Dec 11 21:38:58 * adlai wonders whether His Lordship (not you, stas; the absent one!) will approve my humble offering: http://trilema.com/2016/honor-societies-vs-respect-societies-or-how-the-disaster-of-commons-sunk-the-western-world/#comment-127195 Dec 11 22:32:37 re: html/txt math: (i weigh in on this topic since i've been typesetting as much of my homework as practical during the past two semesters (so far - elementary qm, kindergarden calculus, and a handful of "this might be an enticing field of research someday") Dec 11 22:34:15 while ltx-setting various formulae, i've found that i am quite literally translating them to lisp-n, and only then to whatever braindamage notation is required in order to remain popular among the nonpracticing mathematicians and physicists-in-denial. Dec 11 22:35:47 it would thus seem to me that the best format for unambiguously communicating _nontrivial_ mathematics (and I say this without having read your latest releases in the FFA series, so it's not a commentary on those) would be either S- or M-expressions. Dec 11 22:36:12 and yes, i bleed my bias in that statement. Dec 11 22:37:52 * adlai is mildly embarassed to admit not having even tried texsetting fisher/newman projections and their ilk Dec 11 22:39:16 (i did hand in one organic chemistry assignment with all reactions written out in precise and mostly-correct King's IUPAC, to the great displeasure of the fellow grading these) Dec 11 22:40:32 * adlai imagines: "what the shit, i am being paid to do copyedit the same chickenwire they tested me on last year, not to do peer-review" Dec 12 09:03:06 ohai adlai Dec 12 09:03:45 how's life in panzerbrigade. Dec 12 09:04:55 adlai: fwiw i latexed good % of my homeworks back in uni. Dec 12 09:05:02 it dun do any good for www pg tho. Dec 12 09:06:45 adlai: if you end up writing a sexprtronic replacement for tex, i promise to test/review. Dec 12 09:07:10 ( it won't do any good for www any moar than regular tex, but still useful elsewhere ) Dec 12 17:29:33 * diana_coman has quit (Ping timeout: 250 seconds) Dec 12 17:31:06 * diana_coman (~diana_com@eulora/CTO/diana-coman) has joined #asciilifeform Dec 13 08:04:37 * spyked (~spyked@unaffiliated/spyked) has left #asciilifeform ("the cake is a lie") Dec 13 08:05:12 * spyked (~spyked@unaffiliated/spyked) has joined #asciilifeform Dec 13 16:40:24 nobody would've expected it'd be so difficult to refrain from repeating, every single quantum chemistry class, "what's the point of doing all this nonsense on a wave equation with an underestimated rest energy" Dec 13 16:44:16 re:ltx, this friction is definitely reaching the phase transition away from statics; i am terribly ashamed to admit that i have begun writing throwaway cl to generate group multiplication tables. this feels morally worse than inviting pregnant women to a kegger. Dec 13 16:46:20 it does, however, make for a passable excuse: "dear professor, may i submit this homework tomorrow, so the TA can check my math rather than my handwriting?" Dec 13 16:48:12 in other news, the department has begun ostracism proceedings against me, and i have naturally begun my fool-for-a-client routine. Dec 13 17:55:03 adlai: whatcha being drummed out for ? Dec 13 18:01:12 adlai: i thought you ~liked~ chem ? ( or only eating, not studying, lol ) Dec 13 18:01:56 getting an "incomplete" grade (not failed, but kicked out halfway through semester) in the 2nd year chem lab. my appeal essentially consists of "how about you let me finish the class, and if i actually fail, i'll see myself out" Dec 13 18:02:36 What angered the educators so? Dec 13 18:03:39 which raises the question of why the lab supervisors kicked me out of the lab, and the answer to that is a mix of them not wanting students to just barely pass (low quartile is above 80), and also me taking seriously the encouragement to conduct original research rather than merely rote repetition of procedures handed down by instructors Dec 13 18:05:19 * adlai is also terribly optimistic at time management, and registered for too many theoretical classes (such as "DFT for autistic monkeys" and "statistical thermodynamics") rather than limiting courseload to bare minimum necessary for qualifications Dec 13 18:06:58 the DFT class (which actually has the simple name, "quantum chemistry") is quite fun. the professor gave us a one-hour crash course in calculus of variations, which i doubt i'd have understood without all those dead trees and years spent not drinking. Dec 13 18:08:00 asciilifeform: chemistry is very interesting, the trouble with academic lab courses is that they are primarily litmus tests of ~interpersonal Dec 13 18:08:35 ... they are primarily litmus tests of ~interpersonal~ chemistry, between the students and the grad students who drew the short straw and have to babysit this lab that week Dec 13 18:09:18 adlai: i took coupla semesters of orgochem lab ( as 'adult', long after orig degree ) and found'em to be strictly a test of whether yer hands grow from shoulders or not Dec 13 18:09:38 dunno about in adlaistan, but over here -- that. Dec 13 18:09:55 there is hardly any orgo done in the initial "general chemistry education" labs Dec 13 18:09:55 grade was based mostly on yield Dec 13 18:10:25 a bit of chromatography, and a bit of trivial identification (melting point tests). no synthesis. Dec 13 18:10:28 took that 1st also, it was 100% test of 'hands grow not from arse' also Dec 13 18:10:58 how the hell yer gonna do synthesis if you have nfi how to gauge yield ( what melting point is simplest tool for ) Dec 13 18:11:09 yield-based grades are given here, too, which is near the top of the list of my favorite things about the place Dec 13 18:11:18 * adlai has such a list, but it's more fun to complain, neh! Dec 13 18:12:15 imho it's a shame that analytic chem aint taught any moar (it's ~obsoleted by modern instruments). was erry bit as much 'art form' as synthetic Dec 13 18:12:31 there are such lab courses, but they have the earlier lab courses as prerequisites. Dec 13 18:13:11 too many theoretical classes << dun do that. it's how asciilifeform was nearly drummed out, back in olden times Dec 13 18:13:25 essentially, they require students to pass the "knows how to act like sheepish cadet" labs first. Dec 13 18:13:26 adlai: dun try an' drink the ocean. Dec 13 18:14:13 * adlai regrettably enough had all the "act like sheepish cadet" crap beaten out of him in the other 'academy' Dec 13 18:14:45 adlai: if you dun like jumping through flaming rings, don't join the circus Dec 13 18:14:53 adlai: why exactly ~did~ you join that circus ? Dec 13 18:15:46 which circus is that 'that' anteceding at? Dec 13 18:15:53 chem school Dec 13 18:17:58 the summer after discharge, i registered for a "research track" program which their department had just started, then decided that i wanted experience working at workplaces before going back to school environments, so i cancelled my registration before the schoolyear began. Dec 13 18:18:31 why specifically that department? for starters, my qualifications (GED + SAT I & IIs) were best suited for it. Dec 13 18:18:45 * adlai got soft-booted out of high school too, remember! Dec 13 18:19:38 adlai: i used to work in whole room of folx where i was the only one who finished grade school Dec 13 18:19:39 but completed AP chem before that happened, and took that SAT II Dec 13 18:19:45 was perfectly fine thing Dec 13 18:20:14 best reverser i ever knew, was drummed out of highschool for hooliganism Dec 13 18:20:28 the more painful question is why i gave up on applying to RWTH Dec 13 18:20:38 wassat? Dec 13 18:21:12 the Techniche Hochschule in Aachen (near france, in northern deutschland) Dec 13 18:21:23 adlai: if it aint a seekrit, where are you nao ? Dec 13 18:21:46 not secret and not even a surprise - tel aviv Dec 13 18:21:52 weissman ? Dec 13 18:22:33 no, tel aviv university. weitzman is in a city which doesn't really exist beyond being the city where that institute is. Dec 13 18:22:39 a Dec 13 18:22:45 that place's name literally means "streets" Dec 13 18:23:01 also, they only have graduate students. Dec 13 18:23:05 i live in 1 of these, in gringostan Dec 13 18:24:03 * adlai is a townmouse, pretty much from birth Dec 13 18:24:43 even the neighborhood of the TAU campus feels like a suburban nowhere to me Dec 13 18:25:32 (other side of river, on top of hill, line-of-sight to an amusement park, etc) Dec 13 18:25:50 adlai: do you even want to chemist ? field is kinda dead Dec 13 18:26:03 eh well now. Dec 13 18:26:21 ~100% of the thinking work is in models, and the models dun work, i quit that racket, was quite frustrating Dec 13 18:26:57 i have already encountered a phenomenon which, while far from unexplainable, has not been explained to me by any professor with whom i discussed it, but the few who could plausibly work it out on their own, have agreed that it's an interesting problem and within the field Dec 13 18:27:06 wanna share? Dec 13 18:28:01 in short: surface effects cause electrode potential to rise when the electrode is removed being in contact with the bulk of the solution, and only contacts it at the reverse-meniscus, whatever you call that Dec 13 18:29:03 i encountered this effect using a copper electrode, with a roughly 1mM Cu(II) electrolyte (iirc nitrate), and the potential increase was ~15% Dec 13 18:29:20 adlai: not mega-puzzler. meniscus works as charge lens. Dec 13 18:29:32 thinkaboutit Dec 13 18:29:53 * adlai is terrible at that kind of mathematics Dec 13 18:30:47 observe that i did not perform any mathematicizing to tell the answer Dec 13 18:33:16 when you phrase it that way, it sounds like an explanation that relies on lensing (in the sense from geometric optics), but i assume you're suggesting to compare the reduction potential of the ions in the bulk solution relative to the narrowed surface through which they can adsorb Dec 13 18:33:45 no optic involved, as such Dec 13 18:34:05 but geometric effect similar. you took capacitor and bent 1 of the plates. Dec 13 18:35:12 the potential jump corresponds to the mechanical work you put in. Dec 13 18:35:33 what makes me unsatisfied with that explanation is that the effect was quite nonlinear: roughly constant potential while the electrode protruded below the meniscus, then a "hockey stick" climb as the electrode rose above the meniscus and the surface narrowed Dec 13 18:35:43 of course it's nonlinear Dec 13 18:35:52 you bent it into a paraboloid Dec 13 18:37:07 * adlai has no idea what -oid to call the surface shape, but it's definitely NOT that one! Dec 13 18:37:13 adlai: if you avoid to study the 'boring' basics of various things, you run very real risk of ending up as 'circle squarer' Dec 13 18:37:20 like that laddel fella Dec 13 18:37:35 it's a trap that's killed a million thinking folx Dec 13 18:37:58 i'm not avoiding the boring basics Dec 13 18:38:11 yer well along on the road to being those 50yo d00dz who gripe that their cold fusor reallyworx and nobodylistens etc Dec 13 18:38:57 why do you say that? Dec 13 18:39:22 adlai: largely from the 'i signed up for all the qm classes' comment Dec 13 18:39:34 it's not fatal, but imho yer in the risk group Dec 13 18:39:40 helps to be aware of it, when thinking. Dec 13 18:39:52 i'm more worried about being one of those 40yo d00dz who's weekly adrenaline rush consists of asking questions the seminar presenter doesn't want to hear until the grad students start whispering loudly and leaving one by one Dec 13 18:40:27 it gets old quickly. when it happened to asciilifeform , he left the field it was in Dec 13 18:41:13 adlai: if you feel like fucking with prof, next time yer in the lab late at night , set up belousov's reaction and bring it to him while it's going, and ask to explain how worx Dec 13 18:41:37 a significant part of the reason i've not dropped the qm class is because it forces me to keep learning math Dec 13 18:41:56 y'know it ~is~ possible to learn maffs in yer own house Dec 13 18:42:54 indeed. i'm studying at a much slower pace towards other fields as well. Dec 13 18:44:38 which fields Dec 13 18:44:49 right now what's keeping me in school is the inertia of the ~4.5 semesters already completed (aka, 'sunk cost fallacy', to a certain extent) Dec 13 18:45:06 tensor calculus Dec 13 18:46:10 fond of fluids problems? Dec 13 18:46:25 indeed Dec 13 18:46:54 * adlai has gotten quite a bit of laugh-mileage out of your v.karman joke about turbulence Dec 13 18:46:56 asciilifeform's grandfather was. spent last 3 decades of life on hydraulic comps (yes) Dec 13 18:47:29 ( long-forgotten orc tech. but imho interesting. ) Dec 13 18:47:36 and in case you've not read it yourself, "The Wind and Beyond" is great Dec 13 18:47:59 there's some dead-end master's thesis about logic gates using the BZ reaction Dec 13 18:48:15 you can make'em, yes Dec 13 18:49:22 my impression is that such a computation substrate would be more flexible and efficient than a hydraulic one Dec 13 18:49:41 find how to make 'resettable' bzreaction, then find how to ~electrically~ reset, then put it on surface of sram, a la the microarray thing the sequencer folx use.. Dec 13 18:49:54 (not specifically the BZ reaction, but chemical computation in general, rather than mechanical) Dec 13 18:50:19 see, it's not a dead field :) Dec 13 18:50:33 it's 'dead' in the same sense as comps Dec 13 18:50:39 i.e. nobody wants to pay for interesting works Dec 13 18:51:14 that seems to be the case almost everywhere. Dec 13 18:51:39 100% errywhere Dec 13 18:52:09 it's why asciilifeform shovels shit for living, and tries to stick to 'interestings' that can be done in small space, on jungle budget Dec 13 18:52:57 * adlai suspects that a thin edge of interesting research occurs at the borders of various fields and organizations, predominantly ones subject to stressors such as geopolitical conflict or economic poverty Dec 13 18:53:13 which is a horrible state of affairs, because those are also the worst conditions for conducting research. Dec 13 18:53:19 believe , even there not interesting. Dec 13 18:53:30 but they are the ones that ~require~ innovation. Dec 13 18:54:36 work on subjs that dun require finessing a bureaucracy and sitting with people who oughta be driving bulldozers but somehow called 'academics' Dec 13 18:56:22 this is why i mentioned poverty. organizations with "perks" for the employees (whether industry, academic, or even military) are probably continually dying of bureaucracy cancer Dec 13 18:57:30 adlai: 'orgs with perks' are last place you want to be if interested in actual work. the 'count days to pension' folx want to see real work happen in their lab like a dog wants beets. Dec 13 18:57:45 lol Dec 13 18:58:07 laff if you like, but it's troo Dec 13 18:58:12 i saw in e.g. darpa committee. Dec 13 18:58:25 innermost circle of wanker hell. Dec 13 18:58:28 * adlai literally lol! "can't go out hunting if you don't eat your beets!" Dec 13 18:59:03 well this is what happened to me with the lab this semester. Dec 13 18:59:41 for the electrochemistry lab, i suggested quantifying the surface effects on the electrode potential Dec 13 19:00:13 adlai: tell me again why you haven't a blog ? Dec 13 19:00:39 post the electro-thing. spend fiddybux that you didn't spend on drink this week, on cheapo camera Dec 13 19:00:41 and post. Dec 13 19:00:57 because http://adlai.uncommon-lisp.org:7421/posts/oh-you-have-a-blog.html Dec 13 19:01:50 it's an elementary 1st step to doing anyffing worth doing. or what, waiting for .il academy of sciences to print you ? Dec 13 19:02:02 could be long wait. Dec 13 19:02:53 please forgive my horrid contrarianism, but i spend more time drafting thoughts on paper than wondering which steradians to radially digitize for my little corner of the web Dec 13 19:03:13 y'know, 'pics or didn't happen' aint joke Dec 13 19:03:24 if you dun write about it, it literally didnthappen. Dec 13 19:03:29 as far as other thinking folx are concerned. Dec 13 19:03:53 (and oddly enough, ~100% of what's on there was bashed out at the keyboard, and ~100% of the notepad notes have so far remained in the notepad) Dec 13 19:04:11 adlai: 99% of errything asciilifeform ever did, is on paper. doesn't keep blog from happening. Dec 13 19:04:51 i know that. my comment is about your "cheapo camera" comment. i'm not about to turn that webserver into a replacement for not having a facebook page where i post selfies, foodshots, etc Dec 13 19:05:16 if i ever have bolixen to reverse, yes, i'll probably be posting pictures of that process, as well as a writeup Dec 13 19:05:41 but i don't think anybody except perhaps my mother wants to read "dear diary, today i argued with another professor about the way they taught some concept" Dec 13 19:05:42 adlai: i spend about 5 $ on www bandwidth in typical month. Dec 13 19:05:53 ( and notice, it dun consist of 'dear diary' ) Dec 13 19:06:00 (which is what most of my life consists of these days) Dec 13 19:06:13 nobody said you gotta write about what you had for lunch. Dec 13 19:06:58 can write , e.g., 'i set up xyz reaction, here's out of what, here's pic', rub in derps' faces Dec 13 19:07:09 or post that cl arbitrage bot thing you did Dec 13 19:07:10 or etc Dec 13 19:07:19 it aint as if yer never done anyffing worth to post Dec 13 19:07:22 fwiw i have been piecing together "views from the asylum", despite the knowledge that poor little superman is honor-bound to ignore its publication, even if i were to hand-deliver it to .cr Dec 13 19:07:27 or even that Dec 13 19:07:35 i aint ever been in asylum, would read Dec 13 19:08:02 ( recently read and enjoyed v. bukovsky's asylum chronicles, for instance ) Dec 13 19:09:12 adlai: some folx ignore, what of it. why sweat over who ignores. Dec 13 19:09:19 post for the folx who dun ignore. Dec 13 19:09:54 fwiw, he still published my comment ! Dec 13 19:10:48 in which case i should continue working on my "bitcoin competency certification" application, since the only forum for submitting those is trilema comments Dec 13 19:11:06 adlai: the a+++ best place to post, is ~yer own www~ Dec 13 19:11:16 that way dun have to sweat over 'will this d00d approve Dec 13 19:11:16 ' Dec 13 19:11:29 overcome the phobia of writing things down. Dec 13 19:11:40 without this, cannot do anyffing of any lasting interest, believe Dec 13 19:11:45 joking aside, i have meat to eat and some hours of darkness to enjoy before the next sunrise Dec 13 19:11:51 laters then.