliple rabbits in the same half hour
1955236;1576189254;diana_coman;gah, nails, ugh.
1955237;1576189274;mp_en_viaje;bangs, acrylics & buttplugs!
1955238;1576189303;diana_coman;yeah, well, not exactly my interests, what can I say.
1955239;1576189331;BingoBoingo;It was hard for me to think much about the time this one took. Was too busy reminding myself Parkinsons is a resting tremor as the dude used a straight razor and comb instead of scissors.
1955240;1576189331;mp_en_viaje;in other news, how the fuck uk laboratory party can still lose seats ? the "conservative" / lulzparty got like 70% of the seats and it's still gonna pick up 50 ?
1955241;1576189568;BingoBoingo;mp_en_viaje: It seems the Tories have enough of a fracture within their ranks that there's a Torry for most every Labor voter to prefer.
1955242;1576189601;mp_en_viaje;must be russian tampering yes
1955243;1576189659;feedbot;http://qntra.net/2019/12/nginx-hit-by-russian-police-raid-over-copyright-drama/ << Qntra -- NGINX Hit By Russian Police Raid Over Copyright Drama
1955244;1576189661;BingoBoingo;Well, the biggest problem with elections are the voters.
1955245;1576201726;lobbes;http://logs.ericbenevides.com/log/trilema/2019-12-12#1955096 << ty for going into more detail on this btw. This makes a lot of sense now
1955246;1576201726;ericbot;Logged on 2019-12-12 07:55:31 mp_en_viaje: use it like it's the enemy, if you will, because it is ; this doesn't reduce to "don't use it".
1955247;1576227110;mp_en_viaje;man, watching uk labour, literally the oldest anglophone pantsuit bastion, go the way of the dnc...
1955248;1576227128;mp_en_viaje;"does the labour party even have a right to exit ?!" no, it very well fucking doesn't.
1955249;1576240113;BingoBoingo;mp_en_viaje: They don't. Labour forgets that they are the local "Regime change in Iraq" party which was a great way to fuck themselves into nothing as a "left" pantsuit party.
1955250;1576240191;*;mp_en_viaje recalls their triumphalist idiocy during thatcher election...
1955251;1576240199;mp_en_viaje;they have some history as a lolcow really.
1955252;1576240258;mp_en_viaje;v for vendetta (the original, 0-circulation pulp) was actually a by-product of radical labour core attempting ideological supremacy.
1955253;1576240397;mp_en_viaje;[http://trilema.com/2012/la-terra-trema/][as this things] ever [http://trilema.com/2016/consumerism-is-not-the-answer-though-it-will-put-you-to-sleep-or-american-history-x/][work], not only completely failed to engage anything, but also became the proverbial broken arm to be fucked in the ass with.
1955254;1576240660;BingoBoingo;Kinda how in every period record outside of their own reality distortion bubble, hippies were exactly materialistic theiving pichis
1955255;1576240725;mp_en_viaje;myeah
1955256;1576240852;BingoBoingo;Allowing them to defect back to society in the late 70s and 80s was a mistake.
1955257;1576241171;mp_en_viaje;except for the part where it's unclear such a thing as society exists, past 90s.
1955258;1576241352;mp_en_viaje;seems about as fake as "industry" or "economy", a putative imagined item, i'm supposed to believe "[http://trilema.com/2017/fake-news-are-just-one-tail-of-the-failed-female-state/][everything]'s online" just like i'm supposed to believe [http://trilema.com/2019/no-platforms/#footnote_0_87128][0-value] items are "an industry"
1955259;1576241353;mp_en_viaje;or [http://trilema.com/2016/to-be-clear-hillary-clinton-lost-the-presidential-election-on-june-16th-2016/][0-power] [http://trilema.com/2016/and-they-wont-fucking-yield/][lulz] are "the public oppinion" etcetera.
1955260;1576241394;mp_en_viaje;but somehow i just can't quite manage. what society ? what anything really, compare 1989 mtv with 2019 mtv, what "music" ? what anything ?
1955261;1576241464;BingoBoingo;mp_en_viaje: Well doesn't exists past 90s because they let the hippies shave and pretend submit in the 80's
1955262;1576241477;mp_en_viaje;i mean, the orcs visibly still imagine some kind of similar miami, across various orclands. but this is very flimsy existence indeed.
1955263;1576241712;BingoBoingo;That they do.
1955264;1576241796;mp_en_viaje;hows uy revolution these days ? died down like any football match ?
1955265;1576241848;BingoBoingo;mp_en_viaje: That little helicopter on tilt and the one tank was enough to calm the kids down.
1955266;1576241863;mp_en_viaje;wouldn't want to like, spill one's blood
1955267;1576241881;mp_en_viaje;or break a nail or something. there's so much more futuro awaiting, it;d be a pity if any of them missed any of it.
1955268;1576241883;BingoBoingo;As Tupamaro leader Mujica says "No hay que ponerse delante de tanque"
1955269;1576241899;mp_en_viaje;principally because the transmission'll prolly break.
1955270;1576241988;*;mp_en_viaje is watching some game of handball on tv in the background. "who's that one ?" "the blondy with the ponytail ?" "no, the other one" *tap* *tap* *tap* "1.69" "motherfucker".
1955271;1576242082;BingoBoingo;But yes, kids got scared. Didn't even seem to show up last week. They could be quietly wrecking shit somewhere else, or not obsessing over Saturday night-Sunday morning
1955272;1576242089;BingoBoingo;But...
1955273;1576242288;mp_en_viaje;or carefully preserving their very valuable contents. you know, for later.
1955274;1576242431;BingoBoingo;The ones that DID get caught. House arrest and not very much of it.
1955275;1576242555;mp_en_viaje;they have to provide their own house ?!
1955276;1576242703;BingoBoingo;Usually the mulas do that for them.
1955277;1576242820;BingoBoingo;"If you don't have a scolding old crone one will be assigned to you"
1955278;1576242830;mp_en_viaje;heh
1955279;1576242960;BingoBoingo;For the ones under 18, INAU, the infants and adolescents agency literally assignes court ordered old scolds to the kids
1955280;1576243024;mp_en_viaje;in other news, isil is evidently moving to a nuke. taking sahel uranium mines since summer ; the iranians are quite unhappy with the subsidy level so it looks like this is their "we'll do it without doing it" approach, transfer tech to isil.
1955281;1576243060;mp_en_viaje;dirty bombing in, eg, frankfurt, oslo, whatever uppity old woman strongholds quite feasible by 2025 in any case.
1955282;1576243103;BingoBoingo;Interesting developments
1955283;1576243136;mp_en_viaje;but, yeah, the "great victories" in afghanistan, iraq etc have resulted in what looks like a whole-north-africa caliphate in the making.
1955284;1576243229;mp_en_viaje;in other lulz, [https://www.hindustantimes.com/world-news/boris-johnson-wins-contest-to-become-next-uk-prime-minister/story-ahZT3KLvc5lwW2yiS971RJ.html][borish] johnson
1955285;1576243280;BingoBoingo;Well that Arab spring didn't seem to actually knock off any US/EU/NATO enemies. Just Ghaddafi who turned out to have been Europe's best friend this whole time.
1955286;1576243305;BingoBoingo;In one of the few times [https://i.redd.it/pwko5h637e441.jpg][History and Montevideo intersected]
1955287;1576243320;BingoBoingo;Fortaleza de Cerro in the background
1955288;1576243565;BingoBoingo;Biggest difference then to now is... THere
1955289;1576243580;BingoBoingo;'s less occupied structures in the neighborhood under the hill fort
1955290;1576243583;mp_en_viaje;gaddafi was old, and no actual successor available.
1955291;1576243792;BingoBoingo;Still, his sons probably had "Don't let dark africa discover boats can reach Europe" drilled into their heads since infancy
1955292;1576244383;mp_en_viaje;honestly i see no further point to europe. other than the high rents, the whiteboys north of the mediterranean are just as african as the black boys south.
1955293;1576244439;mp_en_viaje;in fact, probably the best thing one could do would be to take all the teenaged precious cuntlets from yurp and send them to niger & friends ; take the african girls in lieu.
1955294;1576244469;mp_en_viaje;nothing quite like a little bit of reality crash, if experience's any guide.
1955295;1576244521;mp_en_viaje;let 'em see how well "believe women" works on the mud floors, work out their "animal rights" aggenda on the goat that ate their last remainign crotchrag and so on.
1955296;1576244553;mp_en_viaje;nothing quite like sleeping nineteen to the room for solving nineteen year old's "social anxiety" / awkwardness.
1955297;1576244638;mp_en_viaje;famine-level poverty's in any case the best known solvent for girly pretense.
1955298;1576244697;mp_en_viaje;from "sex & the city" to "an apple a day's a dream faraway" in pretty much one short generation, huh. what wonders socialism hath wrought!
1955299;1576244833;BingoBoingo;God bless china buying all the New World food stuffs. I suspect Buenos Aires is prepping to do another run of export controls on beef now that their production's sorta recovered a decade later.
1955300;1576245041;BingoBoingo;At the same time China's floating a free-ish trade agreement with Uruguay's next government, yet to be published. I suspect the aim is among other things... to cut out the Miami based re-shippers.
1955301;1576245093;BingoBoingo;And generally reduce the US role as the place things go first before hitting the rest of the Americas.
1955302;1576245668;mp_en_viaje;they're also doing "anti-terrorism" mixed exercises with the serb militsya
1955303;1576245727;mp_en_viaje;transparently a "russkis couldn't protect you ; we will" demonstration, made all the more evident by the eurohag stance on it (ignore, rather than whine. whenever daddy's present the "liberated" cunts magically forget all the bullshit they have at the ready in all other circumstances)
1955304;1576245866;BingoBoingo;Well the chinese seem to be improving the message targeting. To Uruguay "Why deal with the US who exactly competes with your exports when we have so much synergy... Baja la costa de vida"
1955305;1576245870;mp_en_viaje;oh, and they're also buying 1bn worth of canadian gold mining interests.
1955306;1576245890;BingoBoingo;Well, they do like shiny
1955307;1576245943;mp_en_viaje;https://www.reuters.com/article/us-serbia-china-police-idUSKBN1Y21PK << "in an exercise at a Chinese-owned steel mill outside Belgrade."
1955308;1576246014;mp_en_viaje;oh, and in ongoing lulz : https://www.navytimes.com/naval/2019/12/06/with-china-gunning-for-aircraft-carriers-the-us-navy-says-it-must-change-the-way-it-fights/ "
1955309;1576246015;mp_en_viaje;To keep carriers relevant, the U.S. Navy must change how it fights, the new top officer says. (MC1 Toni Burton/U.S. Navy)
1955310;1576246015;mp_en_viaje;WASHINGTON Just because China might be able to hit U.S. Navy aircraft carriers with long-range anti-ship missiles doesnt mean carriers are worthless, the services top officer said Thursday."
1955311;1576246039;mp_en_viaje;funny shit, they're re-running 2014 tmsr logs, these people.
1955312;1576246164;mp_en_viaje;Look, people dont give us enough credit for the gray matter between our ears, and there are some very smart people we have thinking about how we fight better. " and assorted great keks.
1955313;1576246178;BingoBoingo;Lol, I saw the carrier piece's title on another site.
1955314;1576246213;BingoBoingo;Seems like syndicated spamstro-turf
1955315;1576246324;BingoBoingo;But I suppose this is how the USG press agents keep up with the times. They scroll back the logs 5 years and pretend the conversation was their own.
1955316;1576247106;mp_en_viaje;aahahahaha, check it out, half the republicans in the house are openly going to vote agqainst.
1955317;1576247121;mp_en_viaje;dnc tryina make it open vote, because they understadn they'll lose, but at least they want some drama out of it
1955318;1576247125;mp_en_viaje;bwahahahah what a fucking week
1955319;1576247164;mp_en_viaje;basically "we're imploding, the dnc is never getting another seat in the house, let's go out with a bang" kinda backfired as an exit strategy.
1955320;1576247489;*;BingoBoingo has newsing to do!
1955321;1576250001;feedbot;http://qntra.net/2019/12/airstrip-one-labour-party-suffers-greatest-collapse-since-1935-unlikely-to-recover/ << Qntra -- Airstrip One: Labour Party Suffers Greatest Collapse Since 1935, Unlikely To Recover
1955322;1576253126;feedbot;http://qntra.net/2019/12/african-bus-arsonist-who-tried-to-burn-50-italian-children-in-his-care-blames-wops-for-not-letting-more-of-his-people-in/ << Qntra -- African Bus Arsonist Who Tried To Burn 50 Italian Children In His Care Blames Wops For Not Letting More Of His People In
1955323;1576261990;feedbot;http://ossasepia.com/2019/12/13/a-walk-among-the-trees-of-v/ << Ossa Sepia -- A Walk among the Trees of V
1955324;1576266293;mp_en_viaje;!Q later tell hanbot https://4.bp.blogspot.com/-ei8CbiT4Hhs/VGP0mq3X_YI/AAAAAAAAABc/JhPPjuKEXaM/s1600/elephant.gif
1955325;1576266293;lobbesbot;mp_en_viaje: The operation succeeded.
1955326;1576267211;mp_en_viaje;diana_coman, http://ossasepia.com/2019/10/31/working-with-ideals-and-perfections/?b=the%20history&e=whole#select << isn't that part weird ?
1955327;1576267779;diana_coman;mp_en_viaje: uhm, it is, apparently it's some messed up footnote, lemme see.
1955328;1576279143;diana_coman;I fixed the issue though it's rather weird: for one thing I distinctly rememvber it was *fine* ie all of it in a footnote so not sure what/when broke, ugh; for the other, I had to split it into 2 footnotes - it was *fine* to take 2 spans but not the 3rd? wtf is this.
1955329;1576288157;trinque;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-11#1954934 << I've meanwhile reviewed the article http://trilema.com/2019/the-contemplated-update-to-the-trilema-voice-model/
1955330;1576288158;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-11 04:45:58 mp_en_viaje: so specifically trinque is this feasible iyo ? and everyone else also, is an hour too short a time ? other comments ?
1955331;1576288171;mp_en_viaje;how's it look ?
1955332;1576288185;mp_en_viaje;diana_coman, it can't be the size, i tested this
1955333;1576288188;trinque;entirely feasible, will respond to the article tomorrow after more thought, and some rest.
1955334;1576288200;trinque;looks right-thing shaped to me.
1955335;1576288214;mp_en_viaje;trinque, it's not an emegency, it's end of december. by spring or whatever will be fine.
1955336;1576288241;mp_en_viaje;eminently not the sort of thing one has to do over xmas.
1955337;1576288277;trinque;nah, I'm going to do my best to uncoil the spring.
1955338;1576288313;trinque;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-11#1955038 << both.
1955339;1576288314;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-11 16:59:12 dorion_road: trinque mind clarifying which you mean though ? the article about [http://logs.ericbenevides.com/log/trilema/2019-12-10#1954813][trying out Gales and offering critque] or [http://logs.ericbenevides.com/log/trilema/2019-12-10#1954810][on why eating a product of socialists is stupid] ?
1955340;1576288314;ericbot;Logged on 2019-12-10 22:34:51 trinque: dorion_road: ftr I have no problem with trying out your thing and offering critique either. I do have a problem with armies that don't eat, so I'd love to hear how you plan to sustain the effort necessary to maintain an OS.
1955341;1576288314;ericbot;Logged on 2019-12-10 22:27:34 trinque: I'm going to write something on why eating a product of socialists is stupid, and if we must eat shit, eating the least shit is the move.
1955342;1576288330;trinque;the products of men are shaped by their politics.
1955343;1576288512;trinque;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-11#1955047 << the politics of the "men" who made linux (not the kernel, but the whole turd) are contempt.
1955344;1576288513;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-11 17:01:08 dorion_road: http://logs.ericbenevides.com/log/trilema/2019-12-11#1954831 << perhaps I'm dull, but I'd appreciate it stated plainly in texan straight talk.
1955345;1576288513;ericbot;Logged on 2019-12-11 03:53:10 trinque: what is it you think I'm signaling to diana_coman's bunch?
1955346;1576288558;trinque;narrowly, in its time, of microsoft. "whatever, literally anything is better than microshit" and now, of themselves, living in their own shit.
1955347;1576288598;trinque;I am particularly aggressive to this, it being isomorphic to the church environment in which I was raised.
1955348;1576288600;trinque;both must die
1955349;1576288667;trinque;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-11#1955049 << c'est possible
1955350;1576288668;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-11 17:02:10 dorion_road: http://logs.ericbenevides.com/log/trilema/2019-12-11#1954839 << I'd say it's worth spelling out once and for all in an article, I'd read and comment. Publishing it would probably be cathartic too.
1955351;1576288668;ericbot;Logged on 2019-12-11 03:56:53 trinque: but gentoo's a piece of shit. if it's not apparent why, I'll definitely have to say why.
1955352;1576288783;trinque;ah, to speak less obliquely! protestantism, of course.
1955353;1576288841;trinque;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-11#1955051 << shall digest.
1955354;1576288841;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-11 17:06:06 dorion_road: http://logs.ericbenevides.com/log/trilema/2019-12-11#1954851 << trinque, [http://dorion-mode.com/2019/11/jwrd-computing-the-why-how-what-and-way-forward/][the business plan] for my venture with jfw.
1955355;1576288841;ericbot;Logged on 2019-12-11 04:13:36 mp_en_viaje: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-10#1954813 << they're doing a consulting gig, it's somewhat detailed on his blog, he even has a business plan / some description of actual sales activity in there.
1955356;1576288842;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-10 18:39:12 trinque: dorion_road: ftr I have no problem with trying out your thing and offering critique either. I do have a problem with armies that don't eat, so I'd love to hear how you plan to sustain the effort necessary to maintain an OS.
1955357;1576288966;mp_en_viaje;i dont know, man. from where i'm sitting, and i'll readily admit i'm not some sort of linux scholar over here, it seems to me torvalds came in two decades ago on a sorta-kinda wishy-washy platform, and a bunch of perfectly respectable men went with him because well, sorta-kinda wishy-washy is better than nothing, and because being an engineers they didn't know better. they were, so to speak, pre-headfucked by pantsuit agitprop, like cult-r
1955358;1576288966;mp_en_viaje;aised children are pre-molested even before anyone bothers fucking them, they're groomed to respond "well" to moelestation.
1955359;1576288996;mp_en_viaje;and then of course he turned around and took them right "home", like all of these asshats do, "mencius modlbug" was the same thing, Framedragger 's stupid whore same thing, etcetera etcetera.
1955360;1576288997;trinque;that's a better bridge from protestantism to gentooism than I could've built.
1955361;1576289011;trinque;premolested is exactly right.
1955362;1576289060;mp_en_viaje;the switch part was i suppose self-obvious to anyone but me.
1955363;1576289316;trinque;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-11#1955056 << it's hard because the flow of money through your business determines the shape of your product, which is to double down on what I said above. skillfully done, you accumulate a generally useful set of tools and the job gets easier, til eventually it's more of a product play than consulting
1955364;1576289317;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-11 17:08:41 dorion_road: http://logs.ericbenevides.com/log/trilema/2019-12-11#1954854 << if you're up for it, I'd also like to read about your experience there.
1955365;1576289317;ericbot;Logged on 2019-12-11 04:14:42 trinque: I've been in that business. It's hard, wish them well.
1955366;1576289412;trinque;if you're taking clients with very different problems all the time, that'd result in an incoherent accumulation of disjunct items.
1955367;1576289430;trinque;and when you're bootstrapping, you need that money, so yes, hard.
1955368;1576289476;mp_en_viaje;his saving grace is that his clients are in fact very similar idiots in the relevant aspects, which is why i said well targetted. that's the key to success, always find a group of such idiots that, ideally, don't even realise it.
1955369;1576289481;trinque;yep that's great
1955370;1576289499;mp_en_viaje;but oherwise, yes that's the bane of technical consulting.
1955371;1576289557;mp_en_viaje;his other advantage is that he needs less money than absolutely anybody.
1955372;1576289614;mp_en_viaje;the two major money leaks in traditional start-ups are by very far 1 [http://trilema.com/2015/you-know-what-gets-no-airplay-unflattering-truth/][the pretense pump], wherein tiny new cos end up paying frisco rents because "iotherwise how to atteact employees"
1955373;1576289615;trinque;heh, speaking of the pantsuit labeling everything its opposite, obviously the dorks with laptops are the most capital intensive businesses!
1955374;1576289626;mp_en_viaje;and a distant 2, the cost of payroll.
1955375;1576289647;trinque;this because burn-rate, also labeled its opposite, a positive, because it justifies a higher valuation, somehow.
1955376;1576289678;mp_en_viaje;but even leaving aside how a good wot means more access to capital than any fiat bank arrangements can provide -- the ideological structure well protects him from 1 and much helps hiom with 2, by supporting strong partnerships.
1955377;1576289678;trinque;ha, you beat me to it.
1955378;1576289692;mp_en_viaje;he can get away with overheads incomprehensible for any other start-up
1955379;1576289736;mp_en_viaje;yup, there's an entire body length of lacerations and bleeding sites he dun have to deal with here. which is what they call an edge in business.
1955380;1576289749;mp_en_viaje;dorion_road, you read that article above btw ?
1955381;1576289755;trinque;going back to "what is trinque signaling to dorion_road?" do not take ^ as some kind of invincibility.
1955382;1576289775;mp_en_viaje;actually, i don't recall you ever saying, either of you ever been involved with start-ups in any capacity ?
1955383;1576289786;trinque;I've started and sold and etc, yes
1955384;1576289808;mp_en_viaje;be very explicit because it greatly benefits you for us to know how you're fucked in the head. like the doctor gotta know if you've been fucking any skinny girls in behind-the-bar alleys.
1955385;1576289813;mp_en_viaje;not you lol, i know about you.
1955386;1576289821;trinque;ah
1955387;1576289874;trinque;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-11#1955059 << database money is me being a hipster instead of saying "accounting"
1955388;1576289875;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-11 18:08:03 dorion_road: http://logs.ericbenevides.com/log/trilema/2019-12-11#1954882 << it's not clear to me what you mean by database money.
1955389;1576289875;ericbot;Logged on 2019-12-11 04:37:25 trinque: so dorion_road, is the idea that there's a tmsr stack upon which what, systems are built for these folks holding piles of database money?
1955390;1576289988;trinque;take the deedbot wallet. the assets aren't in the thing; it just counts them.
1955391;1576290014;trinque;same with your panamanian guy. he doesn't have the assets in his desk drawer.
1955392;1576290043;trinque;and I'm certain his tech for keeping track of which wire's going to whom, who's getting their dubaloos put in what paper, is primitive.
1955393;1576290086;mp_en_viaje;it's a fucking [http://trilema.com/2012/law-enforcement-never-fails-to-unintentionally-entertain/][excel], what. they all are.
1955394;1576290114;trinque;mmmmmhm
1955395;1576290129;trinque;dork I know does this in oil
1955396;1576290378;mp_en_viaje;everyone.does. every leak i ever got was excel. no exceptions.
1955397;1576298651;BingoBoingo;In blood, stones, and squeezing Argentina's new-old government is... inventing new official outgoing exchange rate to shave capital flight, if there was any left to go flying http://archive.is/xmsuL
1955398;1576306091;mp_en_viaje;wtf 5bn spent abroad, this is entirely imaginary
1955399;1576306101;mp_en_viaje;if the whole of argentina spent 5mn last year its a wonder
1955400;1576306167;feedbot;http://trilema.com/2019/zig-zag/ << Trilema -- Zig-zag
1955401;1576316396;diana_coman;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-13#1955265 - maybe it's something specific to the 3d block there that messes it up though it's not all that likely (if for no other reason than the basic 1. at first it worked 2. it still works as a separate footnote); anyways, I don't think it's worth the time right now to chase it fully.
1955402;1576316396;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-13 21:58:40 mp_en_viaje: diana_coman, it can't be the size, i tested this
1955403;1576316556;diana_coman;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-13#1955280 - looks more like easily triggered by it than effectively aggressive to it.
1955404;1576316556;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-13 22:05:33 trinque: I am particularly aggressive to this, it being isomorphic to the church environment in which I was raised.
1955405;1576316751;diana_coman;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-13#1955290 - this sounds right to me although I rather hesitate on the "perfectly respectable" - I mean, precisely not so perfectly given the "pre-headfucked" as you put it (and I'm not sure it's that at all ie some external rather than internal lack).
1955406;1576316752;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-13 22:11:41 mp_en_viaje: i dont know, man. from where i'm sitting, and i'll readily admit i'm not some sort of linux scholar over here, it seems to me torvalds came in two decades ago on a sorta-kinda wishy-washy platform, and a bunch of perfectly respectable men went with him because well, sorta-kinda wishy-washy is better than nothing, and because being an engineers they didn't know better. they were, so to speak, pre-headfucked by pant
1955407;1576319951;mp_en_viaje;diana_coman, well yeah but i mean, before it fails all pig iron's perfectly respectable. after, you find out it had a bubble.
1955408;1576320571;diana_coman;I guess so.
1955409;1576338301;feedbot;http://qntra.net/2019/12/north-korea-bolstering-nuclear-deterrent-this-holiday-season/ << Qntra -- North Korea Bolstering Nuclear Deterrent This Holiday Season
1955410;1576343663;trinque;diana_coman: I'm not going to do the "hurr, be a man and toil in this mountain of boy's cumsocks" thread again.
1955411;1576343780;diana_coman;trinque: it has/had nothing to do with that either; but sure.
1955412;1576344487;trinque;diana_coman: did the point of comparing open source to protestantism not make sense, or what
1955413;1576344536;trinque;it's idiotic to equate "this man is loudly saying X is foolhardy" with "X man is a bitch" every time it comes up.
1955414;1576344546;trinque;you may recall me getting similarly loud before pizarro crashed.
1955415;1576344579;trinque;if there's anything to which I'm developing an allergy, it's the hubris cycle.
1955416;1576345071;diana_coman;trinque: the comparison OS/protestantism made sense; I get the allergy to hubris cycle too, now that you say it explicitly; my point above was though precisely re loud-before-crashed esp given the long silence -punctured at times briefly, sure- before that; ie the outbursts themselves I get but I don't see to be very useful really.
1955417;1576345430;diana_coman;and just to be on the clear side: it's not against "loudly saying X is foolhardy", not at all; if it's not clear though, I'll give it a rest.
1955418;1576345431;trinque;you realize where I live the aggression threshold for "unpleasant company" is set way higher, or no?
1955419;1576345451;diana_coman;trinque: you are not unpleasant company that I see, no.
1955420;1576345453;trinque;one yells at his friends for going off the same cliff over and over again.
1955421;1576345461;diana_coman;does it help ?
1955422;1576345476;trinque;apparently this depends on the counterparty.
1955423;1576345505;trinque;at any rate, I consider myself heard on the hubris cycle, and I've already committed to a few bile-soaked pieces on linux and other things.
1955424;1576345884;trinque;dorion_road: btw, your gales has the same problem mp_en_viaje pointed out about my cuntoo. it doesn't actually have the sources of the dependencies. one provides those as tarballs.
1955425;1576345931;trinque;totally solvable problem, and I expect what you'd do ends up looking what I've been working on.
1955426;1576345988;trinque;or wait, jfw I think?
1955427;1576346008;trinque;at any rate one of you has a beard almost as awesome as mine.
1955428;1576346163;trinque;"While I have striven to make prudent and security-conscious choices, I am not attempting to keep up with the "penetrate and patch" rat-race in its many third-party components." << This is somewhat concerning, in that you say "eh" about the "many third-party components". I'd instead try for the minimal possible bootable src surface area.
1955429;1576346219;trinque;suppose someone's going to kill you for losing their 1000btc with this thing. What then about "not keeping up with the rat race"?
1955430;1576346255;trinque;^ it's this I mean by "let money flow over it, and let money shape it"
1955431;1576346793;trinque;I don't think you expect to actually be yourselves patching acpica autoconf automake bash bc bison bzip2 cl-hyperspec clisp dash db flex gales-util gcc64 git gnupg less libevent libressl libusb links m4 man-pages man-pages-posix mandoc ncurses nginx ocaml openssh patch pciutils perl php56 py-setuptools python python-docs qmail readline redis sbcl sqlite sqlite-doc tmux ucspi-tcp vim xz zlib
1955432;1576347224;dorion_road;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-14#1955357 << I think the source tarballs are available on the mirror. A problem with not publishing has been this source distribution is only being worked through now. I'll let jfw comment further.
1955433;1576347224;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-14 14:00:22 trinque: dorion_road: btw, your gales has the same problem mp_en_viaje pointed out about my cuntoo. it doesn't actually have the sources of the dependencies. one provides those as tarballs.
1955434;1576347332;dorion_road;trinque those are the packages in gports. some have patches by jfw. a task for tmsr.os is to list all the dependencies for the implicit clients. so many of those in that Gales gports list may not make it in tmsr.os.
1955435;1576347413;dorion_road;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-14#1955358 << nice, I'd definitely like to read more about what you're working on.
1955436;1576347413;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-14 14:01:10 trinque: totally solvable problem, and I expect what you'd do ends up looking what I've been working on.
1955437;1576347430;dorion_road;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-13#1955270 << sweet.
1955438;1576347431;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-13 22:00:11 trinque: nah, I'm going to do my best to uncoil the spring.
1955439;1576347482;dorion_road;^^ I meant to link this one http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-13#1955271
1955440;1576347483;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-13 22:00:48 trinque: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-11#1955038 << both.
1955441;1576347498;trinque;dorion_road: it's more a comment that "why isn't your patch a vpatch atop the gales genesis"
1955442;1576347571;dorion_road;ah, right. that's a big shortcoming of Gales, didn't use V from the start.
1955443;1576347594;trinque;I skipped it in cuntoo as well, for equally bad reasons.
1955444;1576347682;dorion_road;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-13#1955279 << systemd now, what, a couple million lines of C ? 'open source', i.e. shit that's not microsoft.
1955445;1576347682;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-13 22:04:53 trinque: narrowly, in its time, of microsoft. "whatever, literally anything is better than microshit" and now, of themselves, living in their own shit.
1955446;1576347697;dorion_road;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-13#1955280 << thanks for sharing
1955447;1576347697;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-13 22:05:33 trinque: I am particularly aggressive to this, it being isomorphic to the church environment in which I was raised.
1955448;1576347707;dorion_road;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-13#1955282 << cool.
1955449;1576347708;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-13 22:06:42 trinque: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-11#1955049 << c'est possible
1955450;1576347724;dorion_road;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-13#1955286 << thanks! I look forward to any comments/questions
1955451;1576347725;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-13 22:09:35 trinque: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-11#1955051 << shall digest.
1955452;1576347793;dorion_road;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-13#1955296 << that makes a lot of sense. processes and tools are being built in this first stage. for exmple, we have exercises/problem sets after working with these first clients. that's a product we can tweak/adjust/refine moving forward, but a lot of the work is done.
1955453;1576347794;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-13 22:17:31 trinque: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-11#1955056 << it's hard because the flow of money through your business determines the shape of your product, which is to double down on what I said above. skillfully done, you accumulate a generally useful set of tools and the job gets easier, til eventually it's more of a product play than consulting
1955454;1576347920;dorion_road;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-13#1955299 << right, we start of with a clear offer, "hey, this is what you can gain from working with us," but are open to more custom deals if it makes sense.
1955455;1576347921;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-13 22:19:07 trinque: if you're taking clients with very different problems all the time, that'd result in an incoherent accumulation of disjunct items.
1955456;1576348063;dorion_road;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-13#1955301 << lol!
1955457;1576348063;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-13 22:20:10 mp_en_viaje: his saving grace is that his clients are in fact very similar idiots in the relevant aspects, which is why i said well targetted. that's the key to success, always find a group of such idiots that, ideally, don't even realise it.
1955458;1576348247;dorion_road;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-13#1955309 << yeah, partnerships, referral agreements, etc. is what we're after, especially with Panama's prolabor labor laws.
1955459;1576348247;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-13 22:23:32 mp_en_viaje: but even leaving aside how a good wot means more access to capital than any fiat bank arrangements can provide -- the ideological structure well protects him from 1 and much helps hiom with 2, by supporting strong partnerships.
1955460;1576348327;dorion_road;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-13#1955313 << yeah, a while back and it made its impact on me. probably due for a re-read here sooner rather than later though.
1955461;1576348327;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-13 22:24:44 mp_en_viaje: dorion_road, you read that article above btw ?
1955462;1576348638;dorion_road;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-13#1955315 << I shared a [http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/ossasepia/2019-10-16#1006596][bit] in #o a couple months back, and have some overdue articles to publish detailing, but the short is I worked 2 years for euro pacific bank, a start up at the time.
1955463;1576348639;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-13 22:25:10 mp_en_viaje: actually, i don't recall you ever saying, either of you ever been involved with start-ups in any capacity ?
1955464;1576348639;ossabot;(ossasepia) 2019-10-16 dorion: in 2010 I came across Peter Schiff, American investor who forecast 2008 financial crisis. this opened me up to seriously exploring what things are and ultimately lead me to decide by spring 2011 I would do what I had to do to work for him. in January 2012, he advertised openings for commission only sales people to move out of usia and work for his new bank, www.europacbank.com .
1955465;1576348666;trinque;ha! that's pretty cool actually!
1955466;1576348772;dorion_road;yeah, it was fun and I learned/grew a lot. can for sure think of worse ways to spend one's 22nd and 23rd years.
1955467;1576348908;dorion_road;in 2013 I met evoorhees in Panama, and took a job with Coinapult in 2014 to run customer service. I did some business development and got exposure to qa for the ~year that lasted.
1955468;1576349109;dorion_road;the ceo and cto of coinapult spun off a development company and I did some consulting with them, but they didn't finish the software they started and I transitioned to work with jfw.
1955469;1576349250;trinque;why didn't they finish? ran out of steam?
1955470;1576349265;trinque;this isn't an insult btw; I've been a part of several that did.
1955471;1576349285;dorion_road;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-13#1955317 << I've certainly found that to be the case in opening up and asking diana_coman help me kill my stupidity.
1955472;1576349285;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-13 22:25:42 mp_en_viaje: be very explicit because it greatly benefits you for us to know how you're fucked in the head. like the doctor gotta know if you've been fucking any skinny girls in behind-the-bar alleys.
1955473;1576349351;dorion_road;trinque they got lost on engineering loops and yeah, ran out of steam.
1955474;1576349523;trinque;most of these failures in my own life amounted to mp_en_viaje's "toward purpose", i.e. they were narcissists reaching for objects conjured in their own imaginations, primarily to create the feedback necessary to sustain said narcissism.
1955475;1576349573;trinque;my lately talking only of money isn't greed, so much as trying to humble myself into hustling for that dirty dollar^Wbuttcorn instead of ^
1955476;1576349657;trinque;well hell, it's greed too. :p
1955477;1576349754;trinque;back to the subj, what does a europac bank need, in your experience?
1955478;1576349795;trinque;schiff's an interesting guy, has some of the right ideas, but it almost seems an accident from the outside.
1955479;1576349839;trinque;i.e. "if we just let markets work" etc., the libertarian thing where the forces that aggregate into govt "just" wise up.
1955480;1576350029;dorion_road;trinque I'll circle back to that in a bit, talking with diana_coman in #o
1955481;1576350656;trinque;in reading her logs, I couldn't agree with her more. bbl
1955482;1576358036;mp_en_viaje;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-14#1955358 << i don't think they've been thinking about it before in these terms ; but yes solvable. what's more : not only solvable, but beneficially solvable. it's one thing when cleaning up the place is approachable ; it's another thing when cleaning up the place not only is approachable, but actually approaching it necessarily provides an answer to why your scissors kept disappearing. as th
1955483;1576358036;mp_en_viaje;ey work towards properly genesis-ing the thing, whichever points of resistence they end up encountering are bound to be quite informative.
1955484;1576358036;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-14 14:01:10 trinque: totally solvable problem, and I expect what you'd do ends up looking what I've been working on.
1955485;1576358239;diana_coman;carrying over from #o as it's possibly of interest re jfw's code: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/ossasepia/2019-12-14#1013020
1955486;1576358240;ossabot;(ossasepia) 2019-12-14 diana_coman: jfw: I went through your keksum proggy and it's been quite a pleasure really; a few nitpicks on top of [http://fixpoint.welshcomputing.com/2019/keksum-a-keccak-implementation-in-c-as-standalone-unix-utility-genesis/#comment-122][those]: 1. why default/fallthrough on "bad option" instead of the more useful help option? 2. you have nicely \t everywhere except in usage_err in main.c where it's \s 3. just out of curiosity re
1955487;1576358280;diana_coman;he'll end up doing a 3rd regrind of that genesis but once he does it, I'll sign and mirror it.
1955488;1576358288;mp_en_viaje;not bad.
1955489;1576358306;*;mp_en_viaje is annoyed by reference @acpica intelshit, but there's ~nothing he can do about it atm
1955490;1576358340;diana_coman;well yes; and there are also C-specific annoyances but I don't think *those* are his fault now either.
1955491;1576358357;mp_en_viaje;nothing to do with him at all, this is re the gales prereq pile
1955492;1576358377;mp_en_viaje;honestly i'd much prefer an acpi-free machine, myself.
1955493;1576358398;mp_en_viaje;i can't think of any desirable element in it whatsoever.
1955494;1576358460;diana_coman;I don't really have anything to offer as a counterargument to that.
1955495;1576358496;mp_en_viaje;i get it, thing comes with supposed full sources that supposedly build ; i don't know that anyone worth any confidence even tried to in the past however many years. it's still building the wrong way, what the fuck os-awareness of power button. whole fucking point of even having a power butto nin the first place is to have an ALTERNATIVE control mechanism to the operating system.
1955496;1576358569;diana_coman;the usual "we're innovating aka corrupting because reasons", as far as I see it, yes.
1955497;1576358622;*;diana_coman glares at zcx
1955498;1576358773;mp_en_viaje;heh
1955499;1576358949;mp_en_viaje;in the same vein i suspect bison is massively suboptimal wrt algorithms chosen, elegance of implementation, length, pretty much everything. would prolly greatly beenfit from a rewrite.
1955500;1576358979;diana_coman;ahahaha; that reminds me of the "compilers" course at uni where ...
1955501;1576358992;mp_en_viaje;prolly should say bison-flex
1955502;1576359000;mp_en_viaje;nfi why they're even separate.
1955503;1576359015;diana_coman;so you have to flex the bison, no other reason that I can see.
1955504;1576359018;mp_en_viaje;makes about as much sense as axe head / handle separation
1955505;1576359096;mp_en_viaje;basically software that's not outright banned falls either in the gpg category, like bison etc above, "barely working, extremely bloated, would greatly benefit from rewrite" ; or else in utf category, "massively fucking stupid implementation, would love nothing more than the right surgical silk to suture the wound with correctly".
1955506;1576359127;mp_en_viaje;there's some slow migration from 2 to 1, like eg dns. but by and large...
1955507;1576359631;mp_en_viaje;diana_coman, truth be told there's this immense, but i do mean IMMENSE pile of accumulated tech debt via "i'll do it tomorrow" [http://trilema.com/2015/racists-and-the-racist-idea/?b=later%20when&e=?#select][device]
1955508;1576359700;mp_en_viaje;i expect there's shit that still requires the same re-read and re-write it did back before the berlin wall.
1955509;1576359757;diana_coman;quite possibly, I can see it.
1955510;1576359762;mp_en_viaje;jfw, more's the point, why the fuck import git at all ?
1955511;1576359974;mp_en_viaje;also, you're probably stuck dropping nginx altogether
1955512;1576360072;mp_en_viaje;xz AND zlib lol ok, this discussio ncan continue later.
1955513;1576360736;mp_en_viaje;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-14#1955407 << this is actually a pretty accomplished description of the problem.
1955514;1576360737;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-14 15:01:02 trinque: most of these failures in my own life amounted to mp_en_viaje's "toward purpose", i.e. they were narcissists reaching for objects conjured in their own imaginations, primarily to create the feedback necessary to sustain said narcissism.
1955515;1576360791;mp_en_viaje;most beings an engineer produce useful things only as an unintentional / coincidental byproduct of an internal cycle of self-assuaging that's broadly unrelated to anything else.
1955516;1576360882;mp_en_viaje;ye olde [http://trilema.com/2014/fred-quimby-and-ancient-evils/?b=let%20me%20just%20say&e=1957#select][hb] problem.
1955517;1576360973;mp_en_viaje;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-14#1955411 << there's been [http://archive.is/Oaxjz][some casual effort] put into quantifying that accident question.
1955518;1576360973;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-14 15:05:33 trinque: schiff's an interesting guy, has some of the right ideas, but it almost seems an accident from the outside.
1955519;1576361116;mp_en_viaje;the principal problem with the approach is that the guy is a radio personality, his statements are never that i've seen structured enough to constitute meaningful prediction. they're closer to statements of sentiment, and the value of sentiments depends chiefly on what your sentiments for the sentiment-er are. if it turned out nancy pelosi loved you deeply what'd it pay ?
1955520;1576361232;mp_en_viaje;otherwise, items like eg http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2017-08-16#1699371 very much speak to him. dude had the general idea, but then it turned out it wasn't gold, it was something entirely else. was he "right" ? or was he "wrong" ?
1955521;1576361233;ossabot;Logged on 2017-08-16 15:28:19 mircea_popescu: asciilifeform i suspect the gold people are very subjectively hurt by bitcoin doing what gold "Was supposed to do" and haet.
1955522;1576361424;mp_en_viaje;the same sort of naivity permeates throughout, "oh, the dollar will crash". doesn't enter his mind to wonder "against what". it's been sorta-kinda crashing against the euro, i guess, but i mean look at the fucking euro. the whole fucking concept of the dubaloo is that "it hasn't what to crash against" ; and everyone's complicit -- the chinese sure as fuck don't want it crashing against themselves, for instance. the republic's pretty much t
1955523;1576361424;mp_en_viaje;he only entity that can afford the fiats crashing against its currency, and lo that it has.
1955524;1576361454;mp_en_viaje;but schiff dun know about that, because i guess [http://trilema.com/2013/how-to-fail-the-scott-locklin-method/][scott locklin mental issues].
1955525;1576361617;mp_en_viaje;and so on in this vein, yes us is confronting a "crisis of confidence" in the sense of complede decredibilization -- but it's [http://qntra.net/2015/11/obama-at-asean-money-overwhelms-ideas/][purely political], not monetary ; and its underlying is mindblowing military weakness, not industrial inefficiency. not that the latter's absent, but phenomena are driven by what they happen to be driven, not by the larger or most visible element. peo
1955526;1576361617;mp_en_viaje;ple routinely fall in love with smart girls to the tune of 1 in 10mn because of their ass, that's ok-ish, but ok-ish to the tune of 1 in 500.
1955527;1576361788;mp_en_viaje;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-14#1955410 << it's surfing, exactly. without an actual navy ready to bombard, 1800s gunboat diplomacy style, a bank's as meaningless as "a jet engine", or "a liver". they don't do anything by themselves.
1955528;1576361788;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-14 15:04:52 trinque: back to the subj, what does a europac bank need, in your experience?
1955529;1576384764;mp_en_viaje;meanwhike in dead things, http://vagendamagazine.com/2015/07/we-need-a-lie-down-2/
1955530;1576389986;feedbot;http://trilema.com/2019/minutes-of-their-lives/ << Trilema -- Minutes of their lives
1955531;1576395758;feedbot;http://trilema.com/2019/the-orc-in-miami/ << Trilema -- The orc in Miami.
1955532;1576409888;mp_en_viaje;meanwhile in russki attacks upon the aspietards' worldview, http://archive.is/MGIUx
1955533;1576409938;mp_en_viaje;i think trump should be impeached for this totally blatant abuse of his office and meddling in congress pipedreaming where everyday hardworking americans' right to hallucination is cruelly mocked and manipulated by cynical foreigners.
1955534;1576410007;mp_en_viaje;#toxicupboats
1955535;1576422235;BingoBoingo;In other news, the Argentines went from proposing the tourist dollar to finalizing their rate for it. 30% over official. I suspect the blue is going to have to beat 30% over official
1955536;1576422331;BingoBoingo;They are also pushing their retarded export tax up because "el campo tiene que pagar también.
1955537;1576422735;BingoBoingo;North and South american hallucinationeering seems to be approaching convergence
1955538;1576445705;mp_en_viaje;pretty fucking lulzy. the only ~actual~ measure that could conceivably work, ie the olde "we select the top 100 hottest athenian maidens every year and send them over as tribute" not yet occuring to them, huh.
1955539;1576445938;mp_en_viaje;who the fuck taxes ~exports~ anyway ?! this might be the dumbest thing i ever heard, everyone's ~subsidizing~ exports, the euros give a >20% tax break with their whole vat scam, the chinos prolly more though it's byzantine, these idiots actually TAX it ?
1955540;1576445971;mp_en_viaje;i suppose the argentine team shows up at the boxing olympics, lines up and starts punching out its own face, too ?
1955541;1576446069;mp_en_viaje;this is kinda why i say, the numbers are bullshit, what billions, 1 mn is factually exaggerate : IF they actually had some exports of any consequence, taxing them would be too stupid to try. the only way to do this sort of dumb shit is if the base is 0 anyway ; then you can tax it, triple it, whatever -- it all comes out same (=0) in the end
1955542;1576448540;mp_en_viaje;in other lulz, holy shit "red 2" is a crappy movie. what the fuck were these people even smoking, you wanna talk of deplorables, this set of singer-songwriter vhs-america hanger ons is the stiffest contender. who the fuck is dean parisot even, wtf.
1955543;1576456649;feedbot;http://trilema.com/2019/messrs-doo-i-sprat-international-communications-partners/ << Trilema -- Messrs. D.O.O. & I. Sprat, International Communications Partners.
1955544;1576465659;mike_c;hey all
1955545;1576465721;mike_c;I've been following the snsa wind down recently. Makes sense at this point, and I'm sorry it didn't work out!
1955546;1576465769;mike_c;having been there a couple of times myself, I empathize.
1955547;1576465951;mike_c;As an ex-shareholder, I was not surprised but still impressed at the orderly liquidation.
1955548;1576466237;mike_c;I pulled a MPEX statement in november, but post-dividend I have not been able to (getting the 'Unrecognized signature. Please email your public key first.')
1955549;1576466311;mike_c;Thought I'd ask if anything changed with the proxies or other mechanisms in the last couple of weeks that might have gummed things up.
1955550;1576488308;spyked;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-10#1954731 <-- I've been all good for the last week, but I got caught up in meat works (finding new apartment and starting to move, mostly) just when I was about to catch a breath. unfortunately breathing's gonna have to wait until the end of the month.
1955551;1576488309;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-10 00:11:17 mp_en_viaje: yo spyked, how's the vomit business thsee days ?
1955552;1576488414;spyked;!Qlater tell dorion_road in UEFI study/review news, I'm behind with all my tasks on the subject. I'm slowly getting back on track this week, aiming to have a report published by monday the 23rd
1955553;1576488520;spyked;got other write-ups piled in addition to that, they'll slowly get done this week
1955554;1576488550;spyked;and well, answering comments etc.
1955555;1576488663;spyked;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-09#1954632 <-- I'm certainly looking at that, wanna sample some items for both daily use and testing. the apu1 seems like a good candidate
1955556;1576488663;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-09 11:54:20 dorion_road: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-07#1954458 << I'd tend to agree with the suspicion. First I think it'd be helpful to know the cost of acquiring TMSR bootbable hardware. Defining was TMSR bootbale hardware means and listing the 'known good' board that are already supported by coreboot or similar would be a good start.
1955557;1576488815;spyked;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-10#1954760 <-- certainly looks like a spin on greenspun's rule: any system that amasses enough complexity (for some values of "enough", at least) becomes a contender for the "operating system" label. imho emacs, wp, cltrons all fit in there.
1955558;1576488816;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-10 12:10:44 BingoBoingo: Reading the ongoing conversations in the forums and castles, I get a building suspicion [http://ossasepia.com/2019/12/06/cutting-through-the-tangles-notes-on-graphics-in-eulora-vii/#comment-7162][that further cutting on Gentoo is going to start looking like cutting on CrystalSpace]
1955559;1576505722;mp_en_viaje;o look who the cat dragged in!
1955560;1576505743;BingoBoingo;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-15#1955471 << The export tax seems to be a supreme admission of poverty. If they don't do it all of the garbage they produce will leave. ANd they they will have none
1955561;1576505744;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-15 17:44:10 mp_en_viaje: pretty fucking lulzy. the only ~actual~ measure that could conceivably work, ie the olde "we select the top 100 hottest athenian maidens every year and send them over as tribute" not yet occuring to them, huh.
1955562;1576505746;mp_en_viaje;!Q later tell mike_c on the road right now, i'ma look at it tonght/tomorrow morning depending on traffics
1955563;1576505752;mp_en_viaje;!Qlater tell mike_c on the road right now, i'ma look at it tonght/tomorrow morning depending on traffics
1955564;1576505764;mp_en_viaje;wth am i doing wrong now
1955565;1576505863;mp_en_viaje;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-15#1955478 << kinda disappointing i suppose, from the pov of "well, we invested, were patient for years, y bupkiss!"
1955566;1576505863;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-15 23:17:48 mike_c: I've been following the snsa wind down recently. Makes sense at this point, and I'm sorry it didn't work out!
1955567;1576505870;mp_en_viaje;then again, there's other povs readily available.
1955568;1576505903;mp_en_viaje;lobbes, bot down ?
1955569;1576505963;mp_en_viaje;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-16#1955487 << tis the season to be jolly, tanananana nana na na.
1955570;1576505963;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-16 05:38:18 spyked: and well, answering comments etc.
1955571;1576506073;mp_en_viaje;uuu, the laksa's here.
1955572;1576506109;*;mp_en_viaje shall bbl. take it easy all!
1955573;1576506516;feedbot;http://qntra.net/2019/12/node-js-garbage-dump-npm-admits-to-malware-enabling-pheature/ << Qntra -- Node.js Garbage Dump NPM Admits To Malware Enabling Pheature
1955574;1576507696;lobbes;^ lobbesbot back up; sorry folx (and wb mike_c)
1955575;1576521376;feedbot;http://thetarpit.org/2019/sunt-un-orb << The Tar Pit -- Sunt un orb, a piece by Horaiu Mlele
1955576;1576549166;mike_c;mp_en_viage: thanks, no rush.
1955577;1576549181;mike_c;lol, *mp_en_viaje
1955578;1576572633;mp_en_viaje;mike_c yeah, as it happens i can tell you what got "gummed up" : you got [http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2018-07-14#1834535][negrated] meanwhile. what, this escaped your notice ?
1955579;1576572633;ossabot;Logged on 2018-07-14 12:11:05 mircea_popescu: !!rate mike_c -10 http://trilema.com/2017/the-practical-costs-of-hallucinated-freedom/
1955580;1576572639;mp_en_viaje;you shouldn't even be able to speak here ; coincidentally nobody could be arsed to plug the particular hole, it [http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-13#1955268][wasn't deemed that high a priorty], but that doesn't mean you have thereby acquired some kinda license to abuse.
1955581;1576572640;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-13 21:59:09 mp_en_viaje: trinque, it's not an emegency, it's end of december. by spring or whatever will be fine.
1955582;1576572645;mp_en_viaje;i suggest you find a lord willing to speak for you, because i'm not interested in hearing what else you have to say. pick a limber one, too, you sure can use the help (and whoever you are -- make sure you get paid well, and in advance. pantsuits love their zone so much, let them have what they like, it's the least you could do for them).
1955583;1576572653;mp_en_viaje;now back on the record here : i have absolutely no intention of reinstating his mpex account. that ain't happening ; but that aside i also have no problem paying, in principle. god knows i've been paying loads of these, and what's a hundred btc or whatever, who even cares about pennies like that (right ?).
1955584;1576572663;mp_en_viaje;however i'm also getting prety sick of all this self-uppity cuntery whereby douche "gets upset" at mpex/republic/the world. as if there even CAN BE such a thing as "upset at the totality of existence".
1955585;1576572664;mp_en_viaje;don't you know, all that is ain't good enough for him, he has all these many other imaginary options that aren't, and [http://trilema.com/2019/the-orc-in-miami/?b=division-by-zero&e=magics#select][in not being "are"] all so much better, important, whatever. truly, the republic's like bounty bar wrappers, who even cares, hallucinaria's where it's at.
1955586;1576572675;mp_en_viaje;years later, when it turns out [http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-09-07#1934510][they really weren't], as it happens ALL THE FUCKING TIME, with ornery regularity... then it's suddenly weasel time. we were good friends all along, right ? he just took a nap while we carried, what's the problem.
1955587;1576572675;ossabot;Logged on 2019-09-07 03:28:41 mircea_popescu: the matter SIMPLY CAN NOT BE IGNORED : if back in 2017, ie the very month that article came out, joe bloe took out the 20-50k in debt he could and liquidated the 20-50k in assets that he could, converting it to bitcoin at a monthly average $1k, he'd be looking now at either 400k to 1mn in cold hard cash, or else something like 1-1.5mn worth of liquidated assets, if he sold during the peak. (and not AT the peak,
1955588;1576572683;mp_en_viaje;until that time comes, it's the optionality show on days of his lives channel, no problemo. like for instance he could... what could he do ? he could never miss a day of tv, or jury duty, or sucking dick at the airport, or whatever the fuck else (by which "else" i do mean ~same~) they do in the zone.
1955589;1576572687;mp_en_viaje;for that he'll get 100 just [http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-09-16#1936658][as soon as he spends 105] and no sooner -- but he'll gladly count that as "getting 100", because [http://trilema.com/2018/memoranda-of-congress/#footnote_2_77974][pantsuitlogic] ;
1955590;1576572687;ossabot;Logged on 2019-09-16 05:51:56 snsabot: Logged on 2019-09-15 21:06:04 lobbes: indeed, is a scam. I fell for the 'well, my mortgage will be a fixed cost vs rising rents' thinking, but neglected to factor in cost of maintenance, rising property taxes, whathaveyou
1955591;1576572694;mp_en_viaje;whereas the 10`000 the republic made him in the same fucking interval out of a piddly 1 he accidentallied in there is... you know, not enough. too much trouble. and also blablabla yadda yadda & "people themselves".
1955592;1576572694;mp_en_viaje;then he picks up the coin mpex, and the republic, made him, and kept safe for him, and dumps it on [http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2018-06-27#1830144][the dumbest] scam [https://archive.is/BbeY3][du jour] he can find. [http://btcbase.org/log/2013-11-13#379090][that'll show everyone]! and boy-howdy does it show...
1955593;1576572694;a111;Logged on 2013-11-13 21:06 Bugpowder: I lost enough for a few teslas on JD though
1955594;1576572694;mp_en_viaje;(in other lulz, apparently http://trilema.com/2019/forum-logs-for-25-oct-2014/ is broken somehow. was gonna link in it, but obviously now will hafta wait.)
1955595;1576572694;ossabot;Logged on 2018-06-27 12:30:52 mircea_popescu: as far as anyone knows, usg is still churning the same bitcoin dust it got by clicking on faucets back in 2012. first it "sold it" via the usms scam, now it "captured" it and so following.
1955596;1576572700;mp_en_viaje;so... i think it's high time we have a conversation about it, and a l1 consultus on the topic, and so forth. what, exactly, is the negrated to get from the republic ? and why ? and wherefore ?
1955597;1576572701;mp_en_viaje;i get we're basically getting scammed by the duplicitous nature of the lazy, and will be, forever. cuz that's how the world goes, that's how laziness survives as a survival mechanism in the first place. but i'd much rather we understand each other on the topic, than it just proceed on my authority and then whatever, ten years later it'll be "mp just shouldn't have paid all these asshats" or who the fuck knows what (priorly seen) nonsense.
1955598;1576572707;mp_en_viaje;i'll be exploring nis today ; and will be in sofia sometime tomorrow so we can have a proceeding on all these interesting topics no earlier than then.
1955599;1576572726;mp_en_viaje;an' i shall gladly read the positions of everyone as published in the meanwhile.
1955600;1576573330;*;mp_en_viaje shall bbl.
1955601;1576577154;*;diana_coman shall be mulling this over for a bit.
1955602;1576593264;*;lobbes has acknowledged the need for mulling; will also mull
1955603;1576596092;BingoBoingo;!Qlater tell mike_c Your are cordially invited to GPGgram details of your situation to me or come into #agriculturalsupremacy and get me up to speed on your situation in a logged channel.
1955604;1576596092;lobbesbot;BingoBoingo: The operation succeeded.
1955605;1576596104;BingoBoingo;!Qlater tell mike_c This is a high risk case, and it presents an especially high danger for anyone arguing it on your behalf. My greatest asset is my WoT position, and should I argue your case and recover the coin... The argument that will have won your coin will present a risk to my WoT position if it is later found to be bad precedent.
1955606;1576596104;lobbesbot;BingoBoingo: The operation succeeded.
1955607;1576596121;BingoBoingo;!Qlater tell mike_c I am willing to argue your case. Without your providing more details the cost structure is as follows: 35 BTC up front, 10 BTC to be refunded if my argument on your behalf loses. The best way for you to start negotiating this price downward is starting a conversation about the case in #agriculturalsupremacy
1955608;1576596122;lobbesbot;BingoBoingo: The operation succeeded.
1955609;1576596251;*;BingoBoingo to mull a bit, but has been mulling the potential for situations like this since the http://trilema.com/2017/the-practical-costs-of-hallucinated-freedom/ negrating waves
1955610;1576597943;BingoBoingo;!Qlater tell mike_c Since the discussion appears ready [http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-17#1955528][to happen sooner rather than later] I give you the option of sending 35BTC to 15eVXAW7k8uKc5moDFUSc9Y3jmHFAenNXo as a retainer. As it is 2019 I'll assume 35 BTC arriving at the address is yours and not someone else's misfire.
1955611;1576597943;lobbesbot;BingoBoingo: The operation succeeded.
1955612;1576597943;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-17 05:00:53 mp_en_viaje: so... i think it's high time we have a conversation about it, and a l1 consultus on the topic, and so forth. what, exactly, is the negrated to get from the republic ? and why ? and wherefore ?
1955613;1576598150;*;BingoBoingo very curious about the prices other members of the Lordship list will offer... If any have the appetite at all for taking on the substantial downside risk of winning...
1955614;1576599373;BingoBoingo;There are good arguments for paying sleepers who slept their way into negratings, but... I am anti-inclined to give them away for free.
1955615;1576602458;dorion_road;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-16#1955485 << ok, thanks for the update. I'm looking forward to your report monday.
1955616;1576602458;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-16 05:36:02 spyked: !Qlater tell dorion_road in UEFI study/review news, I'm behind with all my tasks on the subject. I'm slowly getting back on track this week, aiming to have a report published by monday the 23rd
1955617;1576602495;dorion_road;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-16#1955488 << nice. I've not used the apu1 myself.
1955618;1576602495;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-16 05:40:11 spyked: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-09#1954632 <-- I'm certainly looking at that, wanna sample some items for both daily use and testing. the apu1 seems like a good candidate
1955619;1576616238;diana_coman;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-17#1955541 - I have to admit that I rather considered this sort of situations to be more a matter between the people directly involved and as such it didn't seem to me that there was a need for some sort of upfront decision.
1955620;1576616238;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-17 11:33:27 BingoBoingo: to mull a bit, but has been mulling the potential for situations like this since the http://trilema.com/2017/the-practical-costs-of-hallucinated-freedom/ negrating waves
1955621;1576616301;BingoBoingo;diana_coman: It's a nuanced thing. There is very good reason the proposal I put in channel is structured *exactly* the way it is.
1955622;1576616338;diana_coman;having refreshed my memory with the concrete dates and multiple missed questions/enquiries has been tending towards very infuriating indeed.
1955623;1576616373;BingoBoingo;Infuriating has nothing to do with it.
1955624;1576616461;diana_coman;BingoBoingo: I get the impression there's some parallel talking here, lol; I wasn't linking my "infuriating" with your proposal, lolz.
1955625;1576616553;BingoBoingo;diana_coman: Ah, I thought maybe you were taking the infuriating nature of the things encountered during the research as informative of the price/shape of my proposal.
1955626;1576616604;diana_coman;no, not at all.
1955627;1576616896;diana_coman;BingoBoingo: I can see at least from one angle how&why you'd structure the proposal precisely as you did; at any rate though, it's your proposal and your consideration of the issue so if the exact reasoning behind it is to be explained, it will be explained by you, surely.
1955628;1576616993;diana_coman;I have to admit that I can't quite see a way one would go exactly about making a decision based on a case argued on this sort of thing but then again, it would be the first so I don't find it all that surprising that it's not clear upfront, ofc.
1955629;1576617081;BingoBoingo;I can't explain the proposal or the strategy in plaintext unless it is accepted by the one requiring an advocate in the forum.
1955630;1576617370;diana_coman;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-17#1955517 - I can fully see this, usually a sort of "can pick and choose".
1955631;1576617371;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-17 05:00:17 mp_en_viaje: however i'm also getting prety sick of all this self-uppity cuntery whereby douche "gets upset" at mpex/republic/the world. as if there even CAN BE such a thing as "upset at the totality of existence".
1955632;1576617383;diana_coman;BingoBoingo: btw my "infuriating" was precisely caused by ^
1955633;1576617724;BingoBoingo;diana_coman: In mike_c's case, I am very confident I can make the case that gets his coin back. The argument is grounded in Republican doctrine as I understand it, proceeds from cause, does not import Pantsuitisms, and is incredibly removed from the late ROTA's derpitude.
1955634;1576617832;diana_coman;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-17#1955528 - thing is, even "the negrated" is not an entirely clear thing for me; I could see it as "loss of citizenship hence of rights" at one extreme; it is however just that - one extreme.
1955635;1576617832;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-17 05:00:53 mp_en_viaje: so... i think it's high time we have a conversation about it, and a l1 consultus on the topic, and so forth. what, exactly, is the negrated to get from the republic ? and why ? and wherefore ?
1955636;1576617995;diana_coman;I suppose not even the extreme actually, no, hm.
1955637;1576617998;BingoBoingo;I don't even see loss of citizenship and therefore rights as an extreme meaning of a negrating, especially at -10. That's more of a -1, -2
1955638;1576618014;diana_coman;yeah, had just cross-typed.
1955639;1576619249;diana_coman;BingoBoingo: my main trouble is not at all with the payment, in principle, but mainly with the notion of a single, clear meaning for "negrated", to start with.
1955640;1576619313;diana_coman;!!reputation mike_c
1955641;1576619314;deedbot;http://paste.deedbot.org/?id=Bo96
1955642;1576619673;diana_coman;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-17#1955528 - ie, I find I simply can't answer this in the form stated.
1955643;1576619673;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-17 05:00:53 mp_en_viaje: so... i think it's high time we have a conversation about it, and a l1 consultus on the topic, and so forth. what, exactly, is the negrated to get from the republic ? and why ? and wherefore ?
1955644;1576619927;diana_coman;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-17#1955529 - there is certainly this ie being scammed, yes.
1955645;1576619928;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-17 05:00:55 mp_en_viaje: i get we're basically getting scammed by the duplicitous nature of the lazy, and will be, forever. cuz that's how the world goes, that's how laziness survives as a survival mechanism in the first place. but i'd much rather we understand each other on the topic, than it just proceed on my authority and then whatever, ten years later it'll be "mp just shouldn't have paid all these asshats" or who the fuck knows what
1955646;1576621544;feedbot;http://qntra.net/2019/12/chinese-navy-takes-delivery-of-first-domestically-built-aircraft-carrier/ << Qntra -- Chinese Navy Takes Delivery Of First Domestically Built Aircraft Carrier
1955647;1576626883;lobbes;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-17#1955551 << I keep coming back to this point. The meaning of any rating is something that each individual must weigh for themselves, isn't it? Could there be a 'blanket' upfront decision as such? (Very possible I'm just not picking up the nuance, however)
1955648;1576626884;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-17 17:06:35 diana_coman: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-17#1955541 - I have to admit that I rather considered this sort of situations to be more a matter between the people directly involved and as such it didn't seem to me that there was a need for some sort of upfront decision.
1955649;1576644491;jfw;!!v 5C14A1306AAE9FFAFA022C333F51410201693496F3C601CABB55D59705518A2C
1955650;1576644491;deedbot;jfw rated jfw_travel 2 << Me, on the road.
1955651;1576663129;diana_coman;!!v 65767CE701462226C3BFB1FA2B5E5F1AD8C7B004D31AE8E0FC9CE20F64BBCA0B
1955652;1576663129;deedbot;diana_coman updated rating of alex__c from 1 to -2 << chose to do nothing with all the time in the world.
1955653;1576663161;diana_coman;!!v B48BDF4ACFA97D549A9DF00FCB3C72D25F5EA29B24976CE4317A5F2064C64117
1955654;1576663161;deedbot;diana_coman rated billymg 2 << mp-wp trimming and testing; on the move to CR; writes at http://billymg.com/
1955655;1576663198;diana_coman;!!v 0D55D205FBDA56C46413B06D0B1E39DC4B55842A52B4E1E8B12C505A7D76A0FF
1955656;1576663198;deedbot;diana_coman updated rating of dorion_road from 1 to 2 << travel key of my page, dorion: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-11-19#1951606
1955657;1576663198;ossabot;Logged on 2019-11-19 18:54:36 deedbot: dorion rated dorion_road 1 << my key for the road, 201911-202001
1955658;1576663221;diana_coman;!!v BD9DB780CFBB636859EB99F94202AE51AC5098FE63D28FC9D1A58A40B3C5BFF9
1955659;1576663221;deedbot;diana_coman rated jfw_travel 2 << travel key of my page, jfw: http://welshcomputing.com/jfw_travel-cert.asc
1955660;1576663252;diana_coman;!!v 04D6F1EB1CCD6139827C8879D2AEC35D467971FEC08CC3992586DB019A999DE1
1955661;1576663253;deedbot;diana_coman updated rating of juliankunkel from 2 to 1 << busy being a CS lecturer at Reading Uni.
1955662;1576686923;BingoBoingo;!Qlater tell mike_c Here's the strategy and why it is your best shot at recovering your coin http://paste.deedbot.org/?id=7sEi
1955663;1576686924;lobbesbot;BingoBoingo: The operation succeeded.
1955664;1576701958;feedbot;http://qntra.net/2019/12/democratically-elected-us-president-donald-trump-writes-letter-to-pantsuit-nancy/ << Qntra -- Democratically Elected US President Donald Trump Writes Letter To Pantsuit Nancy
1955665;1576705958;jfw;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-13#1955315 - besides the present self-funded efforts with dorion, yes, kinda:
1955666;1576705958;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-13 22:25:10 mp_en_viaje: actually, i don't recall you ever saying, either of you ever been involved with start-ups in any capacity ?
1955667;1576706162;jfw;my first and longest 'real' job was with an IT consulting shop, started in 2000 amid the dotcom rubble by some IBM mainframe & Linux people; they self-bootstrapped starting from existing relationships and had reached maybe 15 people when I started in 2007. I did mainly internal sysadmin work.
1955668;1576706234;jfw;No fancy office there, many worked from home. 'Excel shop' like all of 'em of course.
1955669;1576706464;jfw;That'd be my template for a more conservative startup I suppose. When I moved to Panama (late 2013) and met dorion, he had recently started an entry-level position at Coinapult, which was running on Wall St. financing. I met some of them, at one point inquired about a job but was declined.
1955670;1576706963;jfw;After their hack / loss and change of ownership, they downsized to 3-4 people, none of whom could really maintain the redeployed systems. So I ended up doing some part-time for them in 2016. This was short-lived: I found their priorities entirely out of whack, it looked like they were headed for nothing but more trouble, and they didn't listen to me on much of anything. The pretense pump I reckon.
1955671;1576708256;jfw;trinque: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-14#1955361 - I don't disagree on either point really, but not sure what anyone can realistically say about the current software mess beyond 'eh'. Minimizing or moreover replacing socialistware with sane things is the long term approach, but meanwhile one still needs things to work. I'm curious to see what you're cooking for sure.
1955672;1576708256;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-14 14:05:02 trinque: "While I have striven to make prudent and security-conscious choices, I am not attempting to keep up with the "penetrate and patch" rat-race in its many third-party components." << This is somewhat concerning, in that you say "eh" about the "many third-party components". I'd instead try for the minimal possible bootable src surface area.
1955673;1576708508;jfw;"minimal possible bootable" seems a slippery goal, you could trim down to barely any OS at all. But then some pesky user comes along and wants graphics, and TCP, and to run on recent iron and then what.
1955674;1576708747;mp_en_viaje;geez sophia is a shithole.
1955675;1576708756;mp_en_viaje;sofia* whatevs.
1955676;1576708802;mp_en_viaje;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-17#1955537 << no it doesn't, wut, im gonna get pissy at x because he made a sound argument ?
1955677;1576708803;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-17 11:31:00 BingoBoingo: !Qlater tell mike_c This is a high risk case, and it presents an especially high danger for anyone arguing it on your behalf. My greatest asset is my WoT position, and should I argue your case and recover the coin... The argument that will have won your coin will present a risk to my WoT position if it is later found to be bad precedent.
1955678;1576708811;mp_en_viaje;i only get pissy at nubbins-"arguing"
1955679;1576708870;jfw;trinque: one approach is if money flows and wants patching support, to sell subscriptions covering some defined set of things. Do such clients exist? I don't know but seems like these tend to be large corps already in submission to USG and can just as well buy RedHat
1955680;1576708886;mp_en_viaje;in other news, tukey internet is kinda iffy. if i blink nobody panic.
1955681;1576709035;mp_en_viaje;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-17#1955551 << i don't think this view is sound, because it essentially destroys the possibility of a republic. the term literally denotes "things held in common". whether these are women, sacks of grain, ships, itineraries or ideas can be mixed and matched ; but that SOMETHING will be held in common, and thus not "between the people themselves" is the quintessential prerequisite of a republic, and in genera
1955682;1576709035;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-17 17:06:35 diana_coman: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-17#1955541 - I have to admit that I rather considered this sort of situations to be more a matter between the people directly involved and as such it didn't seem to me that there was a need for some sort of upfront decision.
1955683;1576709132;jfw;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-14#1955362 - that'd be why I'm sewing an air-gapped wallet by hand. No amount of software-level patching can protect 1000btc sitting on networked PC I figure.
1955684;1576709132;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-14 14:05:58 trinque: suppose someone's going to kill you for losing their 1000btc with this thing. What then about "not keeping up with the rat race"?
1955685;1576709712;jfw;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-14#1955376 - to make my reasons for inclusion by reference rather than importing trees explicit, even if bad: on my own I was certainly in no position to pay the maintenance debts of all those projects, so I wanted some separation between my own work and them. As I see it now, the trouble is this doesn't actually solve anything if you still have to use
1955686;1576709712;jfw;them
1955687;1576709712;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-14 14:28:53 trinque: I skipped it in cuntoo as well, for equally bad reasons.
1955688;1576710003;jfw;though tbh, the reasons also included following the pattern of other distributions.
1955689;1576710103;mp_en_viaje;l human society as such.
1955690;1576710107;mp_en_viaje;meh this is annoying.
1955691;1576710188;mp_en_viaje;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-17#1955560 << why not ? there's some claims made, some answers to them, proposed terms of settlement justified or not, a settlement reached or not...
1955692;1576710189;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-17 17:19:10 diana_coman: I have to admit that I can't quite see a way one would go exactly about making a decision based on a case argued on this sort of thing but then again, it would be the first so I don't find it all that surprising that it's not clear upfront, ofc.
1955693;1576710197;mp_en_viaje;it's all the heart and soul of the rational process.
1955694;1576710273;mp_en_viaje;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-17#1955566 << what exactly it means surely could benefit from some clarification. one strong strand in there is the (so far well formalized in history) "i am not interested in what you have to say"
1955695;1576710273;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-17 17:33:09 diana_coman: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-17#1955528 - thing is, even "the negrated" is not an entirely clear thing for me; I could see it as "loss of citizenship hence of rights" at one extreme; it is however just that - one extreme.
1955696;1576710405;mp_en_viaje;getting back to the whole "among they themselves" : the classical form of the sq in extremis was something along the lines of consules darent operam ne quid detrimenti res publica caperet ; videant consules ne res publica detrimenti capiat. let those guys in charge of things make sure the public shit dun get burned. there's gotta be some commonality for a republic to exist in the first place.
1955697;1576710489;mp_en_viaje;it doesn't have to be anything in particular, nor any specific thing. but it must be ~something~.
1955698;1576710648;mp_en_viaje;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-17#1955571 << consider the matter of services. this question pops in all over the place, alf was all over trinque re "what happens with deedbot if i get negrated". i din't invent this question, it's been recurring, mod6 asked me at some point [http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-11-04#1949455][something similar]
1955699;1576710648;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-17 17:56:46 diana_coman: BingoBoingo: my main trouble is not at all with the payment, in principle, but mainly with the notion of a single, clear meaning for "negrated", to start with.
1955700;1576710648;ossabot;Logged on 2019-11-04 15:51:48 mp_en_viaje: now, more's the point, what the fuck are you planning to do such that you think you should be negrated for it, and why the fuck would you.
1955701;1576710715;mp_en_viaje;practice's been evolving multipliy, eg, people got booted off pizarro if negrated ; we never gave a shit / booted nobody off eulora for same (iirc).
1955702;1576710762;mp_en_viaje;there's at the very least some basis for this, such as a "is user entirely harmless or potentially harmful". user eminently harmful on pizarro, couldn't afford luxury to ignore negrates for instance.
1955703;1576710838;mp_en_viaje;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-17#1955579 << yes, individual. but if the individual offers ~a service~, then what is the meaning of the individual's negrating ~for the use of the service~.
1955704;1576710838;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-17 20:04:01 lobbes: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-17#1955551 << I keep coming back to this point. The meaning of any rating is something that each individual must weigh for themselves, isn't it? Could there be a 'blanket' upfront decision as such? (Very possible I'm just not picking up the nuance, however)
1955705;1576710931;mp_en_viaje;ie, i'm not asking you to tell me what you think i should think about mike_c ; i established that for myself, and stated it for your information back in 2018. i am however asking you to tell me what you think my thoughts on mike_c should do to, eg, coin he thinks i owe him.
1955706;1576710955;mp_en_viaje;and no "fuck it, just keep it" ain't much of an answer, because if nothing else this provides the most perverse incentive imaginable.
1955707;1576711014;mp_en_viaje;conversely, you also can't ask me to talk to people i don't want to talk to, i'm not a public woman.
1955708;1576711030;mp_en_viaje;so the answer will probably have to carve itself a space within these two wires. now, how exactly, is what we're talking about.
1955709;1576711174;mp_en_viaje;consider the other aspect of the matter. what, if anything, can color your notion of someone, besides your own experience ?
1955710;1576711222;mp_en_viaje;"he fucked my 3yo daughter with a barbed metal pole, here are the bloody remains", for instance. you'll ignore ~everything~, "he's always been paying rent on time so i really don't care about the corspes" ?
1955711;1576711302;mp_en_viaje;if you'll ignore everything, then what's the point of talking ? if you'll ignore random things outside of even the possibility to prediction, then again what's the point of talking ? if there is some common ground, making at least some prediction possible, then what is it ?
1955712;1576711622;mp_en_viaje;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-18#1955600 << so to what standard does that "kinda" speak ? "had options, never vested, never A-series" ? "had options, did A-series, never vested" ? "had options, did a series, vested, never ipo'd" ? ipo'd too ? be specific.
1955713;1576711622;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-18 18:06:37 jfw: No fancy office there, many worked from home. 'Excel shop' like all of 'em of course.
1955714;1576711737;mp_en_viaje;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-18#1955602 << fwiw these little shits were never start-ups in any sense. they're fluffers, padding the downlist of [http://trilema.com/2013/ycombinator-continues-to-suck-jointly-and-severally/][mainline scams] (like the b-side of records of yore, exactly, or like the "package" part of package movie deals in the hollywood studio system days)
1955715;1576711737;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-18 18:18:46 jfw: After their hack / loss and change of ownership, they downsized to 3-4 people, none of whom could really maintain the redeployed systems. So I ended up doing some part-time for them in 2016. This was short-lived: I found their priorities entirely out of whack, it looked like they were headed for nothing but more trouble, and they didn't listen to me on much of anything. The pretense pump I reckon.
1955716;1576711775;mp_en_viaje;they also serve as "hr lukewarmers", keeping fucktoys / assorted "talent" from starvation / routed and readily accessible.
1955717;1576712111;mp_en_viaje;in the east, the "[http://trilema.com/2015/a-modern-lovestory-ioan-niculaie-diana-guresoaie/?b=Ioan%20Necul&e=ie#select][mobster]" has a buncha girlies in tow that are "coo at [http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2018-01-28#1777648][hair theory], inc". still, you sit down with them to talk [http://trilema.com/2010/key-business-affairs-manager-scl/][business] if fucked in the head only.
1955718;1576712112;ossabot;Logged on 2018-01-28 00:58:37 mircea_popescu: meanwhile in other chicks can code moments, "I earned my degree and license in cosmetology and had a horrible career as a hair dresser that I ended in 2015 due to social anxiety. I still love hair theory, and I even really enjoy working on people with whom I share a close relationship, but now I'm in pursuit of a new path."
1955719;1576712117;mp_en_viaje;~same concept anyways.
1955720;1576712421;mp_en_viaje;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-18#1955615 << irl, most coin sits in appaling security contexts and yet "liberations" are indeed rare. it's a problem of roi, most theft is opportunity-driven rather than systematic (mirroring how most people's houses ~could~ be broken in, [http://trilema.com/2011/nsfw-fata-n-oglinda/?b=Si%20drac&e=ea#select][by your gf]. but most people's houses nevertheless aren't broken into -- and especially not by your
1955721;1576712421;mp_en_viaje; gf.)
1955722;1576712421;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-18 18:54:55 jfw: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-14#1955362 - that'd be why I'm sewing an air-gapped wallet by hand. No amount of software-level patching can protect 1000btc sitting on networked PC I figure.
1955723;1576712625;mp_en_viaje;meanwhile in other usgistani wins : http://archive.is/twwd2 ==> http://archive.is/vBQfq
1955724;1576713280;jfw;mp_en_viaje: I was hired labor, did not hold securities.
1955725;1576713305;mp_en_viaje;not usually how start-ups work, is it ?
1955726;1576713421;jfw;Perhaps not start-ups in that sense then? or at least I wasn't there at the starting of.
1955727;1576713528;mp_en_viaje;basically anything that's neither a family owned deli nor a blue chip usg subsidiary calls itself start-up these days huh
1955728;1576714596;jfw;Come to think of it, this stricter usage is compatible with what I'd read about what start-ups are, so not sure why I defaulted to the broader/confused notion for "involved with start-ups in any capacity", perhaps because lots call themselves things as you say.
1955729;1576717913;lobbes;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-18#1955643 << I see what you mean now; there will always be a need to suss out a commonality in proper use of various [http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-18#1955628][public shit] (or else it ends with the same "what republic?")
1955730;1576717913;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-18 19:31:05 mp_en_viaje: if you'll ignore everything, then what's the point of talking ? if you'll ignore random things outside of even the possibility to prediction, then again what's the point of talking ? if there is some common ground, making at least some prediction possible, then what is it ?
1955731;1576717913;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-18 19:16:09 mp_en_viaje: getting back to the whole "among they themselves" : the classical form of the sq in extremis was something along the lines of consules darent operam ne quid detrimenti res publica caperet ; videant consules ne res publica detrimenti capiat. let those guys in charge of things make sure the public shit dun get burned. there's gotta be some commonality for a republic to exist in the first place.
1955732;1576717921;lobbes;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-18#1955640 << I'm hoping mike_c takes BingoBoingo's offer, as I think that process alone stands to carve some answers
1955733;1576717922;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-18 19:26:33 mp_en_viaje: so the answer will probably have to carve itself a space within these two wires. now, how exactly, is what we're talking about.
1955734;1576720089;BingoBoingo;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-18#1955608 << mp_en_viaje Aite, I have a sound argument. Gets more expensive every time it is played. Seems to be the strongest in favor of mike_c if only he takes it. Waited roughly a day to give him the deets http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-18#1955594
1955735;1576720089;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-18 18:49:25 mp_en_viaje: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-17#1955537 << no it doesn't, wut, im gonna get pissy at x because he made a sound argument ?
1955736;1576720089;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-18 12:44:45 BingoBoingo: !Qlater tell mike_c Here's the strategy and why it is your best shot at recovering your coin http://paste.deedbot.org/?id=7sEi
1955737;1576720109;BingoBoingo;Still waiting to see if he takes it.
1955738;1576720139;BingoBoingo;And for the watchers, no... the price did not come out of nowhere.
1955739;1576720214;BingoBoingo;mp_en_viaje ty for weighing in. It makes my pitch stronger
1955740;1576720626;BingoBoingo;lobbes: I do too for obvious reasons. Still more I hope he takes it for the less obvious effects.
1955741;1576720713;BingoBoingo;mike_c: I recommend you hop into #agriculturalsupremacy #asciilifeform or #ossasepia to speak.
1955742;1576721961;trinque;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-18#1955605 << I don't mean to say everything from modern computing is banned.
1955743;1576721961;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-18 18:44:31 jfw: "minimal possible bootable" seems a slippery goal, you could trim down to barely any OS at all. But then some pesky user comes along and wants graphics, and TCP, and to run on recent iron and then what.
1955744;1576721991;trinque;What is banned is any decision from your graphics stack informing a decision on whether I have the shitwad of deps your graphics stack demands.
1955745;1576722055;trinque;we can't build towards the purpose of e.g. running game/browser/etc, even if in the end a browser or game runs atop
1955746;1576722103;trinque;I don't think there's much daylight between our perspectives on this
1955747;1576722175;trinque;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-18#1955611 << rather, I favor the approach of finding someone whose business processes suck, and who manages a good chunk of money
1955748;1576722175;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-18 18:50:33 jfw: trinque: one approach is if money flows and wants patching support, to sell subscriptions covering some defined set of things. Do such clients exist? I don't know but seems like these tend to be large corps already in submission to USG and can just as well buy RedHat
1955749;1576722232;trinque;build them a process that does not suck atop your tool, and let the changes to said tool flow from their needs and yours.
1955750;1576722246;trinque;quality of the output depends on how stupid the clients needs are
1955751;1576722410;trinque;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-18#1955615 << so then your inputs to the process are haxed, and you go diligently dispatch btc to 1HaxFuckYou
1955752;1576722411;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-18 18:54:55 jfw: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-14#1955362 - that'd be why I'm sewing an air-gapped wallet by hand. No amount of software-level patching can protect 1000btc sitting on networked PC I figure.
1955753;1576722422;trinque;airgap protects the coin so long as nothing interesting ever happens
1955754;1576722455;trinque;it's worth mentioning at this point that I'm a deeply self-critical man. obviously the airgapped wallet approach is exactly what I did with deedbot
1955755;1576722461;trinque;but what I do isn't thereby gold
1955756;1576722497;trinque;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-18#1955617 << it solves only the pretense of being "not to blame" while still being very much to blame
1955757;1576722497;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-18 19:04:35 jfw: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-14#1955376 - to make my reasons for inclusion by reference rather than importing trees explicit, even if bad: on my own I was certainly in no position to pay the maintenance debts of all those projects, so I wanted some separation between my own work and them. As I see it now, the trouble is this doesn't actually solve anything if you still have to use
1955758;1576722503;trinque;and it blocks using V to wrangle the mess
1955759;1576722700;trinque;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-18#1955630 << it depends perhaps on whether one intends there to be recourse from negrating
1955760;1576722700;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-18 19:20:11 mp_en_viaje: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-17#1955571 << consider the matter of services. this question pops in all over the place, alf was all over trinque re "what happens with deedbot if i get negrated". i din't invent this question, it's been recurring, mod6 asked me at some point [http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-11-04#1949455][something similar]
1955761;1576722862;trinque;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-18#1955638 << also very much this.
1955762;1576722862;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-18 19:25:18 mp_en_viaje: and no "fuck it, just keep it" ain't much of an answer, because if nothing else this provides the most perverse incentive imaginable.
1955763;1576722878;trinque;it would call all my ratings into question if I could simply snatch the coins of anyone I negrated
1955764;1576722933;trinque;if anyone, I'd want a man unwilling to steal, so help him god, running the money tables
1955765;1576724286;trinque;arguably torching coin in this scenario is preferable to reposessing it.
1955766;1576728562;mp_en_viaje;i wonder if anyone in istanbul's having as much fun as me post morning calls to prayer.
1955767;1576728704;mp_en_viaje;they worship, i whorship, just as long as it's not the workshop who the he'lls to worry sheep.
1955768;1576728785;mp_en_viaje;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-18#1955666 << how can truth wear out with use! only lies are one-shot (in an ideal world).
1955769;1576728786;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-18 21:57:33 BingoBoingo: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-18#1955608 << mp_en_viaje Aite, I have a sound argument. Gets more expensive every time it is played. Seems to be the strongest in favor of mike_c if only he takes it. Waited roughly a day to give him the deets http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-18#1955594
1955770;1576728830;BingoBoingo;mp_en_viaje: The truth doesn't wear out. The screw however turns with time.
1955771;1576728843;BingoBoingo;There is a tentative agreement.
1955772;1576728846;mp_en_viaje;ha.
1955773;1576728852;mp_en_viaje;how's uruguay by the way ?
1955774;1576728872;BingoBoingo;mp_en_viaje: It's pretty great in December. Very few Porteños so far.
1955775;1576728893;mp_en_viaje;i dun expect the present generation's ever getting out again.
1955776;1576728899;BingoBoingo;Every now and then the ears catc the siren song of Portuguese
1955777;1576728938;mp_en_viaje;kinda ~same lulz in lebanon these days. all the pinoy houseworkers / ugly-but-workable-2ndwife / smileyface-paperbag-whores are flocking at the pinoy embassy, "oh, they barely pay 1/4 what they used to, we're outta here"
1955778;1576728945;BingoBoingo;mp_en_viaje: Tonight was the "fin de año" gathering at the Cowork, just the same as when I arrived 12-7-2017. Crowd noticably smaller this year.
1955779;1576728961;BingoBoingo;lol
1955780;1576728967;mp_en_viaje;heh, two years aniversary for you there huh.
1955781;1576728981;mp_en_viaje;speaking of which, how's the dc search ?
1955782;1576729109;BingoBoingo;mp_en_viaje: It's grinding, have not yet found half of 500 without turning towards the US. Will end up posting disk destruction pics tomorrow as 2 WoT'd folks viewed. 500 DC's I applied to blogging may not happen without applying to ones inside the zone.
1955783;1576729145;mp_en_viaje;so this'll double as a "republic's dc inventory & census, 2019" ?
1955784;1576729147;BingoBoingo;Have some local leads on sysadmin jobs which are in the getting to know you phase.
1955785;1576729178;mp_en_viaje;interesting how virtuous circles drive virtue an' the republic itself much like vicious circles drive sin an' the pantsuit itself!!!! /aesop
1955786;1576729197;mp_en_viaje;BingoBoingo, here's hopin' for you, kid!
1955787;1576729208;BingoBoingo;mp_en_viaje: Sadly so... it's not a pretty picture. Biggest change since 2017 is less operators run more ops.
1955788;1576729217;mp_en_viaje;shittierly.
1955789;1576729242;mp_en_viaje;but whatever, right, "el campo hay que pagar tambien", the government's "taking care" of this world while they independence &c all over themselves.
1955790;1576729319;mp_en_viaje;possibly the most annoying part about argentina being argentina is that all the other-same zeks upnorth look at it and imagine they're different & speshul. while doing the EXACT fucking same thing, if coincidentaly the southern printing press had gotten bigger and the northern had stayed small when the chinese showed up to put white man's world on life support -- EVERYTHING woulkd have been the EXACT same.
1955791;1576729322;BingoBoingo;Eastern Europe was largely a bust.
1955792;1576729323;mp_en_viaje;exact fucking same.
1955793;1576729350;mp_en_viaje;the argies'd be "tjhe biggest couintry in thr world" and "buying russia" while "impeaching kristina" while the northerns'd have been driving into canada for ciggarettes.
1955794;1576729380;mp_en_viaje;they both do this as it is, but it's "not relevant" because "bigger themes". except those "bigger themes" are 100% driven by historical accident and naught else entirely at all whatsoever.
1955795;1576729392;BingoBoingo;Lol, Kristina's the VP as of last week. Kinda wondering when Argentina will threaten invasion here.
1955796;1576729434;mp_en_viaje;eh, too late, the mexicans are already closer.
1955797;1576729460;BingoBoingo;Her buttpuppet Albert already dropped all of the low hanging fruit that strains Arg-Uru relations.
1955798;1576729473;BingoBoingo;Didn't even take a weekend.
1955799;1576729475;mp_en_viaje;haha what a concept.
1955800;1576729574;mp_en_viaje;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-18#1955673 << well... in #asciilifeform to commiserate, i guess. otherwise there's also #trinque and iirc #spyked
1955801;1576729575;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-18 22:07:57 BingoBoingo: mike_c: I recommend you hop into #agriculturalsupremacy #asciilifeform or #ossasepia to speak.
1955802;1576729628;BingoBoingo;mp_en_viaje: The shortlist came from channels with folks I've eaten pizza with this month.
1955803;1576729646;mp_en_viaje;ha
1955804;1576729654;mp_en_viaje;uruguay poppin' over there huh.
1955805;1576729677;mp_en_viaje;whatevs dood, ima be back in cr soonish, we throw a party.
1955806;1576729750;BingoBoingo;Both visits were pleasant. Now that I'm not tied to a rack I'll certainly have to see Northern Latino lands.
1955807;1576729821;mp_en_viaje;speaking of which i stuffed the sluts fulla boza yest. which they fucking love, above kvas even (found some utterly delish sweet kvas depicted [http://trilema.com/2019/the-tale-of-three-soups-or-goodbye-minsk/][on left])
1955808;1576729855;mp_en_viaje;that's it for now on mp's graduate beer alternatives course. till we get to egypt at least i guess.
1955809;1576729879;BingoBoingo;Looking forward to the fresh Trilema reads
1955810;1576729925;mp_en_viaje;but i must say, there's something in no way short of fabulous in taking a woman to a place completely incomprehensible, structured in manners irreducible to her own experience, and demaning a choice, and then applying the choice. "you want this ? a you do ? ok, now drink it!"
1955811;1576729975;mp_en_viaje;i'd say it's the one true abailable & possible reeaction of the original act.
1955812;1576729988;mp_en_viaje;available* ; re-enaction*
1955813;1576730143;mp_en_viaje;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-18#1955677 << this may even be so. but trinque , have mercy : in obtaining any desired result, the manager has indeed to await patiently for ~all possible~ results be delivered ? there is NO possibility of choice available, you mean, in the sense of none ~at all~ ?
1955814;1576730143;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-18 22:30:19 trinque: we can't build towards the purpose of e.g. running game/browser/etc, even if in the end a browser or game runs atop
1955815;1576730184;mp_en_viaje;because this seems an even more drastic & destructurating criticism of engineering than [http://trilema.com/2019/the-alleged-crisis-of-the-supposed-engineering-or-mistaken-identities-pantomiming-a-comedy-of-manners/][my own].
1955816;1576730189;mp_en_viaje;is it, truly, that bad ?!
1955817;1576730235;mp_en_viaje;this is how people have heirs, "you'll get a good son just as soon as she's popped all the kids she had in her and no sooner."
1955818;1576730470;mp_en_viaje;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-18#1955679 << well, on the upside, considering they're doing it they can also favour whatever the hell they're favouring it, and then we see how it goes. that's how medicine is built, out of carcasses ~that lived~.
1955819;1576730470;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-18 22:32:19 trinque: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-18#1955611 << rather, I favor the approach of finding someone whose business processes suck, and who manages a good chunk of money
1955820;1576730557;mp_en_viaje;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-18#1955681 << here's the dilemma : when starting a slutteria, you can either approach girls who would make great sluts, or girls who want to be sluts. sure, sometimes you might find the willing talent, but this is besides the point, that's her merit. the point is your process, and you're tooled for either one or the other.
1955821;1576730557;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-18 22:33:15 trinque: build them a process that does not suck atop your tool, and let the changes to said tool flow from their needs and yours.
1955822;1576730625;mp_en_viaje;now, admitting you're good at what you do as only god himself can ever be, here are your outcomes : if you go for girls that would make great sluts, and you make them great sluts, what if they ask "ok, so ?" when you're done ? ie, they ARE great sluts now, where they'd have been just wasted potential before, but they... do not see it ? they don't perceive anything relevant has changed at all ?
1955823;1576730695;mp_en_viaje;(meanwhile, of course, if you go for the willing, well... you know. like curing the deaf, "i think i can hear better now" "really ?" "yeah, if i get really excited about it, kinda feels like i'm hearing". "bitch... please.")
1955824;1576730735;mp_en_viaje;there's the distinct possibility they do build such better thing, and the corp that lived with the worse one reverts to it, because can't tell the difference.
1955825;1576730767;mp_en_viaje;not that i'm saying you're wrong in some kinda absolute way. but... well, gotta moderate expectations.
1955826;1576730967;mp_en_viaje;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-18#1955686 << but obviously the forestated problem is there ; especially ~with anonymity~ baked in. which is a problem, which i've discussed on trilema because of this, but it's also very difficult to digest. it's one of those "against-the-grain" problems, like the problemi of the 20yo [http://trilema.com/2012/c-asa-i-romanu-cind-se-sumeteste/][not getting excited].
1955827;1576730968;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-18 22:36:59 trinque: it's worth mentioning at this point that I'm a deeply self-critical man. obviously the airgapped wallet approach is exactly what I did with deedbot
1955828;1576730973;mp_en_viaje;it just dun come easy.
1955829;1576731117;mp_en_viaje;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-18#1955691 << there's always recourse, from everything. think about it, how could a recourseless world work ? would it be anything like the recoilless gun ? action without reaction where, "in outer space" ?
1955830;1576731117;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-18 22:41:04 trinque: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-18#1955630 << it depends perhaps on whether one intends there to be recourse from negrating
1955831;1576731190;mp_en_viaje;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-18#1955697 << which is a major pillar of why a foundation was even contemplated in the original "wtf to do" spec.
1955832;1576731190;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-18 23:07:30 trinque: arguably torching coin in this scenario is preferable to reposessing it.
1955833;1576731218;mp_en_viaje;lo those many many years ago
1955834;1576731340;mp_en_viaje;speaking of which, anyone recall back in the bitbet pioneering shutdown days, when i proposed a process and ben_vulpes got all suspicious, "omfg, he aims to keep it!!!"
1955835;1576731346;mp_en_viaje;was a funny day or two w/e it was.
1955836;1576731474;mp_en_viaje;anyway, to get back to the "recourse from negrating" thing -- you and him argue, i'm definitely getting stuck with making some choices. there's no out of this, and it doesn't matter what you load into "you, him, i".
1955837;1576731577;mp_en_viaje;what's more, this has played out quite a few times to date, it either dies from inconsequence ("and so who the fuck are you and him anyways ?"), is resolved through some kinda mediation ("how about instead of fucking each other you do x and live ?") or else "you/him is a complete fuckwad, get the fuck lost, i can't even believe you can have this problem."
1955838;1576731601;mp_en_viaje;multiple examples can be squeezed out of log on ~all kinds
1955839;1576732768;mp_en_viaje;http://qntra.net/2019/12/democratically-elected-us-president-donald-trump-writes-letter-to-pantsuit-nancy/ << pretty great letter huh.
1955840;1576733068;mp_en_viaje;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-19#1955703 << aite, so say if it closes we work out a procedure.
1955841;1576733068;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-19 00:23:27 BingoBoingo: There is a tentative agreement.
1955842;1576734801;mp_en_viaje;jfw, " or at any rate that the costs of such a change be born by he who makes it" << be borne. diff word, to bear, entirely unrelated to birth.
1955843;1576734905;mp_en_viaje;i mean uh. the word's the same, ye olde beran, but the participle / past tense of it is "borne" in all cases when you're not talking of actual birth.
1955844;1576735073;mp_en_viaje;http://fixpoint.welshcomputing.com/2019/review-of-polarbeard_add_sendrawtransaction_rpcvpatch/ << but anyways, cuteness, jfw discovering the horrors of satoshi bitcoin. most of the insanity you discover in the guy's patch is just carried over.
1955845;1576740561;mp_en_viaje;in other minutuous mindblowia updates, im lying on my bed here IN THE HOTEL ROOM, pile of assorted cigarillos and respectable ashtray to the side, fucking SMOKING.
1955846;1576740574;mp_en_viaje;amusingly, place does have a fire alarm. apparently this is not a concern.
1955847;1576740610;mp_en_viaje;they even thoughtfully provide matches, in case you're out. old style, hotel branded boxes, like it were nyc 1969 all over again.
1955848;1576740614;mp_en_viaje;no bible in the drawers tho.
1955849;1576740804;mp_en_viaje;goes quite well after a lazy breakfast consisting of a sampler of halva we bought in this little shop in the edirne bazaar (which is pretty fucking cool btw), assorted dried fruits, ayran, tahin, chestnuts an' whatnot. i'm very roundly sated and just as thoroughly satisfied.
1955850;1576748204;diana_coman;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-18#1955628 - this makes full sense, thank you.
1955851;1576748204;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-18 19:16:09 mp_en_viaje: getting back to the whole "among they themselves" : the classical form of the sq in extremis was something along the lines of consules darent operam ne quid detrimenti res publica caperet ; videant consules ne res publica detrimenti capiat. let those guys in charge of things make sure the public shit dun get burned. there's gotta be some commonality for a republic to exist in the first place.
1955852;1576748590;diana_coman;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-18#1955640 - the only possible way I can see is exactly as it seems to be set to go aka negrated may find someone to speak for them and based on the arguments presented a decision will be made; not sure what more can be directly said/specified upfront and in general.
1955853;1576748591;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-18 19:26:33 mp_en_viaje: so the answer will probably have to carve itself a space within these two wires. now, how exactly, is what we're talking about.
1955854;1576763537;BingoBoingo;!!rate mike_c 2 After a long absence came to swift submission to Republican WoT power structure at a greater cost to self than initially proposed
1955855;1576763538;deedbot;Get your OTP: http://paste.deedbot.org/?id=gD04
1955856;1576763570;BingoBoingo;!!v 4F48C7AF50772432BFB53E8BB691913F2AFB423905C99FAC9F3A16F2B1CFDF21
1955857;1576763571;deedbot;BingoBoingo updated rating of mike_c from -1 to 2 << After a long absence came to swift submission to Republican WoT power structure at a greater cost to self than initially proposed
1955858;1576763657;BingoBoingo;mp_en_viaje: Despite the long absence mike_c has made a substantial act of submission to the Republican power structure as gated by the Web of Trust. Over time, the bar for demonstrations of submission made by absentees that should have known better... I can only see it rising. [http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-19#1955702][Hence the screw turns clarification on the strategy last night]
1955859;1576763657;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-19 00:23:14 BingoBoingo: mp_en_viaje: The truth doesn't wear out. The screw however turns with time.
1955860;1576763674;BingoBoingo;Per the agreement mike_c has made a payment to me for my voice in the forum with no provision for any refund to himself. He chose this demonstration after being offered the cheaper alternative of instead sweating out his ammends in the Qntra newsmines
1955861;1576764080;BingoBoingo;In the general case I see a -1 or -2 negrating as a sort of "caution", but I find it hard to read a -10 as anything other than the recipient being marked as future salt-pork that happens to maybe be on the hoof at the time of rating.
1955862;1576764092;BingoBoingo;It didn't take many lines of conversation or a whole hour for mike_c to find that the after missing out on things over the years like the entire history of an ISP... An actual demonstration of the value of WoT position and the barriers presented by WoT gating was his best possible demonstration of submission.
1955863;1576764396;BingoBoingo;The problem of the Republic and the Negrated is not "What does the Republic owe the negrated", the problem is... are those negrated for their absence capable of submission after returning. Is doing something other than submitting an option they hallucinate.
1955864;1576764646;BingoBoingo;After being brought up to speed on relevant matters the Republic has explored in his extended absence, mike_c countered my proposal with one that sees him out an extra 5 BTC over my initial proposed structure whether he recovers his coin or not.
1955865;1576764792;BingoBoingo;Other lords, you are welcome to begin spinning the blades
1955866;1576766241;BingoBoingo;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-19#1955771 << Great letter indeed. Kinda why it got the treatment and not the hallucinatory shit except as presented by the letter.
1955867;1576766241;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-19 01:28:53 mp_en_viaje: http://qntra.net/2019/12/democratically-elected-us-president-donald-trump-writes-letter-to-pantsuit-nancy/ << pretty great letter huh.
1955868;1576777010;diana_coman;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-19#1955792 - how do you reason to get to the conclusion that the qntra contribution is cheaper alternative? The way I see it, the choice clearly spells that mike_c considers the 30 btc as the cheaper option compared to putting in the effort& time on qntra for the interval you requested.
1955869;1576777010;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-19 10:04:00 BingoBoingo: Per the agreement mike_c has made a payment to me for my voice in the forum with no provision for any refund to himself. He chose this demonstration after being offered the cheaper alternative of instead sweating out his ammends in the Qntra newsmines
1955870;1576777109;BingoBoingo;diana_coman: Well, certainly both options had dimensions in which they are cheaper than the other.
1955871;1576777263;BingoBoingo;diana_coman: And per the agreement if he recovers coin the total damage is 40 BTC as he sends 10 BTC to asciilifeform. http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/asciilifeform/2019-12-18#1003953
1955872;1576777263;ossabot;(asciilifeform) 2019-12-18 mike_c: BingoBoingo: I changed my mind, and my offer to hire you: I send you fee of 30 BTC (same amount the mpex account cost coincidentally). If you lose the case and I don't recover my dividend, you send 10 BTC to ascii (nothing to me). If you win and I do recover, then I send 10 BTC to ascii (and you keep the 30). in case of partial recovery, i dunno, we do something gentlemanly.
1955873;1576777334;diana_coman;so basically he wants to give 10BTC to asciilifeform out of the coin he otherwise was even rather ready to consider lost anyway.
1955874;1576777432;BingoBoingo;diana_coman: Right. As asciilifeform is still politically alligned with the Republic, I find the proposal agreeable in creating a second opportunity to demonstrate continuing submission.
1955875;1576777535;diana_coman;hm; I think it shows non-agressiveness; whether submission, I don't quite see it.
1955876;1576777547;*;diana_coman will think of it some more.
1955877;1576777560;BingoBoingo;Under my original proposal in the event mike_c's coin was not returned I would have refunded him 10 BTC reducing the damage to 25 BTC. Under this structure, mike_c is out 30 BTC minimum, outcome independent.
1955878;1576777664;BingoBoingo;Maybe you don't want to call it submission, but it is an acknowledgement of the Republic as Sovereign.
1955879;1576777828;BingoBoingo;diana_coman: Note also what mike_c did not do. He did not go shopping around for a lower bidding lord after I gave him the strategy and then clarified the strategy, catching him up on where the Republic has advanced during his absence.
1955880;1576778451;diana_coman;BingoBoingo: it's not about what I "want" to call it.
1955881;1576778990;BingoBoingo;I really don't see how in this case mike_c could have demonstrated "non-aggression" alone. For his action, he actively acknowledged WoT supremacy. For his recognition of WoT supremacy, [http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-17#1955529][laziness has a demonstrable cost.]
1955882;1576778991;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-17 05:00:55 mp_en_viaje: i get we're basically getting scammed by the duplicitous nature of the lazy, and will be, forever. cuz that's how the world goes, that's how laziness survives as a survival mechanism in the first place. but i'd much rather we understand each other on the topic, than it just proceed on my authority and then whatever, ten years later it'll be "mp just shouldn't have paid all these asshats" or who the fuck knows what
1955883;1576779281;BingoBoingo;There is a sharp edge facing those who fall of the wrong side of the WoT map. It cleaves.
1955884;1576779344;diana_coman;BingoBoingo: as things stand, he is at any rate after getting the coin to use outside tmsr; because can't yet "find time" or whatever; sure, some price to pay for getting it out, that much his actions acknowledge + some appreciation for asciilifeform's work, certainly.
1955885;1576779379;diana_coman;that's where I find it hard to buy the "submission" thing, at the "get it to use it outside" bit.
1955886;1576779444;diana_coman;ftr I do NOT mean that he shouldn't get the coin or anything of the sort; I literally mean what I say above namely that I don't see how does that qualify for submission.
1955887;1576779575;*;diana_coman will bbl
1955888;1576779634;BingoBoingo;mike_c gave us what [http://trilema.com/2014/interacting-with-fiat-institutions-a-guide/][Daphna Waxman] didn't. Sure, Daphna Waxman is salt pork that happens to maybe still be on the hoof. If Daphna Waxman ever shows up... for mike_c's decision to make a deal... there is a screw to be turned.
1955889;1576780262;BingoBoingo;The fact that he valued voice, whether MPEx pays him out or not... I don't see how that isn't submission. In his best case he gets coin out, maybe he does turn it all over to hostile parties. He agreed that in his worst case where MPEx does not pay him out... his coin stays with Republican interests.
1955890;1576782465;diana_coman;BingoBoingo: looking at it from the other side, do you mean to say that if someone comes tomorrow willing to pay 30 btc to have some issue heard in the forum (on which they also stand to possibly get more than the 30 btc as the most favourable result) then it follows that they submitted to tmsr?
1955891;1576782631;BingoBoingo;diana_coman: If someone comes on a day after mike_c is paid out by MPEx, I can't imagine this hypothetical next person would receive any offer for voice nearly as cheap as 30 BTC.
1955892;1576782646;diana_coman;in the case where MPEx does not pay him out, I don't see how he has a say into what happens to the coin so I fail to see how is that part meaningful; if he wants the coin to be paid to asciilifeform entirely then he can do so once he gets it, no? if he doesn't get it, then he can't say what is to be done with it.
1955893;1576782721;diana_coman;ugh, I don't like much this precedent on precedent alone but maybe that's just me.
1955894;1576782821;diana_coman;anyway, I admit by now I'm quite curious as to what the others in L1 have to say.
1955895;1576783027;BingoBoingo;diana_coman: If mike_c doesn't get paid it sends the signal that TMSR doesn't ever deal, following this external relations is difficult because of the "What the hell can a lord do for me" objection. If mike_c gets paid, TMSR matters, WoT matters, and voice has value as can be demonstrated through the outcome of the case... but the precedent is not sufficiently restrictive so as to prevent future tightening, refusals, etc.
1955896;1576783061;diana_coman;BingoBoingo: uhm, no, I don't agree on either points.
1955897;1576783074;*;BingoBoingo awaits others weighing in as well.
1955898;1576783147;diana_coman;and moreover I don't think it's signalling that should be a concern really (in this case or in another).
1955899;1576783536;BingoBoingo;This is a republic of men, not laws. The second order effects, benefits or hazards that follow a decision seem to be of incredible importance.
1955900;1576783946;diana_coman;BingoBoingo: I really hope this case is not going to be argued on "perceived signals of decision A vs those of decision B".
1955901;1576783995;diana_coman;might as well towards-purposing all along; that's not at all what "republic of men, not laws" means to me.
1955902;1576784121;BingoBoingo;That's not the argument at all. The argument follows from http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-19#1955790
1955903;1576784121;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-19 10:03:44 BingoBoingo: mp_en_viaje: Despite the long absence mike_c has made a substantial act of submission to the Republican power structure as gated by the Web of Trust. Over time, the bar for demonstrations of submission made by absentees that should have known better... I can only see it rising. [http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-19#1955702][Hence the screw turns clarification on the strategy last night]
1955904;1576784147;diana_coman;so then I have no idea what it is.
1955905;1576784402;BingoBoingo;mike_c agreed to pay substantially for representation along WoT lines. If he gets paid out and retreats forever back to Pantsuit dreamland or gets aggressive... he'll set a good precedent for closing the window that got him paid for all later comers.
1955906;1576786306;BingoBoingo;Anyways, we've got this Republic which is sovereign. We've got a lord of lords in MP. Does not paying mike_c maximize coin that certainly stays inside TMSR, sure. Does not paying mike_c reduce the space in which Lords can credibly extract rents from those who've touched Pantsuit in the past, I very strongly suspect so. If we consider the cause of increasing the power of the Lordship over Pantsuit Delusonists...
1955907;1576786318;BingoBoingo;Which outcome in this case leaves a borader path open for someone's pages to ask Hussein Bahamas eat a bowl of lumberjack shit in exchange for a literal coinflip that will determine whether or not the page escalates his plea for a small mercy to the page's lord?
1955908;1576786896;feedbot;http://qntra.net/2019/12/pantsuit-nancy-shows-cold-feet-after-pushing-through-impeachment-may-not-forward-impeachment-to-senate-for-trial/ << Qntra -- Pantsuit Nancy Shows Cold Feet After Pushing Through Impeachment May Not Forward Impeachment To Senate For Trial
1955909;1576794914;lobbes;BingoBoingo: So if I'm understanding correctly, your argument rests on two things: 1) one must demonstrate submission to Republican processes (thus recognizing the sovereignty of tmsr) 2) your client has demonstrated submission with his acceptance to pay you 30 btc for voice
1955910;1576794917;lobbes;It does not look like there is any disagreement on 1. However the question of whether 2 is an actual demonstration of submission seems like it is still open.
1955911;1576794923;lobbes;fwiw I can see how it can be argued as submission, primarily because BingoBoingo's client [http://logs.ericbenevides.com/log/trilema/2019-12-19#1955809][has agreed to pay a fee regardless of the outcome].
1955912;1576794923;ericbot;Logged on 2019-12-19 17:50:35 BingoBoingo: Under my original proposal in the event mike_c's coin was not returned I would have refunded him 10 BTC reducing the damage to 25 BTC. Under this structure, mike_c is out 30 BTC minimum, outcome independent.
1955913;1576795028;BingoBoingo;lobbes: That is the core of the argument.
1955914;1576795503;BingoBoingo;lobbes: And less the process. It is about submission to the structure of authority.
1955915;1576796375;lobbes;BingoBoingo: This makes sense on reflection, as it would seem like pegging things specifically to process is a dubious path to walk
1955916;1576873738;feedbot;http://bingology.net/2019/data-protection-journey-part-1-husking-oxidizing-and-salting/ << Bingology - BingoBoingo's Blog -- Data Protection Journey Part 1: Husking, Oxidizing, and Salting
1955917;1576877280;feedbot;http://qntra.net/2019/12/16-year-sentence-handed-down-in-iowa-flag-burning-case/ << Qntra -- 16 Year Sentence Handed Down In Iowa Flag Burning Case
1955918;1576913498;feedbot;http://www.krankendenken.com/2019/12/paying-penance-for-walking-the-path-of-derealisation/ << Krankendenken -- Paying penance for walking the path of derealisation
1955919;1576933601;*;mp_en_viaje has cut his voyage short, and after a 1200 km haul yest is now in more settled circumstances.
1955920;1576933700;mp_en_viaje;shall get to the logs and such presently.
1955921;1576934175;feedbot;http://trilema.com/2019/dur/ << Trilema -- Dur
1955922;1576937698;feedbot;http://bingology.net/2019/conducting-a-job-search-in-2019-part-one-the-environment-inside-and-outside-the-republic/ << Bingology - BingoBoingo's Blog -- Conducting A Job Search In 2019: Part One - The Environment Inside And Outside The Republic
1955923;1576945308;mp_en_viaje;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-19#1955790 << dawg you're so weird! what's with all this bizzaro grandiloquence anyways.
1955924;1576945308;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-19 10:03:44 BingoBoingo: mp_en_viaje: Despite the long absence mike_c has made a substantial act of submission to the Republican power structure as gated by the Web of Trust. Over time, the bar for demonstrations of submission made by absentees that should have known better... I can only see it rising. [http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-19#1955702][Hence the screw turns clarification on the strategy last night]
1955925;1576945314;mp_en_viaje;how about let
1955926;1576945392;mp_en_viaje;s keep it simple instead. deed the basis of whatever claim it is you're representing and state the basis of your representation for the log ? something plain like "paid me so and so to represent this, here's the proof of payment"
1955927;1576945470;mp_en_viaje;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-19#1955792 << this is too vague as such. consider the two most obvious possible issues downstream : severance and subversion.
1955928;1576945471;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-19 10:04:00 BingoBoingo: Per the agreement mike_c has made a payment to me for my voice in the forum with no provision for any refund to himself. He chose this demonstration after being offered the cheaper alternative of instead sweating out his ammends in the Qntra newsmines
1955929;1576945488;mp_en_viaje;if your client claims to not have "really" been your client later, what do you have to say then ?
1955930;1576945526;mp_en_viaje;if a third party claims your client really paid you to subvert the republic rather than work with it, what do you have to say then ?
1955931;1576945562;mp_en_viaje;a much simpler "x paid me to represent him in deed y via tx z" will go a lot further than tjhis other stuff you're doing, you know ?
1955932;1576945661;mp_en_viaje;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-19#1955803 << dude seriously, your notion of representation is you're going to quote some line from alf's channel as if that's now the channel of record ?
1955933;1576945661;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-19 13:50:30 BingoBoingo: diana_coman: And per the agreement if he recovers coin the total damage is 40 BTC as he sends 10 BTC to asciilifeform. http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/asciilifeform/2019-12-18#1003953
1955934;1576945669;BingoBoingo;mp_en_viaje: Aite, I will draft and enter a deed.
1955935;1576945687;mp_en_viaje;i should kick you off of this case altogether, that's literally the dumbest possible move available to you.
1955936;1576945699;mp_en_viaje;but in general : stop quothing shit from other chans into here. that's not how authority flows.
1955937;1576945708;mp_en_viaje;quote #trilema there. that's how authority flows.
1955938;1576945748;mp_en_viaje;and otherwise, i'm not going to go through the rest of this drunken braying. start over, and start over like you know what the fuck you're doing.
1955939;1576945766;mp_en_viaje;hanging out with alf rotted your brain, the same disorganised randomness exudes off you both by now.
1955940;1576945934;BingoBoingo;Alright. I'll reorganize and start over.
1955941;1576946027;mp_en_viaje;aite.
1955942;1576956187;trinque;mp_en_viaje: I'm curious, in all your travels, whether you've found another tolerable outpost.
1955943;1576958018;mp_en_viaje;vienna and prague aren't bad.
1955944;1576958036;mp_en_viaje;budapest's okay-ish these days, otherwise...
1955945;1576958071;mp_en_viaje;to a certain degree it depends on one's particular interests. these are fine tuned for my needs
1955946;1576963168;trinque;probably texas 40-50 years ago, in my case.
1955947;1576963307;trinque;was kinda curious if UY would end up being something like this. sounds instead like another latam communist-wannabe.
1955948;1576964482;BingoBoingo;trinque: Maybe rural UY in the sense of the departments of Maldonado, Flores, or Rocha. I've not yet investigated out there yet.
1955949;1576985529;BingoBoingo;!!deed http://paste.deedbot.org/?id=OL7t
1955950;1576985534;deedbot;accepted: 1
1955951;1576994581;mp_en_viaje;trinque, i don't expect [http://trilema.com/2015/racists-and-the-racist-idea/#footnote_9_62840][1960s tx] is reproducible outside of a hard reset. highly coherent, profoundly skilled workforce in a complete worldview will absolutely require the conditions that spawned them, and will necessarily dissolve once the solvents show up.
1955952;1576994650;mp_en_viaje;1960 texas is predicated on the remnants of three centuries' british struggles with the dutch encountering six centuries spanish struggles with the beasts of the land, women, horses, cattle generally, defeating it in the field and then having the intelligence to rape the carcass raw.
1955953;1576994699;mp_en_viaje;by the time the 80s roll around and everyone's driving and they kick the cattle out ass by ass to plonk down oil rigs, it's done for. the distances narrowed, and oil trade is integrating in ways cattle trading is not.
1955954;1576994916;mp_en_viaje;no joke about the spanyards, either. [http://trilema.com/2014/vreau-sa-mi-spui-frumoasa-zaraza/#footnote_3_55011][Mientras que, bajo el peso del trigo, los ejes cansados los siento quejar, yo, anudando mi pena a esa queja, con cantos y silbos te sé acompañar.] is a fucking thing, which they did. thoroughly, and well -- or if not well, then as well as could be done, for sure.
1955955;1576994990;mp_en_viaje;but the end's always gonna be buey zaraza, tus ojos tristones mirando la huella parecen buscar el milagro de aquellos pasitos que al irse la ingrata no supo dejar. it has to.
1955956;1576995762;mp_en_viaje;for that matter : by the time the 60s rolled around there were adult tejanos all over texas shaking their head at this elvis greasy, faggoty bs and thinking back to a greater time in, say, 1890, back when cattle was still speaking spanish and the east coast dudes hadn't really shown up with their idioties, "how to make it all cheap". while in the actual 1890, actual mexicans in texas were looking up through almanacs at the
1955957;1576995762;mp_en_viaje; time of the revolution and read all up on Antoine de Saussure Peronette de Crocketagne's grandson's adventures.
1955958;1576995846;mp_en_viaje;meanwhile while we're talking, the former us state of texas is being taken over by an emergent new world isis, undeclared as such, but stronger nevertheless, the "cartels" in pantsuitspeak.
1955959;1576996170;mp_en_viaje;it's probably simpler to go help them hang Cecilia Phalen Abbott by her fallopian tubes than to go build yourself a time machine, on the purely technological standard.
1955960;1576996232;mp_en_viaje;and on the cultural standard, you'll still have to explain both, it's not like one's free. "but but but, greg abbot was ~trying~ to be good!" vs "what does this button do ?", doesn't seem you're saving anything either way. always cheaper to live in the present than to reconstruct the past.
1955961;1577022939;mp_en_viaje;in other lulz, /me surveying thoroughly harvested resource nodes : "damn, how come every time i find a rare it's 0/5. i should kill all the other players." then, after some reflectiion : "the problem's if i killed them all, who'd then buy all my shit". helpful slavegirl : "maybe you should put them in buying internment camp". /me thinking about it "i guess that's what the us actually is".
1955962;1577026714;BingoBoingo;The more specifc construction that the US is a Chinese buying internment camp also seems to work. Kinda the defining struggle of the Trumpreich. Pantsuits and others wholly owned by the Chinese needlessly make noises to impress their captors, Chinese largely indifferent as they can just wait for this little bit of excitement amongst the white worms to pass.
1955963;1577027328;trinque;mp_en_viaje: I suspect that's an ethnowot, but what do I know.
1955964;1577027369;mp_en_viaje;nothing ever is a true ethnowot.
1955965;1577027435;mp_en_viaje;there was a chinese man at king louis' court. human reproduction so greatly benefits from a little bit of exogamy, no human society was ever unporous.
1955966;1577027462;trinque;I'd buy it, and as I've said http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2017-06-23#1674066
1955967;1577027462;ossabot;Logged on 2017-06-23 13:57:56 trinque: it is factual that the non-pussified mexican culture is a huge boon for texas.
1955968;1577027533;trinque;at any rate, got one I'll put on the blog when the lawyers are done with it.
1955969;1577027559;trinque;pretty disappointed in this place by now.
1955970;1577027635;mp_en_viaje;the main thrust of my earlier comments was that it's likely you'll have to moderate your expectations. there's a humongous difference between what i mean by nice and what i suspect behind your "place-and-period" indication. in approximate math terms, you want something 3 or 4 sigmas away from what i want.
1955971;1577027738;mp_en_viaje;there's tremendous difference between "i want something like [http://www.academiacatavencu.info/imagine/2000x2000/einstein%2Bcur%2Bmare_4119.jpg][that] but with a better face" and "i want a great looking woman that's my 5th grade classmate from back in jr high".
1955972;1577027751;trinque;this is probably also so, and with more layers between me and the intolerable.
1955973;1577027844;*;trinque brb
1955974;1577035450;trinque;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-19#1955745 << there's certainly choice.
1955975;1577035451;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-19 00:45:07 mp_en_viaje: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-18#1955677 << this may even be so. but trinque , have mercy : in obtaining any desired result, the manager has indeed to await patiently for ~all possible~ results be delivered ? there is NO possibility of choice available, you mean, in the sense of none ~at all~ ?
1955976;1577035532;trinque;still when dealing with heaping shitpiles of accidental complexity, I'd warn that manager to keep his declaratives close.
1955977;1577035850;feedbot;http://qntra.net/2019/12/pichiaje-in-california-up-16-4-in-2019/ << Qntra -- Pichiaje In California Up 16.4% In 2019
1955978;1577038110;mp_en_viaje;pichiaje lol
1955979;1577038183;BingoBoingo;mp_en_viaje: That word exists here verbally with substantial frequency, but... the search engines don't seem to know it.
1955980;1577048869;Mocky;good evening
1955981;1577049127;BingoBoingo;Evening. Mocky I have a backup of your materials that were hosted at Pizarro.
1955982;1577049193;Mocky;oh thank you. I'm pretty sure I have everything but would use the backup to double check
1955983;1577050397;lobbes;evening Mocky. How's life been treating you?
1955984;1577050544;Mocky;treating me well but I haven't been managing it well. I went a little overboard trying to earn more money and seeing three chicks at the same time. I exceeded my capacity to manage it.
1955985;1577050659;Mocky;I've cut back back to 1 chick for now, have some of my time back again
1955986;1577050699;lobbes;Mocky: lol, sounds fun at least. Listen, I owe you a lunch one of these days (I still feel like a dick for making you wait that last time). I'll be out of state until January, but if you're free sometime early next year I dun mind making the trek up to your neck of the woods
1955987;1577050790;Mocky;sounds good. I'll def have time. What's got you travelling?
1955988;1577050830;lobbes;nothing interesting, just visiting old meatwot up in the northeast
1955989;1577050903;lobbes;Mocky: you still got the same # I wager? If so I'll hit you up in 2020 and we can figure something out
1955990;1577050940;Mocky;I do. text me anytime
1955991;1577050991;lobbes;sounds good
1955992;1577052977;BingoBoingo;Mocky: http://paste.deedbot.org/?id=ZiS-
1955993;1577053064;Mocky;BingoBoingo: got it, thanks. will let you know.
1955994;1577053073;BingoBoingo;Aite
1955995;1577055101;Mocky;BingoBoingo: can you give me read permission on that file?
1955996;1577055464;Mocky;trinque: I made a deposit, please let me know once you've had a chance to process it
1955997;1577055551;BingoBoingo;Mocky: Sorry about that, should be ready
1955998;1577057146;Mocky;BingoBoingo: I have it, looks good. Thank you
1955999;1577057156;BingoBoingo;Mocky: ty
1956000;1577062285;feedbot;http://qntra.net/2019/12/2-chinese-vessels-among-ships-attacked-by-pirates-in-gabon-capitals-harbor/ << Qntra -- 2 Chinese Vessels Among Ships Attacked By Pirates In Gabon Capital's Harbor
1956001;1577062475;trinque;Mocky: ack
1956002;1577065373;trinque;meanwhile, fuck, ave1 did your domain expire?
1956003;1577081064;mp_en_viaje;ahaha Mocky, tits or gtfo.
1956004;1577081154;mp_en_viaje;wut is this java bullshit, "oh, i've been fucking three women". mocky.org/three-nude-sluts when!
1956005;1577081333;mp_en_viaje;to be perfectly clear & understand each other : the ENTIRETY of stage, from "broadway" to "highbrow theatre" to ballet to ice skating to ~EVERYTHING ELSE~, the absolutely and strictly only reason ANYTHING like the stage exists in contemporary degeneracy,
1956006;1577081418;mp_en_viaje;is that centuries ago rich and powerful men modulated [http://trilema.com/2014/consent-is-a-myth-lets-see-how-it-came-to-be/][their natural social competitiveness] (also known as "gentle" in the gentleman, "let's compete SOME OTHER WAY than with fists and clubs", that's what it is)
1956007;1577081464;mp_en_viaje;to include the competition of young women they own and trained. there's exactly no substantial difference between "showbusiness" and racing horses or "bloodsports", cockfighting, dog fighting etc.
1956008;1577081473;mp_en_viaje;you own these beautiful animals which you train to compete.
1956009;1577081617;mp_en_viaje;the reason lucia was ever written by donizetti (and if it weren't written by him, it'd have been written [http://trilema.com/2013/what-is-art/][by someone else]! -- not "the same" in the irrelevant, misunderstood sense of "same exact surface", "same exact stringing of notes", because IT IS NOT THE FORM OF THE ARGUMENT THAT LENDS IT CREDENCE. but same in the only meaningful way : sameness of function, lucia, "the thing tha
1956010;1577081617;mp_en_viaje;t does lucia" would have been written anyway)
1956011;1577081704;mp_en_viaje;is the very simple "we each have these herds of sluts we're competing" basis, upon which donizetti came and offered a useful tool : "hey guise ? ima write a piece no human female born out of human female can EVER fucking sing. it'll just be fucking impossible. you can watch them die trying, crash and burtn on the stage, all their natural girly hopes and aspirations and the rest of the coy behaviour debris eviscerated for y
1956012;1577081705;mp_en_viaje;our amusement, how about it ?"
1956013;1577081739;mp_en_viaje;that's what lucia fucking is, "let these bitches who think they can sing break their teeth". it was SUPPOSED to be undoable, which it's why it is. and it's not the only item in that vein, either.
1956014;1577081789;mp_en_viaje;and same with theatre, and with all "entertainment" run off the backs of young women : [http://trilema.com/2017/zuleika-dobson-or-an-proper-love-story/][his grace] and his friends' liveried sluts.
1956015;1577081822;mp_en_viaje;now don't fucking tell me you didn't understand this is both a) how human society advances and b) what the fuck we even do here.
1956016;1577082025;mp_en_viaje;if it weren't for those guys, all there'd be on tv would be bronco busting, wrestling an' etcetera. look up Bonnie McCarroll & women bronc riding to see the fuck i mean.
1956017;1577082273;mp_en_viaje;back in 1600 samuel pepys never missed a performance of the duke's company, he really liked mary knep, guess how the fuck he ever got to know she existed.
1956018;1577082486;mp_en_viaje;in other lulz, check out these fucking idiots : https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elizabeth_Knepp https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mary_Knep
1956019;1577082751;mp_en_viaje;there's a reason wikitards & redditards & etc waste their days away. that reason might no be, but just as well might have plenty to do with our neglect of running the slut competitions.
1956020;1577086194;feedbot;http://www.krankendenken.com/2019/12/a-brief-look-into-portage-and-ebuilds/ << Krankendenken -- A brief look into Portage and ebuilds
1956021;1577088520;mp_en_viaje;and that clown alf thought starting a home business was "suicide mission".
1956022;1577089779;mp_en_viaje;whaack, hey, that's not even bad.
1956023;1577089900;mp_en_viaje;meanwhile [http://www.krankendenken.com/2019/12/paying-penance-for-walking-the-path-of-derealisation/?b=I%20am%20nothing&e=done%20nothing#select][I am nothing in particular, because I have done nothing in particular]... man, the gems just keep on coming.
1956024;1577089929;mp_en_viaje;i had a list of these to get to later, now's that later, boy howdy what a string. apparently this dcu thing's working out.
1956025;1577092920;diana_coman;lolz, so Mocky's [http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-09-04#1933761][rabbit hole] was more of a chicken coop?
1956026;1577092920;ossabot;Logged on 2019-09-04 22:48:05 Mocky: I fell down a rabbit hole
1956027;1577093285;mp_en_viaje;lel
1956028;1577093295;mp_en_viaje;you know why rabbits sleep with their eyes open, btw ?
1956029;1577093333;diana_coman;no idea on rabbity things.
1956030;1577093367;mp_en_viaje;they have very little skin.
1956031;1577093374;mp_en_viaje;if they close their eyes, the foreskin retracts.
1956032;1577093389;diana_coman;ahaha
1956033;1577093392;mp_en_viaje;:)
1956034;1577093563;diana_coman;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-21#1955881 - fwiw, I read through this deed; I hope that is not all of "making the case" as BingoBoingo_ sees it.
1956035;1577093564;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-21 23:41:51 BingoBoingo: !!deed http://paste.deedbot.org/?id=OL7t
1956036;1577101107;mp_en_viaje;dorion_road, can you explain the difference between imminence and immanence ?
1956037;1577113200;BingoBoingo;diana_coman: MPEx is built on [http://trilema.com/2012/gpg-contracts/?b=Sure%20all%20identities&e=may%20be#select][GPG contracts] upheld voluntarily. Introducing "these GPG contracts must be upheld always and forever no matter the cost as if they were fiat contracts" would be subversion. For that, in representing the claim I can't say "This must be paid no matter what" or other constructions along that line without attacking a
1956038;1577113200;BingoBoingo;fundamental part of what makes the Republic.
1956039;1577113242;BingoBoingo;diana_coman: GPG contracts are such that a case can only be so strong without hallucinating a denial of the fundamental difference between GPG contracts and fiat contracts.
1956040;1577114471;diana_coman;BingoBoingo: dunno who do you think was hallucinating that GPG contracts = fiat contracts or something but sure/
1956041;1577114721;BingoBoingo;diana_coman: I don't think anyone present here in is hallucinating that, but not all log readers are here.
1956042;1577114726;diana_coman;ftr, I wasn't either asking for or indeed expecting the sort of "this must be paid no matter what", no idea where you took that from.
1956043;1577114975;BingoBoingo;diana_coman: I apologize for addressing points for the record in a manner that appears to be addressing them to you specifically.
1956044;1577115085;diana_coman;BingoBoingo: no worries.
1956045;1577115193;mp_en_viaje;BingoBoingo, i don't get it, so the idea is i should pay money because you say so ?
1956046;1577115608;BingoBoingo;mp_en_viaje: I'm not saying whether you should pay the money or not. I am saying it would be consistent with the way you've worn the MPEx CEO hat before to pay. You, ultimately, are free to decide to pay or not pay. My client paid me to introduce his interests to the forum, otherwise his interests would have gone unrepresented and certainly unpaid.
1956047;1577115688;mp_en_viaje;but what ~THE~ money are we talking about ?
1956048;1577115703;mp_en_viaje;which the ?
1956049;1577115729;mp_en_viaje;so far it'd seem you expect your signing something you wrote yest retroactively produces some the money however long ago ?
1956050;1577115755;mp_en_viaje;the basis for a claim tuesday can't be a document signed thursday. even if whoever signs it has the autority, which i dun see how you have here.
1956051;1577115876;mp_en_viaje;you're not even a witness here, to be producing something like say [http://trilema.com/2012/icbitse-the-bucket-shop/][the smickles affidavit]. so far the only way that thing can be classified as is a letter of credit, i guess ? you're saying i should give mike_c some dough as you think he's good for it ?
1956052;1577115889;BingoBoingo;mp_en_viaje: I'll request mike_c produce his last statement issued by MPEx
1956053;1577115951;mp_en_viaje;do that ; add to it a plain statement of your involvement, and we can take it from there.
1956054;1577116252;BingoBoingo;mp_en_viaje: Thank you for your patience.
1956055;1577116351;feedbot;http://ossasepia.com/2019/12/23/foxys-unshaded-skin-and-side-effects-notes-on-graphics-in-eulora-viii/ << Ossa Sepia -- Foxy's Unshaded Skin and Side Effects (Notes on Graphics in Eulora, VIII)
1956056;1577120954;mp_en_viaje;diana_coman, oooo
1956057;1577120958;mp_en_viaje;dis is beautiful
1956058;1577121726;diana_coman;mp_en_viaje: the side effects? lol.
1956059;1577121841;feedbot;http://thewhet.net/2019/12/broken-sesame/ << The Whet -- Broken Sesame
1956060;1577125018;BingoBoingo;!!deed http://paste.deedbot.org/?id=jB2s
1956061;1577125021;deedbot;accepted: 1
1956062;1577125131;BingoBoingo;!Qlater tell mike_c http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-23#1955992 and http://paste.deedbot.org/?id=jB2s
1956063;1577125131;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-23 14:26:49 BingoBoingo: !!deed http://paste.deedbot.org/?id=jB2s
1956064;1577125131;lobbesbot;BingoBoingo: The operation succeeded.
1956065;1577127557;dorion_road;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-23#1955968 << I couldn't when I read the question. I looked into the etymology and gather [https://www.etymonline.com/word/imminence][imminence] refers to projection and [https://www.etymonline.com/word/immanence][immanence] refers to inherence.
1956066;1577127558;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-23 07:48:16 mp_en_viaje: dorion_road, can you explain the difference between imminence and immanence ?
1956067;1577129598;mp_en_viaje;right, imminence is being in the very near future ; immanence is the essential tight coupling tying essences to phenomenology.
1956068;1577129603;mp_en_viaje;you ever read the essences series ?
1956069;1577129646;mp_en_viaje;anyway, the latter immediately loads a kantian context, much like saying "subconscious" loads freudian.
1956070;1577141935;BingoBoingo;!!deed http://paste.deedbot.org/?id=LM6J
1956071;1577141935;deedbot;accepted: 1
1956072;1577141965;BingoBoingo;!Qlater tell mike_c http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-23#1956002
1956073;1577141966;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-23 19:08:47 BingoBoingo: !!deed http://paste.deedbot.org/?id=LM6J
1956074;1577141966;lobbesbot;BingoBoingo: The operation succeeded.
1956075;1577146920;feedbot;http://qntra.net/2019/12/uncaring-markets-see-us-dollar-fall-against-peso-uruguayo-and-brazis-real-while-peso-argentino-will-not-stop-shitting-the-bed/ << Qntra -- Uncaring Markets See US Dollar Fall Against Peso Uruguayo And Brazil's Real While Peso Argentino Will Not Stop Shitting The Bed
1956076;1577151363;dorion_road;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-23#1955999 << both sound important to be aware of.
1956077;1577151364;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-23 15:43:10 mp_en_viaje: right, imminence is being in the very near future ; immanence is the essential tight coupling tying essences to phenomenology.
1956078;1577151402;dorion_road;I've read the [http://trilema.com/2014/on-essences/][english translation] of the essences series. I don't recall when I did though and I'm probably due for a re-read.
1956079;1577151437;dorion_road;Unfortunately I've not yet read much Kant, though I know I need to.
1956080;1577153034;BingoBoingo;!!deed http://paste.deedbot.org/?id=KcLJ
1956081;1577153039;deedbot;accepted: 1
1956082;1577154385;BingoBoingo;!!deed http://paste.deedbot.org/?id=x4MA
1956083;1577154387;deedbot;accepted: 1
1956084;1577165717;mp_en_viaje;happy thanksgiving everyone!!!
1956085;1577166111;mp_en_viaje;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-23#1955954 was re ztkfg.com/2019/12/finding-meaning-in-a-deterministic-world-part-3/ btw, nfi why i thought it's self-obvious yest.
1956086;1577166111;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-23 04:39:28 mp_en_viaje: whaack, hey, that's not even bad.
1956087;1577166168;mp_en_viaje;to a certain degree it's rather confusing that your toolbar only shows on index page, i keep thinking i'm on the latest article all the time.
1956088;1577166451;mp_en_viaje;dorion_road, aw fuck, the other two aren't even in english huh. this fucking blows, and it's where the sadness starts, i don't know how to fix this.
1956089;1577173544;feedbot;http://trilema.com/2019/theres-no-better-way-to-ensure-the-enmity-of-the-mediocre-than-by-exposing-their-mediocrity-for-what-it-is/ << Trilema -- There's no better way to ensure the enmity of the mediocre than by exposing their mediocrity for what it is.
1956090;1577181653;bvt;mp_en_viaje: http://trilema.com/2014/peri-metaphyseos-in-english-this-time/ http://trilema.com/2014/the-two-all-essences/ ?
1956091;1577187604;mp_en_viaje;fuck yeah!
1956092;1577187609;mp_en_viaje;tyvm :D
1956093;1577200258;feedbot;http://ossasepia.com/2019/12/24/some-gothic-fashions-of-another-era/ << Ossa Sepia -- Some Gothic Fashions of Another Era
1956094;1577206167;diana_coman;jfw: Keksum's 3rd genesis [http://ossasepia.com/reference-code-shelf/?b=Keksum&e=#select][is now signed and mirrored]; as you've gathered already the previous comments on your article directly, I linked that and there's no need that I see for an additional article; also, you messed up something with your Keksum's article title now.
1956095;1577207717;whaack;mircea_popescu: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-24#1956017 <<-- ty, I had figured the message was meant for lobbes prior. I'll take a look into getting the toolbar showing on the individual article pages. They are hidden by default on mpwp's Kubrick theme.
1956096;1577207717;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-24 01:51:45 mp_en_viaje: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-23#1955954 was re ztkfg.com/2019/12/finding-meaning-in-a-deterministic-world-part-3/ btw, nfi why i thought it's self-obvious yest.
1956097;1577211012;BingoBoingo;In gifts the locals give me this Navidad, [http://archive.is/Stqhh][the names inside the FA are tearing at each other.] Mujica "Rights agenda was a mistake" Other derps "Muh feminismo, un violador eres tú", Mujica "I spent 12 years getting thrown into dark holes"
1956098;1577215977;feedbot;http://qntra.net/2019/12/trump-signs-bill-vastly-increasing-us-military-personnel-costs-as-capability-keeps-declining/ << Qntra -- Trump Signs Bill Vastly Increasing US Military Personnel Costs As Capability Keeps Declining
1956099;1577227291;feedbot;http://trinque.org/2019/12/24/ruin/ << trinque -- Ruin
1956100;1577293901;hanbot;dorion_road haha, so you met voorhees [http://dorion-mode.com/2019/10/simple-steps-the-fabled-outlines/?b=Negative%20space&e=never%20linked#select][in 07 '13] and [http://trilema.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/04/image.jpeg][this], two months previous, seriously never came up? There's a truly toxic acquaintance for ya.
1956101;1577293901;lobbesbot;hanbot: Sent 1 week, 4 days, 21 hours, and 26 minutes ago: https://4.bp.blogspot.com/-ei8CbiT4Hhs/VGP0mq3X_YI/AAAAAAAAABc/JhPPjuKEXaM/s1600/elephant.gif
1956102;1577297679;feedbot;http://qntra.net/2019/12/usg-hypes-operation-delivering-gifts-to-troops-in-syria-as-all-mentions-of-withdrawal-apparently-lies/ << Qntra -- USG Hypes Operation Delivering "Gifts" To Troops In Syria As All Mentions Of Withdrawal Apparently Lies
1956103;1577307863;feedbot;http://bimbo.club/2019/12/belgrade-nis-edirne-istanbul/ << Bimbo Club -- Belgrade, Nis, Edirne, & Istanbul
1956104;1577309497;dorion_road;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-25#1956032 << the conference was mentioned, but I don't remember when or by who - josh rossi is also in that pic and moved to panama in 2013. the importance of who was meeting wasn't seriously discussed with me and I didn't have the smarts at the time to ask and figure it out.
1956105;1577309497;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-25 13:21:44 hanbot: dorion_road haha, so you met voorhees [http://dorion-mode.com/2019/10/simple-steps-the-fabled-outlines/?b=Negative%20space&e=never%20linked#select][in 07 '13] and [http://trilema.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/04/image.jpeg][this], two months previous, seriously never came up? There's a truly toxic acquaintance for ya.
1956106;1577353687;mp_en_viaje;in other housekeeping, hey diana_coman lobbes wouldja mind taking alf's derpy alt-bitcoinwizards off the loggers header list ?
1956107;1577353712;mp_en_viaje;little point playing fave with morons, gotta either have all or none (and ideally -- none).
1956108;1577353899;*;mp_en_viaje has fixed the long over-due logger links on trilema also.
1956109;1577354111;diana_coman;mp_en_viaje: do you mean #asciilifeform or what?
1956110;1577354118;mp_en_viaje;yeah
1956111;1577354208;diana_coman;tbh I kept pondering what *should* be in there to start with; on one hand it would make sense to have #trilema + deeded chans really; onth dunno, I'd want #trinque for instance and he hasn't asked for a deed, so uhm.
1956112;1577354248;*;mp_en_viaje now has to come up with some manner of dealing with http://deedbot.org/bundle-596500.txt
1956113;1577354250;diana_coman;and #eulora...
1956114;1577354276;mp_en_viaje;because fucking obviously, the reason you do things is so you have to undo them two weeks later, such is the great benefit of dealing with people.
1956115;1577354308;mp_en_viaje;diana_coman, imo all the rest can stay. also imo it is more important to be right than principled. the principles can be written in afterwards, for as long as you're right ; if you're wrong no writ will save you anyway.
1956116;1577354351;diana_coman;in principle, yes :D
1956117;1577354354;mp_en_viaje;:p
1956118;1577354366;mp_en_viaje;honestly #eulora was a sorta proto-deed castle for chet.
1956119;1577354411;diana_coman;makes sense; I'll get to it later today.
1956120;1577354430;mp_en_viaje;diana_coman, this is a great beautiful mirror to that "in theory, there's no difference between theory and craptice" ditty : "in principle, there's no difference between right and principled".
1956121;1577354450;diana_coman;hah, craptice indeed
1956122;1577354454;mp_en_viaje;you know ?
1956123;1577369884;mp_en_viaje;meanwhile in prophetic 2009ia, http://trilema.com/2009/ideile-bune-ideile-proaste-si-ideile-noastre/
1956124;1577369902;mp_en_viaje;"Sa nu observam diferenta intre practica si teorie, si sa incercam practic o aplicare teoretica a teoriei in practica.", apparently prennial.
1956125;1577393705;diana_coman;!!v DC810768CF6BB492BF848A933D736A77B5476FB1C5B40031735ACCDD38DC1942
1956126;1577393706;deedbot;diana_coman updated rating of shrysr from 2 to -8 << fuck off granted, as he clearly prefers.
1956127;1577393993;lobbes;http://logs.ericbenevides.com/log/trilema/2019-12-26#1956038 << [http://logs.ericbenevides.com/log][done]
1956128;1577393993;ericbot;Logged on 2019-12-26 09:52:57 mp_en_viaje: in other housekeeping, hey diana_coman lobbes wouldja mind taking alf's derpy alt-bitcoinwizards off the loggers header list ?
1956129;1577394002;*;lobbes will bbl; attending meat matters for the holidays and will have sporadic terminal access until ~Jan 2
1956130;1577394030;BingoBoingo;!!rated diana_coman
1956131;1577394030;deedbot;BingoBoingo rated diana_coman 5 at 2018/03/19 15:39:55 << S.MG, Republic Tech development, Reliable
1956132;1577394066;BingoBoingo;!!rate diana_coman 9 Master of the Serene Republic's University, S.MG, etc
1956133;1577394067;deedbot;Get your OTP: http://paste.deedbot.org/?id=64D0
1956134;1577394109;BingoBoingo;!!v E38DB114DE66D5775DE472FD62916ECD7A47C9BAC63FD029F111301E618371B9
1956135;1577394109;deedbot;BingoBoingo updated rating of diana_coman from 5 to 9 << Master of the Serene Republic's University, S.MG, etc
1956136;1577394397;feedbot;http://qntra.net/2019/12/media-derps-blame-russian-bots-over-film-franchise-collapse/ << Qntra -- Media Derps Blame "Russian Bots" Over "Film Franchise" Collapse
1956137;1577394914;BingoBoingo;!!rated mircea_popescu
1956138;1577394914;deedbot;BingoBoingo rated mircea_popescu 10 at 2014/03/05 01:09:07 << Ongoing bsns
1956139;1577394923;BingoBoingo;!!v C5687A8B8B8ED4BFB42CAFA8E599FB65706BB3B11DC5F225D754C4AEDE72D4DF
1956140;1577394923;deedbot;BingoBoingo updated rating of mircea_popescu from 10 to 9 << Lord of Lords
1956141;1577394932;BingoBoingo;!!rated hanbot
1956142;1577394932;deedbot;BingoBoingo rated hanbot 3 at 2014/04/24 12:50:14 << Only Functional part of Bitcointalk
1956143;1577394946;BingoBoingo;!!v 6C776BAF01793E771F3A260FC514C7BA461D902E2F559517A1115EE5E3EDD922
1956144;1577394947;deedbot;BingoBoingo updated rating of hanbot from 3 to 9 << Manticore
1956145;1577394956;BingoBoingo;!!rated asciilifeform
1956146;1577394956;deedbot;BingoBoingo rated asciilifeform 10 at 2018/04/20 15:53:16 << Met in person, Verified lover of cats, engineer
1956147;1577394972;BingoBoingo;!!v 8342478D6CE3B9D3BACA176E757826ED5F89114D07EF6E929496845DF02000D3
1956148;1577394972;deedbot;BingoBoingo updated rating of asciilifeform from 10 to 5 << Met in person, have a server in his rack, time insensitive when airplanes aren't involved
1956149;1577394987;BingoBoingo;!!rated nicoleci
1956150;1577394987;deedbot;BingoBoingo rated nicoleci 2 at 2018/10/29 02:18:13 << Mircea's chattle, summarizer in training, Outside the Wire
1956151;1577395006;BingoBoingo;!!v C1C9E0B6A0DB5CAF4CD2785BC00D5B251532DEF4B93D6058235BCF0FB8F9CDC1
1956152;1577395006;deedbot;BingoBoingo updated rating of nicoleci from 2 to 5 << Midwestern Escapee, blogs @ bimbo.club
1956153;1577397624;trinque;speaking of updating ratings, in reflecting, I've been quite affected by the year's events as amply evidenced in recent logs.
1956154;1577397648;trinque;I built up one hell of a suppression machine living where I do.
1956155;1577397712;trinque;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-26#1956047 << I'll respect this, and stop trying to inject my own self-evaluations into the matter.
1956156;1577397712;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-26 06:08:34 mp_en_viaje: diana_coman, imo all the rest can stay. also imo it is more important to be right than principled. the principles can be written in afterwards, for as long as you're right ; if you're wrong no writ will save you anyway.
1956157;1577440281;feedbot;http://trilema.com/2019/do-you-know-why-theyre-just-so-damn-awkward-i-only-ask-because-i-finally-figured-it-out/ << Trilema -- Do you know why they're just so damn awkward ? I only ask because I finally figured it out!
1956158;1577446490;diana_coman;!!v F124CF5A90FF11EC662CCDEB3C33B22C442DE5311A92A096D8E2AA03EDD36189
1956159;1577446490;deedbot;diana_coman updated rating of crowncloud_ from 2 to 1 << Australian ISP with US dc-partner; has key, won't use it.
1956160;1577446509;diana_coman;!!v 2AFB7EA3949B06F57B728E4D35D1CE064791A98C3E5132FC3FB21845CDF7876B
1956161;1577446510;deedbot;diana_coman updated rating of Metronix from 2 to 1 << Indonesian ISP; has key, won't use it.
1956162;1577446532;diana_coman;!!v 0598B883206898A6CDF15E20979BDD3E9730D84DA003E1E5145F4BF7C29EA691
1956163;1577446533;deedbot;diana_coman updated rating of asciilifeform from 9 to 1 << Tech outputs brilliant when available; talk outputs and people "evaluations" entirely unreliable.
1956164;1577448386;mp_en_viaje;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-26#1956087 << what's that mean ?
1956165;1577448386;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-26 18:12:01 trinque: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-26#1956047 << I'll respect this, and stop trying to inject my own self-evaluations into the matter.
1956166;1577448424;mp_en_viaje;neways, your main hope is deconstructing the supression machine, not trying to find it new fields of employ.
1956167;1577449597;mp_en_viaje;mwanwhile in other coincidental great things, i found [http://trilema.com/2016/why-is-that/][the article] where (among other great things, such as early warnings to beings an engineer) i discuss the problem of toddlers and dynamic equilibrium. which, i recall, was wanted and not found at some point somewhat recently -- i just can't anymore find where that happened.
1956168;1577449600;mp_en_viaje;life's great.
1956169;1577457865;mp_en_viaje;dorion_road, http://dorion-mode.com/2019/12/some-reasons-contributing-to-tmsr-os-is-ev/ << lotta gaps and jumps huh.
1956170;1577458234;diana_coman;yeah, he tried there for higher than he realised; had a talk with him on that.
1956171;1577462146;feedbot;http://qntra.net/2019/12/alphabets-youtube-takes-down-bitcoin-and-crypto-videos-before-quickly-restoring-them-as-irrelevant/ << Qntra -- Alphabet's Youtube Takes Down "Bitcoin and Crypto" Videos Before Quickly Restoring Them As Irrelevant
1956172;1577464155;feedbot;http://qntra.net/2019/12/kansas-city-inmates-drastically-inflated-property-tax-payment-refused-by-whitney-for-being-wrong-type-of-usg-issued-scrip/ << Qntra -- Kansas City Inmate's Drastically Inflated Property Tax Payment Refused By Whitney For Being Wrong Type Of USG Issued Scrip
1956173;1577476975;feedbot;http://bingology.net/2019/data-center-survey-part-one-latam-and-iberia/ << Bingology - BingoBoingo's Blog -- Data Center Survey Part One - LATAM and Iberia
1956174;1577478674;feedbot;http://bingology.net/2019/data-center-survey-part-2-poland-serbia-prague-with-its-outlying-areas/ << Bingology - BingoBoingo's Blog -- Data Center Survey Part 2: Poland, Serbia, Prague With Its Outlying Areas
1956175;1577495274;Mocky;!!pay mircea_popescu 1
1956176;1577495282;deedbot;Get your OTP: http://paste.deedbot.org/?id=K0Ua
1956177;1577495322;Mocky;!!v 7DE87ACB3A33E2B5224A9961D4121617C06ED8AAF5FB6949B0F45537C20F5D1C
1956178;1577495325;deedbot;Mocky paid mircea_popescu 1
1956179;1577495374;Mocky;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2018-11-15#1872515 http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2018-11-15#1872520
1956180;1577495374;ossabot;Logged on 2018-11-15 11:56:36 mircea_popescu: !!pay Mocky 1
1956181;1577495374;ossabot;Logged on 2018-11-15 11:58:12 mircea_popescu: i'll want the coin back next year. now go forth and own stupidity no more!
1956182;1577513362;mp_en_viaje;Mocky, yay ty.
1956183;1577513397;mp_en_viaje;!!rated Mocky
1956184;1577513397;deedbot;mp_en_viaje has not rated Mocky.
1956185;1577513401;mp_en_viaje;gah
1956186;1577513444;mircea_popescu;!!rated Mocky
1956187;1577513444;deedbot;mircea_popescu rated Mocky 9 at 2019/09/25 10:45:13 << ἀποκρισιάριος دولة قطر
1956188;1577513519;mircea_popescu;so listen... while you were away there's been a lot of progress ongoing in the republic, these guys now have blogs and stick to publishing planning schedules and such wunderbar alien techs. you gonna catch up with the group ?
1956189;1577513835;mircea_popescu;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-27#1956098 << here's what ~i~ mean : as you live, the very substance of what living even is will work to expose things you're no good at. this is what it is, and what it can ever possibly be. much like all energy manipulation is an entropy increase, all living is self-discovery.
1956190;1577513835;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-27 08:17:17 mp_en_viaje: neways, your main hope is deconstructing the supression machine, not trying to find it new fields of employ.
1956191;1577513918;mircea_popescu;every time you discover something, you get the same exact choice, again and again each time. you get the same choice that also happens to be the ~only~ meaningful choice you ever get, or ever could possibly get : are you going to fix it ?
1956192;1577514051;mircea_popescu;there's strictly two possible answers you can ever produce, and they're yes or no. yes sucks because, well... it is suicide. [http://ossasepia.com/2019/10/31/working-with-ideals-and-perfections/#comment-6848][]quite literally], the little girl gotta die.
1956193;1577514115;mircea_popescu;no sucks because... it really doesn't. once you decide you actually "like" your dysfunction, or in any case you're not equal to its remedial, you're stuck hanging out in #asciilifeform with all the other cripples.
1956194;1577514226;mircea_popescu;your life becomes a carousel of a) identifying partitions upon the world that'll neatly divide it across the line of "this part exposes my dysfunction" / "this part doesn't expose my dysfunction" (definitionally an impossible task) and b) making up stories about how it all works out, or will, or whatever.
1956195;1577514360;mircea_popescu;in the end, what you do is hang out with the other cripples. that's it, the loser table at the highschool cafeteria, where you tell each other stories of "how you aren't really geeks", and how one day you'll get the cheerleader, the usual fare. making pacts about losing your virginity by end of school...
1956196;1577514384;mircea_popescu;it's not exactly novel, but on the contrary well documented to date. lotta cripples have lived since the practical implementation of rochester's [http://trilema.com/2014/i-love-rochester-so-will-you/#footnote_32_56488][all men be cowards if they durst].
1956197;1577514861;mircea_popescu;it gets you stuck saying patently dumb shit like "[http://archive.is/V9h54#selection-849.11-849.52][alliance of the smart against the stupid]" when what you quite transparently ~really~ mean is very much "i thought this guy [http://trilema.com/2019/being-an-engineer-the-mental-disorder/?b=potato&e=nits#select][was gonna vouch] for my imaginary partitions of a) above!" ;
1956198;1577514861;mircea_popescu;and everyone else is stuck somehow reconciling your supposed "great technical acumen" with your apparent incapacity to intellectually function enough to match a age-adequately developed nine year old slut -- which is incidentally how the elaborate narrative of the naysayers even evoloved over time : the others dealing with the anal child is how anal childhood even gets implanted in heads in the first place.
1956199;1577514963;mircea_popescu;from whence it can further spread -- much like camels who never saw other camels spit don't know how to spit nor ever spit, while camels who did see other camels spit do know how and actually do it, just so people don't come up with evil naturally, they just replicate it from having seen it before.
1956200;1577515053;mircea_popescu;this isn't a complaint -- i don't personally mind evil exists, nor do i believe it shouldn't exist or that its absence would signal any kind of improvement. without evil the world's boring as fuck, which is why idiots asking dumb questions like "how come an infinitely good god has small children raped to death" are fucking stupid. evil is a better addition to the world than fucking cinema, it'd be way too borning to try
1956201;1577515053;mircea_popescu; and live without.
1956202;1577515177;mircea_popescu;nevertheless -- this introduces no relativism. the ethical choice stays the ethical choice, and the moral state remains the moral state. yes or no, the perpetual question, and well... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3CTZty62iqo
1956203;1577515751;mircea_popescu;aw fuck
1956204;1577515754;mircea_popescu;!!seen spyked
1956205;1577515754;deedbot;2019/12/16 09:33:35 http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-10#1954760 <-- certainly looks like a spin on greenspun's rule: any system that amasses enough complexity (for some values of "enough", at least) becomes a contender for the "operating system" label. imho emacs, wp, cltrons all fit in there.
1956206;1577515754;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-10 12:10:44 BingoBoingo: Reading the ongoing conversations in the forums and castles, I get a building suspicion [http://ossasepia.com/2019/12/06/cutting-through-the-tangles-notes-on-graphics-in-eulora-vii/#comment-7162][that further cutting on Gentoo is going to start looking like cutting on CrystalSpace]
1956207;1577515814;mircea_popescu;!Qlater tell spyked yo, feedbot's unwinding the whole history of comments on trilema at me fo rsome reason, halp!
1956208;1577515821;mircea_popescu;!Q later tell spyked yo, feedbot's unwinding the whole history of comments on trilema at me fo rsome reason, halp!
1956209;1577515828;mircea_popescu;jaysus.
1956210;1577515836;mircea_popescu;lobbes, bot ded ?
1956211;1577531935;spyked;mircea_popescu: hm, from what I see it only sent the comments/new feeds since it first saw mircea_popescu offline
1956212;1577531964;*;spyked thinks feedbot should perhaps come with a "purge" command which deletes pending notifications
1956213;1577537886;hanbot;in other unexpected wins, wikipedia started redirecting my browser to "mandatory upgrade" sometime last week. of all the deprecations i've steadfastly watched pass by in my box's moat as it were, this one is by far the most satisfying.
1956214;1577549429;trinque;mircea_popescu: I'm willing to adapt, and to use my blog to do so.
1956215;1577549444;trinque;specifically, if you saw fit to issue a deed for #trinque , I'd happily accept
1956216;1577549695;trinque;and in that spirit, part 1 of my contribution to the OS thread shall be published tonight, and so on by days until finished. maybe 4/5 parts.
1956217;1577560788;BingoBoingo;In lulz at the local/international interface, local police seized some cocaine. They honestly assessed the pile at ~1 million USD using the local wholesale price. The story moved to the international press today. The BBC is assessing the value of the pile at ~1 billion USD using their local retail prices.
1956218;1577566739;diana_coman;trinque: I'm looking forward to that OS-related series.
1956219;1577567586;trinque;diana_coman: me too, actually! enjoying myself over here.
1956220;1577567623;trinque;teaser fact: busybox is *half* the size of grub-2 by LoC
1956221;1577567940;diana_coman;ahaha, maybe that's why grub-"2", lolz.
1956222;1577568315;trinque;god damned bootloader being larger than an entire userland, holy hell.
1956223;1577568317;*;trinque bbl
1956224;1577569579;feedbot;http://qntra.net/2019/12/phillippines-bars-two-us-pantsuitist-senators-from-entry-threatens-imposing-visa-requirement-on-all-us-nationals/ << Qntra -- Phillippines Bars Two US Pantsuitist Senators From Entry Threatens Imposing Visa Requirement On All US Nationals
1956225;1577587316;feedbot;http://bingology.net/2019/reviewing-the-last-plans-and-new-plans-going-into-2020/ << Bingology - BingoBoingo's Blog -- Reviewing The Last Plans And New Plans Going Into 2020
1956226;1577587324;feedbot;http://trinque.org/2019/12/28/a-republican-os-part-1/ << trinque -- A Republican OS - Part 1
1956227;1577587582;trinque;and jfw, dorion_road, if you don't see the word "Gales" in there, it's because I'm trying to disabuse you of the notion that there's such thing as a "Gales" which you made, by way of sheer numbers.
1956228;1577587604;trinque;and I'm not even halfway to a blinking cursor yet
1956229;1577588038;trinque;ftr not saying anything about the value of the gales work, above. I think it's quite valuable, but we'll get there.
1956230;1577612020;diana_coman;trinque: is the select thing not working on your blog? I'm trying to select that great "fits in hand" and I can't seem to, [http://trinque.org/2019/12/28/a-republican-os-part-1/?b=fit&e=#select][this] doesn't do anything.
1956231;1577614858;mircea_popescu;in this morn's stray thoughts : if "wife" ends up spelled "waifu" in japanese, is it the case "kungfu" really should be "knife" ?
1956232;1577614959;mircea_popescu;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-28#1956143 << ah gosh durnit, you're exactly right. it's my fault, i got confused by thinking of two different nicks as "me".
1956233;1577614959;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-28 07:29:14 spyked: mircea_popescu: hm, from what I see it only sent the comments/new feeds since it first saw mircea_popescu offline
1956234;1577614977;mircea_popescu;sorry for the constant complaints borne out of user error, plox don't take it to heart.
1956235;1577615042;mircea_popescu;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-28#1956145 << i'm sure you can donate less than the cost of a cup of coffee or whatever though. remember, it's the site that doesn't advertise -- a point oft repeated via wikipedia not-advertising.
1956236;1577615042;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-28 09:08:25 hanbot: in other unexpected wins, wikipedia started redirecting my browser to "mandatory upgrade" sometime last week. of all the deprecations i've steadfastly watched pass by in my box's moat as it were, this one is by far the most satisfying.
1956237;1577615093;mircea_popescu;in keeping with the theme, "pedoworld reality distortion field" ends up spelled "wiki" in hawaii or some shit.
1956238;1577615305;mircea_popescu;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-28#1956147 << this is probably the furthest afield asking in the history of askings on planet earth. but... sure, why not, if you'll happily accept ima fire up the magic box later and make the thing.
1956239;1577615305;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-28 12:21:04 trinque: specifically, if you saw fit to issue a deed for #trinque , I'd happily accept
1956240;1577615576;mircea_popescu;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-28#1956154 << fucking nonsense of this ilk is how we ended up [http://trilema.com/2013/the-free-cash-machine/#comment-132777][in the shit] in the first fucking place.
1956241;1577615576;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-28 17:35:36 trinque: god damned bootloader being larger than an entire userland, holy hell.
1956242;1577616145;mircea_popescu;incidentally BingoBoingo what's the snag now ? your client ran off from under you after paying ?!
1956243;1577616228;mircea_popescu;!!seen shysr
1956244;1577616242;deedbot;I haven't seen shysr
1956245;1577616244;mircea_popescu;da fuck
1956246;1577616257;mircea_popescu;!!seen shrysr
1956247;1577616259;deedbot;2019/08/01 17:40:34 mp_en_viaje: yes selection on your pages work, and so does younghands.club, .. seen it before and just rechecked.
1956248;1577616276;mircea_popescu;who the fuck even is this guy
1956249;1577616370;mircea_popescu;apparently now there's [ztkfg.com/2019/12/thoughts-on-shrysr-leaving-younghands-and-asciilifeforms-excommunication/][drama] about people i don't even recall ever hearing of. i have fiddy tabs open struggling to keep up with everyone over here and barely managing... it's like an xmas miracle or something.
1956250;1577616591;mircea_popescu;oh right, the introvert indian engine guy, i see.
1956251;1577621304;mircea_popescu;well now that i took all the time to write it, might as well link it : http://ztkfg.com/2019/12/thoughts-on-shrysr-leaving-younghands-and-asciilifeforms-excommunication/#comment-144 (though whaack stll jas to approve it)
1956252;1577621918;feedbot;http://bvt-trace.net/2019/12/gales-installation-report/ << bvt's backtrace -- Gales Installation Report
1956253;1577625506;BingoBoingo;mircea_popescu: Waiting for deedbot to go from acceptance to deeding. I've got the [http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-23#1956014][MPEx statement with my involvement note attached on top] submitted to deedbot. (Clearsigned statement on its own [http://paste.deedbot.org/?id=T0Va][here] since GPG doesn't like making nested signatures). For whatever it may be worth, I've also got my client to sign [http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/t
1956254;1577625506;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-23 22:36:18 BingoBoingo: !!deed http://paste.deedbot.org/?id=x4MA
1956255;1577625506;BingoBoingo;rilema/2019-12-23#1956012][instructions for me,] which I also submitted to deedbot.
1956256;1577625616;BingoBoingo;The logling where I deed the client's signed instructions again, this time under cutting length: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-23#1956012
1956257;1577625616;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-23 22:13:47 BingoBoingo: !!deed http://paste.deedbot.org/?id=KcLJ
1956258;1577625680;whaack;mircea_popescu: approved ^
1956259;1577626472;mircea_popescu;BingoBoingo, aite, i might be out for a few days seeing how it's new year but we shall resume in 2020
1956260;1577626505;mircea_popescu;whaack, why ty
1956261;1577626607;BingoBoingo;mircea_popescu: Thank you.
1956262;1577626619;mircea_popescu;bvt, /fox/for/ /it's/its/
1956263;1577626927;mircea_popescu;"A feature that I liked a lot is that shell is the only scripting language in the default install of the distribution. Typically perl and python get pulled in unconditionally as a build dependency of a runtime dependency of some rarely-used default-installed utility, or are directly used to implement package manager, etc. With Gales, a decision about what scripting language to use can be made without constraints created
1956264;1577626927;mircea_popescu; by ready availability of python or others." << indeed this is mindblowingly beautiful, and as far as i current;y know the foremost fearher in jfw 's cap.
1956265;1577626937;mircea_popescu;feather*
1956266;1577627165;mircea_popescu;neways, as to the burning "OTOH, I wonder if things like Apache or imagemagick get installed, how will the package management system work out, and how comprehensible will system stay?" question -- i see the merit of using the clean spot as a fixed point to attempt expanding cleanliness. so, it would work by apache becoming tmserv or w/e, and not sucking anymore.
1956267;1577627175;mircea_popescu;at least, ideally.
1956268;1577627241;mircea_popescu;or to put it another way, i do not believe it is either intelligent or even tolerable to try and carry forward the "install" paradigm from derpworld. something much more akin to diana_coman 's work on eulora is what "get installed" will have to mean.
1956269;1577637253;feedbot;http://ossasepia.com/2019/12/29/the-shady-business-with-shaders-in-cs-notes-on-graphics-in-eulora-ix/ << Ossa Sepia -- The Shady Business with Shaders in CS (Notes on Graphics in Eulora, IX)
1956270;1577641116;trinque;mircea_popescu: does this mean "everything is always built and installed" ?
1956271;1577641187;bvt;mircea_popescu: ty; fixed.
1956272;1577641200;trinque;I don't for example need anything GUI-related in an embedded linux device
1956273;1577641253;trinque;I agree that there should be single, correct answers when choosing components (as I'm trying to lay out the options for such selection in my series), but not that each component is always present in any system.
1956274;1577641278;trinque;they are however all to be in the source v-tree, of course.
1956275;1577641290;bvt;mircea_popescu: re second q, imho cleaning up the components will be driven by how the OS gets [re]structured around V, too early to say right now
1956276;1577641343;trinque;bvt: not trying to be a pedantic dick over here, but it's v that's the boundary around the other stuff, not the other stuff around v
1956277;1577641438;bvt;at the individual v-trees sure, but on the yddragsil level?
1956278;1577641466;trinque;no, there's only one v tree
1956279;1577641487;trinque;we've just only ever composed fragments of it yet.
1956280;1577641646;bvt;in this case, i can restate it as 'depends on how current fragments will get composed into one tree'
1956281;1577652303;trinque;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-29#1956162 << this should now work.
1956282;1577652303;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-29 05:44:04 diana_coman: trinque: is the select thing not working on your blog? I'm trying to select that great "fits in hand" and I can't seem to, [http://trinque.org/2019/12/28/a-republican-os-part-1/?b=fit&e=#select][this] doesn't do anything.
1956283;1577652565;feedbot;http://qntra.net/2019/12/iran-conducts-joint-naval-drills-with-china-and-russia-in-gulf-of-oman/ << Qntra -- Iran Conducts Joint Naval Drills With China and Russia In Gulf Of Oman
1956284;1577654733;diana_coman;trinque: I had a look at your published [http://trinque.org/src/paster/][paster] lisp code; my current understanding is that it's only a part of what's required to stand up a backup paste service though, isn't it? mind pointing me to the rest of the bits/a recipe to put it all together? I had this idea that it's saner to replicate at the very least the paste service and a mirrored wot website. My current understanding of that paster ...
1956285;1577654739;diana_coman;... lisp code is that it pulls in the drakma http client that pulls in as far as I can see another 18 deps (and moreover so far one of them fails anyway on my current setup aka centos 6 with sbcl 1.0.39, asdf 2.26; but I see that whaack reports [http://ztkfg.com/2019/12/setting-up-trinques-logbot-on-centos-6-with-sbcl-quicklisp-swank-and-postgres/][sbcl 1.4.14] working for the logbot so I'll try it next with that and see.)
1956286;1577654868;trinque;yeah, that thing's just a lib around doing http posts to what's a very simple wad of php
1956287;1577654879;diana_coman;whaack: what version of asdf did you get to work with all the rest anyway?
1956288;1577654884;whaack;diana_coman: From my experience, for most packages from quicklisp you're going to have problems if you don't have asdf 3+, which comes with sbcl 1.4.14 (not sure what the first version of sbcl with asdf 3+ was)
1956289;1577654884;trinque;I can genesize the phpwad as well.
1956290;1577654898;diana_coman;trinque: please do, thank you.
1956291;1577655042;whaack;diana_coman: i'm using asdf 3.3.1
1956292;1577655069;diana_coman;noted, thanks; basically so far it's have fun with python versions or fun with asdf version, lolz.
1956293;1577655102;*;diana_coman will bbl
1956294;1577655123;whaack;diana_coman: I tried and failed to upgrade to asdf 3+ while keeping my sbcl 1.something . That is one reason why I switched my sbcl to 1.4.14
1956295;1577655144;whaack;1.0.something*
1956296;1577655179;trinque;whaack: what's the principle upon which you choose versions of these?
1956297;1577655256;whaack;trinque: I can't say I am principled in the manner. in general, i use the lowest version that works
1956298;1577655765;trinque;I think this is a bad heuristic.
1956299;1577655786;trinque;version is serving here as a proxy for complexity
1956300;1577655799;whaack;trinque: i am more than open to hear yours
1956301;1577655800;trinque;there's also this hard-to-define cultural decay element
1956302;1577655869;trinque;whaack: in this case, between sbcl-1.0.50 and the latest, the C kernel of the thing actually got smaller by roughly a third, while the lisp part expanded by about 100k lines
1956303;1577655898;trinque;so it's not so clear that it got harder to maintain as time went on, depending a whole bunch on where that extra lisp ended up
1956304;1577655934;trinque;lines are another bad proxy for complexity, but they're a better measure than the version triple
1956305;1577656106;whaack;trinque: what were the sizes of the C kernel and lisp part to begin with?
1956306;1577656193;whaack;trinque: And what version of sbcl + asdf do you use yourself?
1956307;1577656213;trinque;I try not to use asdf at all, anymore.
1956308;1577656228;trinque;but I've had a pretty violently negative reaction to the whole pile.
1956309;1577656266;trinque;I'd be willing to abandon lisp for now, seeing as how the usable components incur at least another 400k lines of bloat, and for that you gain yet another javascript ecosystem.
1956310;1577656327;trinque;if we were to retain lisp, I'd say pick one, don't have a python alongside it, and don't expect to use much "open source" to help you.
1956311;1577656426;trinque;clozurecl ftr is just about as fat as sbcl these days.
1956312;1577656614;trinque;and both of these are larger, again, than ALL OF BUSYBOX
1956313;1577656619;trinque;which includes a shell
1956314;1577656637;trinque;and that's the latest, fattest busybox yet.
1956315;1577656659;trinque;anyhow, gonna stop skipping ahead and get to writing
1956316;1577656707;whaack;trinque: well fwiw I sincerely hope tmsr-os comes with a lisp over a python
1956317;1577656728;trinque;not saying it shouldn't, but why do you hope that?
1956318;1577656859;diana_coman;ahaha, by now I see that trinque will measure everything in multiples of busybox.
1956319;1577656943;whaack;trinque: First, I find it more pleasant writing in lisp. Second, I like the cultural aspect of a (present day) more niche language. Then for problems with python: i find the single line lambdas a strange requirement, and not having tail call optimization is lame (although i admit i can't think of many/any cases where that's been a problem)
1956320;1577656963;diana_coman;re paster though tbh this attempt (coming as it does on top of the previous mess with [http://ossasepia.com/2019/09/02/ossabot-and-its-flask-of-python-27-on-centos-6/][python and its flask]) left me looking again for not using either.
1956321;1577657094;whaack;trinque: pasting chunks of python code is also a pain given the blocks-created-by-tabs design
1956322;1577657147;trinque;diana_coman: http://trinque.org/2019/12/28/a-republican-os-part-1/comment-page-1/#comment-133
1956323;1577657157;diana_coman;whaack: wtf's "the cultural aspect of a (present day) more niche language" ?
1956324;1577657292;trinque;nobody's defending python; I'm questioning the superiority of lisp for anything you might actually be doing on a regular basis.
1956325;1577657325;trinque;all my tmsr work to date could've been php or pyshits for all the difference it would've made.
1956326;1577657350;whaack;diana_coman: if i search for a piece of lisp code to do something, I have a (perhaps naive) belief that I am more likely to find something well written, since there are fewer people using the language
1956327;1577657375;trinque;which is not just a bunch of bawww. it's worthwhile to question wtf we use to value things within which *whole lifetimes* can be lost, wasted.
1956328;1577657445;trinque;whaack: starting at beliefs is going to be a shaky foundation, but fwiw I "believe" most folks writing lisp today are compulsive masturbators like gabriel_laddel
1956329;1577657559;diana_coman;whaack: that's naive at best, indeed.
1956330;1577657602;diana_coman;trinque: I'll take some more time to digest both the article and the comment.
1956331;1577657633;*;trinque tips hat
1956332;1577662004;dorion_road;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-28#1956159 << thanks. my position is gales, like cuntoo, is a stepping stone to tmsr os so looks like we're onthe same page there.
1956333;1577662005;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-28 22:56:45 trinque: and jfw, dorion_road, if you don't see the word "Gales" in there, it's because I'm trying to disabuse you of the notion that there's such thing as a "Gales" which you made, by way of sheer numbers.
1956334;1577674669;feedbot;http://trinque.org/2019/12/29/a-republican-os-part-2/ << trinque -- A Republican OS - Part 2
1956335;1577696876;mircea_popescu;meanwhile in beautiful if ancient turns of phrase, [http://trilema.com/2010/dupa-dave-winer-citire/?b=vorbesc%20din&e=paralel#select][vorbesc din viitorul ulterior unor oameni care sed in trecutul imemorial si viseaza frumos la viitorul paralel]
1956336;1577697486;mircea_popescu;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-29#1956202 << not necessarily, what i meant was, "everything is first read, then [http://logs.minigame.biz/2017-02-21.log.html#t21:53:17][the ints are fixed], then it's read some more, then all the shit is taken out, [http://ossasepia.com/2019/12/06/cutting-through-the-tangles-notes-on-graphics-in-eulora-vii/][bit] by [http://fixpoint.welshcomputing.com/2019/draft-gbw-node-s
1956337;1577697486;mircea_popescu;chema/?b=Compared&e=be#select][bit], then eventually a small pile of actually useful and working code is left behind, implementing 108% or so of what the old pile actually did while removing 98% or so of what it had no business doing"
1956338;1577697486;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-29 13:49:02 trinque: mircea_popescu: does this mean "everything is always built and installed" ?
1956339;1577697487;lobbesbot;Logged on 2017-02-21 21:53:17: now, eulora DID move away from broken ints to sane ints during migration to 0.1.2, and i don't know anyone cared enohgh to extensively debug the insanity that is microsoft. so you might have found something. what exactly were those new errors ?
1956340;1577697511;mircea_popescu;btw diana_coman there's no ossasepia on the original "holy shit, ints!!" or am i just not finding it ?
1956341;1577697519;mircea_popescu;i seem to remember having read something
1956342;1577697691;diana_coman;mircea_popescu: do you mean the move to int64?
1956343;1577697697;mircea_popescu;yep
1956344;1577697732;diana_coman;hmmmm, let me see but I think it was just a mention in one of those open sores rants
1956345;1577697745;mircea_popescu;ah was it ?
1956346;1577697767;mircea_popescu;was it on some old blog and never got moved, is that possible ?
1956347;1577697825;diana_coman;mircea_popescu: that's not possible as the only "old blog not moved" is that thing on wordpress.org that dates from...uhm, 2009/10 ?
1956348;1577697828;mircea_popescu;pretty sure i insisted a thing be published at the end of what was a longish march if memory serves, and pretty sure i was gratified in it ; moreover i recall interacting with a nobject
1956349;1577697849;mircea_popescu;anyways
1956350;1577697993;diana_coman;hm, in my memory the int64 kind of merges with eviscerating the gem mess out of the server
1956351;1577698043;mircea_popescu;oh was it in there ?
1956352;1577698053;mircea_popescu;anyway, to make this pick on diana_coman day : hey, check out http://ossasepia.com/2010/02/08/despre-control-si-recunoasterea-greselilor/?b=invit&e=publica#select
1956353;1577698118;mircea_popescu;proiectele de success ale lu' [http://trilema.com/2010/dobitoc-stanca/][dobi stanca].
1956354;1577698124;diana_coman;well, technically it was first the move to int64 and then the rest but practically they still overlapped to some degree and the similar pains etc.
1956355;1577698189;diana_coman;ahahah; that was one of those things where "at least I figure it out quickly enough", lolz
1956356;1577698245;mircea_popescu;100% costi rogozanu, 9 articles since sept. basically a 1/100th of a qntra, "[https://ro.wikipedia.org/wiki/Realitatea_TV][trustul realitatea media]" (wikilink because notable keks)
1956357;1577698261;diana_coman;fwiw I went there because of a former friend who kept pulling at me about it; nothing to do with stanca really, never even talked to him ever.
1956358;1577698285;mircea_popescu;"Filozofia postului este că evenimentul guvernează programul, astfel încât în orice moment desfășurătorul de emisie poate fi dinamizat cu informații de ultimă oră."
1956359;1577698289;mircea_popescu;o god this is fucking beautiful.
1956360;1577698336;mircea_popescu;diana_coman, i didn't imagine you had, no. just... you know, my own amusements, what can i say. tara mica da' vesela.
1956361;1577698350;diana_coman;mircea_popescu: tbh re ints I recall an article on trilema.com - if I can find it now, hm.
1956362;1577698372;mircea_popescu;oh, did i put it in some minigame report instead ?!
1956363;1577698468;diana_coman;mircea_popescu: [http://trilema.com/2016/eulorangement/#footnote_0_67304][here]?
1956364;1577698537;mircea_popescu;imo this is from an earlier stage when the building blocks of what the problem was going to be were still being assembled.
1956365;1577698544;mircea_popescu;the "fuck ints" order came iirc 2017
1956366;1577698590;diana_coman;hmmm, http://ossasepia.com/2018/03/30/my-first-2-years-as-cto-for-minigame/?b=April&e=bits#select
1956367;1577698603;diana_coman;so dunno, maybe I don't fully get what you have in mind re "fuck ints"?
1956368;1577698615;mircea_popescu;hmmm
1956369;1577698645;mircea_popescu;no, that's it. so it was 2016 hmmm
1956370;1577698703;*;diana_coman will bbl
1956371;1577698722;mircea_popescu;http://trilema.com/2016/eulorangement/#footnote_0_67304 << this think
1956372;1577698748;mircea_popescu;this i think must be it*
1956373;1577698756;mircea_popescu;nfi , maybe false memories, what can i say.
1956374;1577698927;mircea_popescu;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-29#1956205 << i don't think anyone's proposing all components should be present in all systems. rather, i expect the v-way to do this is end up with a large tree, with some usually-favoured leaves or final branches. the gui/nogui split seems very early, like [https://q7i2y6d5.stackpathcdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/09/tree-with-hole.png][one of those]
1956375;1577698927;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-29 13:51:19 trinque: I agree that there should be single, correct answers when choosing components (as I'm trying to lay out the options for such selection in my series), but not that each component is always present in any system.
1956376;1577699015;mircea_popescu;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-29#1956212 << for some reason the proposal there's multiple choice there sits ill with my totalitarian mindset ; but we don't have to argue about it rightnao.
1956377;1577699043;*;mircea_popescu kicks ossabot
1956378;1577699044;mircea_popescu;hey!
1956379;1577699045;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-29 13:57:52 bvt: in this case, i can restate it as 'depends on how current fragments will get composed into one tree'
1956380;1577699063;*;mircea_popescu always knew kicking mechanisms is legitimate maintenance technique.
1956381;1577699314;mircea_popescu;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-29#1956220 << and the only reason this horror passes silently is that ~everyone else who knew lisp well meanwhile took an arrow to the butt and fell back into the swamp.
1956382;1577699328;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-29 17:38:31 whaack: diana_coman: From my experience, for most packages from quicklisp you're going to have problems if you don't have asdf 3+, which comes with sbcl 1.4.14 (not sure what the first version of sbcl with asdf 3+ was)
1956383;1577700182;mircea_popescu;"latest and greatest" asdf is exactly like all the other gpg 2.0 - gcc 19.firefox & assorted thunderbirds. and François-René Rideau aka fare is still [http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2018-01-05#1764882][that infantile dumbass].
1956384;1577700182;ossabot;Logged on 2018-01-05 01:21:45 mircea_popescu: https://www.xach.com/naggum/articles/3129644482406982@naggum.no.html << this exchange with fare is pretty amusing/informative both wrt "who is this francois-rene rideau character ?" and as an early "bitcoin improvements from the sewer" sampler/potputre.
1956385;1577700225;mircea_popescu;(sadly, there's a much better example, also in the form of a naggum exchange. it revolves around "common misconceptions" and such typically pantsuitist wooden tongue, but now i can't fucking find it. though i clearly remember discussing it recently(
1956386;1577700266;mircea_popescu;https://www.xach.com/naggum/articles/3129759496251093@naggum.no.html << ah, here it is!
1956387;1577700522;mircea_popescu;in short : i honestly don't think deploying lisp ~at all~ is such a great idea, or should be done.
1956388;1577700721;mircea_popescu;this is in part naggum's "in my view, Common Lisp provides _values_ that far exceed what other languages do, but I fully realize that people won't understand this until they have actually experienced the problems that it solves for them. now, what's _really_ sad is that those who want free Common Lisp systems have _not_ seen what the commercial systems provide in just this way, and they will go on to make free Common Li
1956389;1577700721;mircea_popescu;sp systems that just _don't_ offer the serious advantages that solid Common Lisp systems do that people can't _afford_ to provide for free." carrying the day with me, but in larger part the actual absence of any serious problem (besides, ~perhaps~, [http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-02-17#1897515][this]) we actually could meaningfully use it for. you really don't need lisp to make a blog anymore than you need a
1956390;1577700721;ossabot;Logged on 2019-02-17 10:04:58 mircea_popescu: look for yourself, i've never seen such wonders in whole lyf before! http://archive.is/89adR#selection-9.20821-9.21149
1956391;1577700722;mircea_popescu;n aircraft carrier to sunbathe.
1956392;1577700791;mircea_popescu;and of course fixing c compilation so it's no longer outrageous idiocy "that works" (tm) is precisely not a possible utilization of lisp because the fucking reason it even exist is so as to not have those problems, and so on.
1956393;1577701738;mircea_popescu;we do indeed need a scripting language, though, and ideally one that doesn't try to [https://www.oglaf.com/obituator/][fuck us while wife sleeps].
1956394;1577701993;mircea_popescu;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-29#1956241 << right. ye recently stated yet nevertheless very olde http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-10#1954792 says hi to http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-08-26#1931212 & friends nao.
1956395;1577701994;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-29 18:01:33 trinque: I'd be willing to abandon lisp for now, seeing as how the usable components incur at least another 400k lines of bloat, and for that you gain yet another javascript ecosystem.
1956396;1577701994;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-10 15:14:42 mp_en_viaje: and in general -- the absentee, the insufficient, the "otherwise busy", the butthurt, physically or mentally -- better pray they're in fact quite as inconsequential as they seem.
1956397;1577701994;ossabot;Logged on 2019-08-26 13:49:11 phf: you ought to consider moving here, or at least coming for a visit. the place is a lot livelier than dc, food is better, girls are prettier, things are generally cheaper, etc. etc. etc.
1956398;1577702020;mircea_popescu;one irresponsible twit gave himself fatal ulcer, the other and so on.
1956399;1577702112;mircea_popescu;naggum for that mattter is being whipped upside down in hell even as we speak, specifically for "wtf did you do with your calling, you schmuck, killed yourself before hearing it ? [https://www.xvideos.com/video9821478/whipped_until_he_cries][TAKE IT LIKE A LITTLE BITCH]".
1956400;1577702748;mircea_popescu;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-29#1956242 << more probably, something like "lisp castrated into scriptlang"; thoguh there's also lua or say tcl...
1956401;1577702749;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-29 18:02:34 trinque: if we were to retain lisp, I'd say pick one, don't have a python alongside it, and don't expect to use much "open source" to help you.
1956402;1577702824;mircea_popescu;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-29#1956245 << indeed, ash/bash prolly the way to go. otherwise, "tcl/tk in python as tinkler" hurr durr, god help us.
1956403;1577702825;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-29 18:07:26 trinque: which includes a shell
1956404;1577702882;mircea_popescu;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-29#1956251 << pleasant nothing. i bet you if i sit down to read what you've written "in" lisp ima in short order discover you wrote it in python anyway.
1956405;1577702882;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-29 18:12:50 whaack: trinque: First, I find it more pleasant writing in lisp. Second, I like the cultural aspect of a (present day) more niche language. Then for problems with python: i find the single line lambdas a strange requirement, and not having tail call optimization is lame (although i admit i can't think of many/any cases where that's been a problem)
1956406;1577702891;mircea_popescu;not to tar you with a well used brush, but it HAS been the experience to date.
1956407;1577703102;mircea_popescu;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-29#1956250 << i honestly think it's the right approach. "identify an useful iota of acceptable internal structure and measure everything in that". next step self-obviously being, "once pretty much everything's within the first sigma, take another look at what you mean by acceptable internal structure".
1956408;1577703102;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-29 18:11:26 diana_coman: ahaha, by now I see that trinque will measure everything in multiples of busybox.
1956409;1577703106;mircea_popescu;the ratchet, yes ?
1956410;1577703217;mircea_popescu;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-29#1956252 << the only practical approach to evicting python for the active diatesis of the logger is to rewrite that part in bash ; which, without an actual decision to do this from now on is imo inexcusably gnarly.
1956411;1577703217;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-29 18:13:10 diana_coman: re paster though tbh this attempt (coming as it does on top of the previous mess with [http://ossasepia.com/2019/09/02/ossabot-and-its-flask-of-python-27-on-centos-6/][python and its flask]) left me looking again for not using either.
1956412;1577703241;mircea_popescu;we gotta think this through. and also let's see what jfw says and so on.
1956413;1577703375;mircea_popescu;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-29#1956257 << except, of course, for [http://trilema.com/2011/nsfw-tigancusa-spune-drept/][the cultural aspects], amirite.
1956414;1577703375;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-29 18:19:12 trinque: all my tmsr work to date could've been php or pyshits for all the difference it would've made.
1956415;1577703594;mircea_popescu;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-29#1956258 << except for the part where lisp code production was never this paste in google / paste from github. this works well for ineptly structured languages like the moroncrowd favours, that are lenghtly verbose and [http://trilema.com/2016/why-is-that/?b=cubical%20job&e=cubical%20game#select][cubical-dweller] optimized, loaded with wooden tongue constructrs and in gene
1956416;1577703594;mircea_popescu;ral carefully disolving every grain of actual thought into many galons of moosauce (which is what the "go playing" moo-engine even uses to identify "similar" bits "that might interest you")
1956417;1577703594;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-29 18:19:37 whaack: diana_coman: if i search for a piece of lisp code to do something, I have a (perhaps naive) belief that I am more likely to find something well written, since there are fewer people using the language
1956418;1577703697;mircea_popescu;traditionally lisp coding consists of spending some time to ~well~ understand your problem ; the internal ast of [http://trilema.com/2019/theres-no-better-way-to-ensure-the-enmity-of-the-mediocre-than-by-exposing-their-mediocrity-for-what-it-is/?b=unwinding&e=ideology#select][this digestion] is not well fit for language (even though yes, the bleeding edge of human technologies & understandings as represented by trilema
1956419;1577703697;mircea_popescu;does indeed dance with these wolves) ; and then once THAT is complete the solution takes five minutes of notation.
1956420;1577703744;mircea_popescu;THAT is the great value of lisp, in its classical form as understood by they regarded as luminaries by the "cultural aspects" crowd : that once you're done mentally digesting your problem, the peristalsis is as short and uncumbersome as it can possibly be.
1956421;1577703911;mircea_popescu;the main problem (and the reason i don't come across as much of a lisp fan) is that since the 80s complexity exploded significantly ; there's no more space for proto lisp as represented by [http://trilema.com/2010/programatorii-adevarati/?b=Daca%20un%20program&e=foloseste#select][mel] ; nor for the classical lisp as represented by the defunct moron club.
1956422;1577704090;mircea_popescu;and what i mean by "there's no more space" is rather a lot in the vein of "you lot chafe and get massively butthurt at even the faintest version of what that world would look like anyone [by which we mean me, for lack of alternatives] can come up with". lisp is a tool for resolving closed problems, not for floating about the endless uncharted seas [http://trilema.com/2014/i-love-rochester-so-will-you/?b=try%20to&e=swim#
1956423;1577704091;mircea_popescu;select][on bladders of philosophy].
1956424;1577704189;mircea_popescu;but you don't ~like~ closed problems, or rather, you deem the putative existence of such a thing as closed problems as such a threat to your misconception of identity, it's almost like it's the koschei stealing the above-linked "cultural aspects" of [http://trilema.com/2012/ah-curvele-astea-fragededelicioase/][young female chest] away from you.
1956425;1577704280;mircea_popescu;nevertheless, all solved problems begin their life as solved problems through first being closed ; a refusal to close problem and a tendency to "keep problems open" is in the end specifically what [http://trilema.com/2009/neotenia/][neoteny] even is.
1956426;1577704392;mircea_popescu;in short, we might be one or two "cultural aspects" away from anything like a useful or usable version of common lisp. now go [http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-23#1955936][fuck some teenie boppers on cam] ; and when you're done have them eat your ass. ON CAM. and then maybe we lisp together, later.
1956427;1577704392;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-23 02:15:42 mp_en_viaje: wut is this java bullshit, "oh, i've been fucking three women". mocky.org/three-nude-sluts when!
1956428;1577704487;mircea_popescu;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-29#1956259 << verily.
1956429;1577704487;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-29 18:20:02 trinque: which is not just a bunch of bawww. it's worthwhile to question wtf we use to value things within which *whole lifetimes* can be lost, wasted.
1956430;1577704502;mircea_popescu;it is, in fact, the foremost worth.
1956431;1577705225;mircea_popescu;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-29#1956260 << it seems indeed well borne by experience that the only thing "uses lisp" codes for nowadays is mental derangement.
1956432;1577705225;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-29 18:21:12 trinque: whaack: starting at beliefs is going to be a shaky foundation, but fwiw I "believe" most folks writing lisp today are compulsive masturbators like gabriel_laddel
1956433;1577711150;diana_coman;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-30#1956339 - it is, yes.
1956434;1577711150;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-30 07:02:12 mircea_popescu: http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-29#1956250 << i honestly think it's the right approach. "identify an useful iota of acceptable internal structure and measure everything in that". next step self-obviously being, "once pretty much everything's within the first sigma, take another look at what you mean by acceptable internal structure".
1956435;1577713231;mircea_popescu;diana_coman, in other keks, https://docs.libretro.com/development/shader/xml-shaders/
1956436;1577713279;mircea_popescu;56 stars ans 86 forks, if this ain't the mark of the times i can't imagine what'd be
1956437;1577713422;diana_coman;oh; I was blissfully unaware of the extent of xml-shading, lolz.
1956438;1577713725;mircea_popescu;myeah. anyway, been working on a comment for you.
1956439;1577713729;mircea_popescu;done soon
1956440;1577715096;diana_coman;reading now
1956441;1577715694;diana_coman;mircea_popescu: answered.
1956442;1577716042;hanbot;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-29#1956198 << i thought i got rid of the need for imagemagick with gimp's built-in scheme thing: http://thewhet.net/2019/11/a-little-bit-of-tinyscheme-a-lot-of-cozonac/?b=It%20turns%20out%20the%20box&e=thereby#select
1956443;1577716042;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-29 09:56:30 mircea_popescu: neways, as to the burning "OTOH, I wonder if things like Apache or imagemagick get installed, how will the package management system work out, and how comprehensible will system stay?" question -- i see the merit of using the clean spot as a fixed point to attempt expanding cleanliness. so, it would work by apache becoming tmserv or w/e, and not sucking anymore.
1956444;1577720117;mircea_popescu;hanbot, a, that's actually a good point -- we might want to look into how gimp uses scheme for scripting
1956445;1577720168;mircea_popescu;pretty much the only lisp i use how shall we put this, on a day to day basis as opposed to some kinda ceremonial function
1956446;1577720251;mircea_popescu;diana_coman, motherfucker, they force-inherited us with their idiotic everything-depends-on-everything-else model, did they!
1956447;1577720263;Mocky;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-28#1956120 << yes I'm going to catch up. I have a lot of catching up to do
1956448;1577720263;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-28 02:22:16 mircea_popescu: so listen... while you were away there's been a lot of progress ongoing in the republic, these guys now have blogs and stick to publishing planning schedules and such wunderbar alien techs. you gonna catch up with the group ?
1956449;1577720284;mircea_popescu;cool.
1956450;1577720321;mircea_popescu;diana_coman, let's restate this, so currently work on nailing down the comms protocol is stalled on a definitive universal data model, which is stalled on graphical use in the client, that about it ?
1956451;1577720371;diana_coman;mircea_popescu: yes.
1956452;1577720436;mircea_popescu;were there more chunks you could be working on ?
1956453;1577720567;diana_coman;mircea_popescu: hm, thinking now about it, I think there might be, namely the more directly game-relevant parts that are also not yet fully spec (eg character, structure/item etc); I need to go over it in this light, put the graphics to the side for now and see from there.
1956454;1577720587;mircea_popescu;there's two portions to the problem.
1956455;1577720675;mircea_popescu;one is that a coupla years of diligent work have gotten eulora to this position where it actually outgrew the intellectual basis of the community such as it is in pretty much every respect. many things nominally upstream would be inputs for this decision spot but are sadly absent, from "well... what about scheme then ?" coincidentally brought up avbove to the self-obvious "how did the western world produce 0 graphic art
1956456;1577720675;mircea_popescu;ists worth the mention" discussed in the article and so on.
1956457;1577720704;mircea_popescu;so i don't even know on what basis i'm supposed to decide what, here.
1956458;1577720770;mircea_popescu;the other part is that, well... why exactly is a texture / skin / shader / model / anything else in compgfx even valuable in the first place ?
1956459;1577720778;mircea_popescu;explain this to me, can you ? why are these valuable ?
1956460;1577720856;diana_coman;oh boy, I'm possibly the last person to ask for an argument pro "valuable" on those.
1956461;1577720865;mircea_popescu;perhaps it's why you're asked then.
1956462;1577721234;diana_coman;hm; I keep thinking that "perhaps I don't know enough about them to find the value" ; as I see them now, they are more accumulations of trial and error/overfitting/tinkering though so they seem of very little - or indeed negative - value tbh.
1956463;1577721276;diana_coman;the sort of accumulating accidental complexity, to link it in with trinque's thread re OS.
1956464;1577721298;mircea_popescu;bear with me here, because this is going to be lengthy.
1956465;1577721407;mircea_popescu;so, the sukhoi 34 is a pretty cool plane ; in any case the basis of the russian defeat in the field of usg's pretense to air participation. now suppose for the sake of argument someone comes offering to sell one ; and suppose further that you're to advise on the purchase by providing a single scalar value : what the item is worth iyo.
1956466;1577721412;mircea_popescu;what value do you spit out ?
1956467;1577721522;diana_coman;ugh, this seems out of my advising capabilities really.
1956468;1577721555;mircea_popescu;why ?
1956469;1577721641;diana_coman;because "what this item is worth" depends on more than just the item in itself and I have no idea even on the item really, let alone the context.
1956470;1577721666;mircea_popescu;well, there's one overarching bit of context here : the offer is to sell ~ONE~
1956471;1577721670;diana_coman;if you are asking "what is this item worth to *you*", well, not much; the fuck do I do with this sukhoi.
1956472;1577721709;mircea_popescu;i suspect the item as discussed is actually worth 0, yes, making complete idiots of the management of all the us' "allies".
1956473;1577721716;mircea_popescu;but let's continue :
1956474;1577721729;diana_coman;oh huh, only one? dunno, perhaps the idea is to reverse engineer, that might be about the only possible value I can see but it's dubious for all sorts of reasons.
1956475;1577721906;mircea_popescu;"artificial intelligence", like "flight" or whatever else, is as such and in the abstract a long cherished dream of humanity.
1956476;1577721941;mircea_popescu;artificial intelligence as actually extant today is, leaving aside all sorta obscure lulz alf used to like referencing about expert systems and nato wargames, and the assorted lulzpile of neural networks and etc from the very dead 70s, and also leaving aside the whole life OF [http://trilema.com/2014/you-cannot-fix-a-machine-by-just-power-cycling-it-with-no-understanding-of-what-is-going-wrong/][MINSKY], and then sussma
1956477;1577721941;mircea_popescu;n, and such others as lost themselves in that whale,
1956478;1577721962;diana_coman;myeah; I fell in love with it at 17 (when read the promise) and then promptly barfed by 19 (when encountered the full extent of the "practice")
1956479;1577721975;mircea_popescu;a very simple thing : [http://trilema.com/2019/the-state-of-the-vidya-address/#footnote_20_84088][systems of really really many linear equations with really really numerous variables hidden behind very small parameters].
1956480;1577722018;mircea_popescu;now, suppose we change out the sukhoi, and chande in instead "an artificial intelligence", specifically, a few TB of w/e worth of mostly 0s, binary values.
1956481;1577722029;mircea_popescu;if run through the proprietary bundle, it beats any human at go.
1956482;1577722042;mircea_popescu;otherwise, it... i dunno, it makes a skymap if you print the 1's as stars i guess.
1956483;1577722055;diana_coman;lolz; and pretty light patterns possibly.
1956484;1577722059;mircea_popescu;now, what's your scalar in this new context ?
1956485;1577722128;diana_coman;what, for buying an AI system that is "very powerful" when ran through the proprietary bundle & otherwise unclear what it does?
1956486;1577722153;diana_coman;rather: unclear what *useful* thing it does
1956487;1577722196;diana_coman;as above, it's negative value, below that "not much" for the sukhoi.
1956488;1577722216;mircea_popescu;do you see the argument that "an sukhoi" is worth exactly the same as "an ai", in the sense that they're the ash of a cigar someone else smoked, the marblecake of an anal cavity someone else fucked, and, to quote the quite prophetic mr mel again, [http://trilema.com/2010/programatorii-adevarati/?b=Daca%20un%20program&e=foloseste#select][what's the point of a program that can't rewrite its own code] ?
1956489;1577722305;diana_coman;that yes, I do; though I am partial to an sukhoi more than to an AI because at least it's a concrete beast I guess.
1956490;1577722311;mircea_popescu;alright
1956491;1577722362;mircea_popescu;now let's see here : leaving aside for the sake of discoursive coherence the correct vectorial representation, and making do with a purely catesian approach (aka bitmaps) for the time being, on the expectation that while this rather than that allows much easier quantification, that rather than this doesn't magically pack much more complexity, greeks be damned :
1956492;1577722439;mircea_popescu;a cube a thousand pixels wide will take, to be naively described point by point, about 3*256 Gb. this means there's about a trillion such cubes. yes ?
1956493;1577722611;diana_coman;ah, I see; yes.
1956494;1577722669;mircea_popescu;alright. out of this space of 3bn units, once applying the rule of "looks like a game character" (or "mob" or whatever forumation of "is useful for eulora") there's going to be a few equivalency classes (most visible on say nintendo, bcause most annoying on nintendo, really, the wolf+1 gets blond hair ?)
1956495;1577722690;mircea_popescu;but mostly, there's going to be empty space. or rather : "crap" is the largest equivalency class.
1956496;1577722708;diana_coman;ahaha, sure.
1956497;1577722719;mircea_popescu;now the proposition here is, as i understand it, the following :
1956498;1577722811;mircea_popescu;so hard and difficult and unapproachable and scary and etcetera is this question of splittign the space, that it is worthwhile to go to all the trouble of farming a bunch of morons, because their crap/noncrap decision is tantamount to fucking holy, and no deployment of anything but honest to god THE dude from big lebowsky can possibly cut it.
1956499;1577722839;mircea_popescu;so it's worth making a thing like blender, and then making a thing like the inexistent exporter, and then making a thing like cs, and all the xml wrapping and etcetera,
1956500;1577722846;mircea_popescu;just so these idiots can alter a pixel here or there.
1956501;1577722862;*;diana_coman saw this coming
1956502;1577722866;mircea_popescu;except, of course, they don't. and when hanbot TRIED to do it, she died in a flaming mess of deeply inadequate tools. she almost made a slime. ALMOST.
1956503;1577722898;mircea_popescu;hey hanbot how did that go ?
1956504;1577722967;hanbot;i had a lot of fun modeling a slime guy in blender, then discovered getting it to a usable form via "baking textures" etc 5 or so layers deep was ... i guess i'd call it beyond my attention span.
1956505;1577722992;mircea_popescu;so you're saying the unusable tools part was not the making but the exporting, as it were ?
1956506;1577722998;hanbot;yep
1956507;1577723013;mircea_popescu;where was the article btw, got a link ?
1956508;1577723041;hanbot;nah, i committed a major sin there, possibly i'll have to pay by starting over and properly documenting.
1956509;1577723048;mircea_popescu;diana_coman, the problem with the foregoing is that i can kinda ballpark the COST of maintaining all the infrastructure for monkeys to typewrite at their leisure. so can you, i expect.
1956510;1577723051;mircea_popescu;is it fucking worth it ?
1956511;1577723069;mircea_popescu;hanbot, why the fuck didn't you write it out ? i remember reading SOMETHING.
1956512;1577723178;diana_coman;mircea_popescu: I had the article on the [http://ossasepia.com/2017/02/24/basic-toolchain-for-blender-cal3d-crystal-space/][toolchain] to help her as I knew she was having a go at it based on some discussion in #eulora I think; maybe that?
1956513;1577723195;mircea_popescu;i recal lpictures of the slime guy in it!
1956514;1577723286;diana_coman;re maintaining the infrastructure, I don't see how it can be really justified as such anyway given that uhm, those doing something with it are anyway essentially non-existent currently so can't maintain so they "do" anything; and if it is to *also* build them up, then well, they'll fit whatever infrastructure is provided, not the other way around.
1956515;1577723294;diana_coman;and no, I wouldn't start making another blender, ugh.
1956516;1577723344;hanbot;yeah there's some #eulora refs like http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/eulora/2017-02-05#940257, i sincerely dun recall properly documenting tho', probably part and parcel of the overwhelmed at step 10 of 10 thing. mea culpa, i oughta know better.
1956517;1577723345;ossabot;(eulora) 2017-02-05 hanbot: fwiw diana_coman i have a blender-made animated character guy finished and am gonna try out the crystal space exporter thingy as per http://www.crystalspace3d.org/docs/online/manual/Blender.html , prolly tomorrow. if you have any tips/pointers/etc in the meantime pls to schpiel at me
1956518;1577723369;mircea_popescu;hanbot, yeah, don't do that again.
1956519;1577723441;mircea_popescu;diana_coman, the way this coming to a head is working out in my head is as follows : you have practically speaking the option to either a) go trawl the entire internet, drag out ~everything~ that's conceivably useful (submit expenses report for stuff that's behind reasonable paywalls i guess) and then we systematize the pile ; or else write a possible-lifeform-generation machine and see what you want it to save.
1956520;1577723457;mircea_popescu;or whatever, how the data should be kept.
1956521;1577723551;mircea_popescu;we actually did something somewhat like a test run for a if memory serves, hence http://trilema.com/2016/eulora-012/ trials yes
1956522;1577723661;diana_coman;if you mean "art products" by that everything that's conceivably useful then yes, indeed, I was thinking precisely of that rather sad attempt, hm; the idea -naive!- behind that to my mind was more to find perhaps as a result *people* doing something useful in that direction, hm.
1956523;1577723666;mircea_popescu;neither of these is shaders specifically, because obviously neither can be shaders specifically, because how
1956524;1577723701;diana_coman;the thing with the AI/automated generation was initially that "can't beat human at this sort of task" iirc.
1956525;1577723709;mircea_popescu;diana_coman, sadly i do not currently believe anyone whose name is going to be worth knowing in ten years is older than about fifteen today. with maybe a dozen exceptions.
1956526;1577723762;mircea_popescu;you meet more 30yos, you'll meet more alfs in the best case. i am so fucking uncurious to be meeting anymore alfs...
1956527;1577723820;diana_coman;myeah; that basically says "you'll have to build up the people too so..."
1956528;1577723863;mircea_popescu;it does. if there's a meteor land tomorrow wipe out "humanity" there'll be exactly nothing lost. except for the stench it wouldn't even be noticeable anything occured.
1956529;1577724104;diana_coman;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-30#1956451 - pretty much b then, for so much "choice" , huh.
1956530;1577724104;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-30 12:41:13 mircea_popescu: diana_coman, the way this coming to a head is working out in my head is as follows : you have practically speaking the option to either a) go trawl the entire internet, drag out ~everything~ that's conceivably useful (submit expenses report for stuff that's behind reasonable paywalls i guess) and then we systematize the pile ; or else write a possible-lifeform-generation machine and see what you want it to save
1956531;1577724301;mircea_popescu;but this aside : our position is remarkably vulnerable, because of the countless ways in which people are morons, from [http://trilema.com/2015/minigame-smg-june-2015-statement/#footnote_6_62044][the pure bobeckistan of blender] (and let's not forget [http://trilema.com/2016/minigame-is-probably-never-going-to-support-python-3/][how python got indexed] in the first place) to a very thick stripperweb-style tarabostes idi
1956532;1577724301;mircea_popescu;ocy.
1956533;1577724320;mircea_popescu;do you even recall how many "artists" i commissioned to date whose idea of "commission" and "artist" was... take some money and RUN!!!!!
1956534;1577724343;mircea_popescu;gotta be at least a dozen, including both the expert who made one splash screen and the contest winning kid on tardstalk who made the other.
1956535;1577724365;diana_coman;I didn't keep track but I do recall at least a few off the top of my head, yes.
1956536;1577724411;mircea_popescu;anyway, i'm not about to go paying idiots a whole lotta money so they're a little bit less idiotic, what the fuck.
1956537;1577724457;mircea_popescu;now, the risk with choosing b is that it can readily turn into the grave ; in the hands of any being an engineer that'd be exactly the necessary outcome. it can take forever, yes ?
1956538;1577724472;mircea_popescu;usure you wouldn't rather choose a ?
1956539;1577724510;diana_coman;certainly; and part of why I'm not all-that-enthusiastic about it; otoh my current experience with ~equivalent of a make me also-not-that-enthusiastic; so I'm looking at "choice".
1956540;1577724522;diana_coman;certainly I meant for "it can take forever"
1956541;1577724531;mircea_popescu;the advantage of a truly republican new year's celebration
1956542;1577724544;mircea_popescu;you get to sit with your drink and mull the depths.
1956543;1577724566;mircea_popescu;anwyay -- i kinda do want a done anyway, so if any of the unemployed in the audience wants to hop to, do talk to me about it.
1956544;1577724593;diana_coman;mircea_popescu: what about cs/ps anyway? ie graphics as "how & what to store" is one thing; there is still at all times some sort of "how to get from data to pretty pics/animations/etc"
1956545;1577724611;mircea_popescu;what are you asking specifically ?
1956546;1577724647;diana_coman;what are the steps going to be re "graphics on client side"?
1956547;1577724690;mircea_popescu;both a and b above produce a pile ; it's piped into extant eulora client ; done.
1956548;1577724778;mircea_popescu;(watch that at some later point, all the assholes who were "too busy" to help out when it mattered will whine about why bitcoin is so expensive now, and their work not worth jack once we didn't need it anymore so they finally deigned to doing some)
1956549;1577724857;diana_coman;ok; worth noting that the "piped into" part might itself be quite involved / will depend on what's exactly in that pile from a/b.
1956550;1577724935;mircea_popescu;but that's the idea : what i mean by " we systematize the pile" is that first we make a large pile, then we select from it to make a smaller but correctly structured pile, and then we use the pile to fix cs where needed (and also we convert some portion of the larger pile left out, that's worth doing)
1956551;1577724939;diana_coman;at any rate, I'll take some days to (mull & read)*
1956552;1577724962;mircea_popescu;(mull & read)* tingles my malloc sense. is that a dangling dereference ?
1956553;1577724986;diana_coman;ahaha, no, it's just several passes.
1956554;1577724994;mircea_popescu;anyway. you happy ?
1956555;1577725010;diana_coman;happiness is such a relative thing, lol.
1956556;1577725025;mircea_popescu;lol. i mean it as the term of art, seen in "vincent ? are we happy ?"
1956557;1577725107;diana_coman;lolz; I was about to say that compared to further trying to get sense out of cs entrails, just about ~anything else qualifies for happy.
1956558;1577725128;mircea_popescu;well good for you then ; ima go back to trying to dig myself out from under all the publishings omfg.
1956559;1577725156;mircea_popescu;this, for the record, is the first time in my life i've actually had this problem. i been preparing for it all my life, it's true, but i never actually had it before.
1956560;1577725169;diana_coman;mircea_popescu's first time.
1956561;1577727671;mircea_popescu;heh
1956562;1577733783;diana_coman;trinque: why does your blog send me to an empty page after I give it a comment? It's quite confusing/initially I thought it failed to eat it and I was just about to try again.
1956563;1577733839;diana_coman;also, mind adding those very useful widgets for last articles and last comments? please?
1956564;1577733867;mircea_popescu;trinque, can i get you to use sane referencing for quotes ? your http://trilema.com/2015/the-anal-child/#selection-43.31-47.27 selects http://trilema.com/2015/the-anal-child/?b=s%20no%20point&e=he%20kno#select , is that what you meant ?
1956565;1577733902;mircea_popescu;and yes what she said, i'm stuck fishing through http://trinque.org/rss.php over here, which guess what.
1956566;1577733929;mircea_popescu;http://trinque.org/feed/ works as intended
1956567;1577736592;mircea_popescu;trinque, your blog ate the links in muh comment. here's the original : http://paste.deedbot.org/?id=AD_t
1956568;1577737207;*;trinque gets to unfucking all the above, thanks y'all
1956569;1577737234;trinque;article width meanwhile prolapsed my theme too
1956570;1577740773;feedbot;http://qntra.net/2019/12/armed-texan-kills-would-be-mass-shooter-in-church-new-york-incident-ends-differently/ << Qntra -- Armed Texan Kills Would Be Mass Shooter In Church, New York Incident Ends Differently
1956571;1577752190;*;BingoBoingo picked a server [http://bingology.net/2019/reviewing-the-last-plans-and-new-plans-going-into-2020/#footnote_1_3307][in LATAM] to join the name serving orchestra that's about to go up.
1956572;1577784349;feedbot;http://thetarpit.org/2019/bootloading-operating-systems << The Tar Pit -- Bootloading operating systems, some opening bits and the current state in personal computing
1956573;1577786158;feedbot;http://thetarpit.org/2019/a-brief-look-at-the-real-estate-rental-market-in-bucharest-cca-2019 << The Tar Pit -- A brief look at the real estate rental market in Bucharest cca. 2019
1956574;1577820855;feedbot;http://qntra.net/2019/12/usg-embassy-in-iraq-beseiged-by-locals-unhappy-usg-wont-stop-bombing-iraq/ << Qntra -- USG "Embassy" In Iraq Beseiged By Locals Unhappy USG Won't Stop Bombing Iraq
1956575;1577824953;dorion_road;http://logs.ossasepia.com/log/trilema/2019-12-27#1956101 - yeah. as diana_coman said, I mistook a mountain for a molehill. I've added my conversation with her as a [http://dorion-mode.com/2019/12/some-reasons-contributing-to-tmsr-os-is-ev/#comment-67][comment].
1956576;1577824953;ossabot;Logged on 2019-12-27 10:54:39 mp_en_viaje: dorion_road, http://dorion-mode.com/2019/12/some-reasons-contributing-to-tmsr-os-is-ev/ << lotta gaps and jumps huh.
1956577;1577835845;BingoBoingo;And the Qntra DNS has been spread http://archive.is/f4l63
|